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EricKnabe

Helix native tones muddy/undynamic

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I recently got the free trial of helix native to see if the helix was for me. I've been looking at it for a long time. Now that I have it, all my tones are muddy. When I record, the notes sound like one long jumbled and distorted mess. I record through a Scarlett 2i2 with the input gain super low because that helps. My question is, how would I fix this? Is it the Scarlett's gain that's the problem? Would the helix floor or rack have the same issues recording through that input as opposed to recording through a separate interface? Thanks

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You might have to experiment with your input impedance as it sounds like you might be clipping the input while monitoring with direct with the round trip via the computer DAW and Native with too high a buffer.

What ever works for any other Amp sim should be fine. Guitar Direct in on instrument impedance with the gain averaging (not peaking)-12db or -18db. Peaking well in the green not the red.

Next is the output level is not clipping back into your interface for monitoring at all.

What do you monitor on?

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Use the optical trem as your last block. Put rate/depth @ 1 and 1. Everything comes alive right there

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There's a world of difference in DI inputs... and this does affect the results you'll achieve using Helix Native.

 

If you've ever heard DI electric bass thru a cheap DI box vs. something like a Neve channel, the difference is night and day (as is the cost difference).

The cheap DI box sounds anemic compared to the Neve.

It's the same with DI electric guitar.

 

Part of what you're paying for with Helix Floor/Rack/LT is an analog input section tailored to this specific task.

To achieve similar results to the Helix hardware, you need a quality DI input.

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I recently got the free trial of helix native to see if the helix was for me. I've been looking at it for a long time. Now that I have it, all my tones are muddy. When I record, the notes sound like one long jumbled and distorted mess. I record through a Scarlett 2i2 with the input gain super low because that helps. My question is, how would I fix this? Is it the Scarlett's gain that's the problem? Would the helix floor or rack have the same issues recording through that input as opposed to recording through a separate interface? Thanks

I've been using the Scarlet 2i4 interface with Native, and have no issues...if it's you first time with Helix, and/or modelers in general, it's much more likely that you just haven't hit on a combination of amp/cab/mic sims that suits you yet. You gotta mess around...usually a lot...at the outset. Think days to a couple of weeks, rather than hours. Modeling is a little weird, and there tends to be a bit of a learning curve.

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I recently got the free trial of helix native to see if the helix was for me. I've been looking at it for a long time. Now that I have it, all my tones are muddy. When I record, the notes sound like one long jumbled and distorted mess. I record through a Scarlett 2i2 with the input gain super low because that helps. My question is, how would I fix this? Is it the Scarlett's gain that's the problem? Would the helix floor or rack have the same issues recording through that input as opposed to recording through a separate interface? Thanks

With the Helix, you don't need an external interface. Helix is the interface. It has 8 ins/outs via usb. You set your DAW to look for the Helix over USB, and that is it. 

 

Sounds like you don't have something set up correctly between your interface, DAW, and Native. 

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I recently got the free trial of helix native to see if the helix was for me. I've been looking at it for a long time. Now that I have it, all my tones are muddy. When I record, the notes sound like one long jumbled and distorted mess. I record through a Scarlett 2i2 with the input gain super low because that helps. My question is, how would I fix this? Is it the Scarlett's gain that's the problem? Would the helix floor or rack have the same issues recording through that input as opposed to recording through a separate interface? Thanks

Did you try my optical trem suggestion

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Did you try my optical trem suggestion

I don't think a tremolo effect will help with signal gain issues. 

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I don't think a tremolo effect will help with signal gain issues.

Just try it. Trust me it brings the helix to life

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Don't get me wrong, I do like some subtle trem at times (bubble trem is my favorite for that). However, it is not a fix for gain staging through a signal chain. 

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Is the guitar plugged into Scarlet with the Line/Inst switch set to Inst? That might be the problem.

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Is the guitar plugged into Scarlet with the Line/Inst switch set to Inst? That might be the problem.

Should we use focusrite set to line and not inst? I'm using the solo 2nd gen

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Should we use focusrite set to line and not inst? I'm using the solo 2nd gen

No...it should be set to instrument. If you set it to "line" the interface is expecting a much hotter signal than a guitar can deliver, and you'll have to crank it to hear anything.

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Should we use focusrite set to line and not inst? I'm using the solo 2nd gen

 

I would think any time you're plugging an instrument in you want it set to instrument. Not sure where you would want the gain, though.

 

You might get some answers on the Focusrite web site, I don't know.

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Use the optical trem as your last block. Put rate/depth @ 1 and 1. Everything comes alive right there

Eric did this work for you

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Eric did this work for you

 

fyi, just so I could say I tried it, I did.

 

Sorry, skyfirez1, but you are incorrect in this matter...

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With the Helix, you don't need an external interface.

 

 

Unless you prefer a better audio interface and just want to use Helix for what its main intended purpose was/is, a killer guitar processor...  ;)

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Unless you prefer a better audio interface and just want to use Helix for what its main intended purpose was/is, a killer guitar processor...  ;)

really? Helix is as good at getting my mic into the computer as anything I've used, and it's better at getting guitar in than anything I've seen.

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really? Helix is as good at getting my mic into the computer as anything I've used, and it's better at getting guitar in than anything I've seen.

 

I'm guessing that post was referring to other (higher-end) audio interface specific features.

ie:  RME audio interfaces offer rock-solid performance with lower round-trip latency.

 

I run Helix (digital) AES into a Fireface UFX.  Best of both worlds.   ;)

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I'm guessing that post was referring to other (higher-end) audio interface specific features.

ie:  RME audio interfaces offer rock-solid performance with lower round-trip latency.

 

I run Helix (digital) AES into a Fireface UFX.  Best of both worlds.   ;)

I run a UAD Apollo "quad" and prefer it as my Audio Interface, and yes I do think it is superior for one because of the multiple plugins you can add to it. But, I still use Helix as my main "guitar Interface". As always YMMV.  ;)

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fyi, just so I could say I tried it, I did.

 

Sorry, skyfirez1, but you are incorrect in this matter...

Me too. It sounds like a tremolo. I am glad skyfirez1 has found a tone he really enjoys though. If it works for you, go with it. 

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Scarlett should be set to inst, really, but I find with some hot output instruments it needs to be set to line. I believe it's just a pad, so as long as you're getting a decent signal level it doesn't really matter which you use

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Eric did this work for you

I didn't try it yet, but I will. The problem has more or less been solved though I'm not sure how

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Hi. I'd like to share my experience using Helix Native. I have the Helix Floor and been using my studio headphone to dial in my tone. Did the same for Helix Native i.e. using the same headphone but indeed it sounds fizzy, muddy, whatever you want to call it, certainly unpleasent and not the same tone as what I heard from the floor unit. Tried the exact same preset as the Floor unit and indeed it has a different tone. After gone through each setting, I found the solution! There is an "Input" level at the left of the "Host". Reduce the level from 0 dB to -18 dB. Thats it. You may want to increase the output level (right of "Main" meter) accordingly to complement the volume. 

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