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JeremiahEdward

TIPS on getting the FX Loop to sound full and robust?

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I'm running an H9 in the effects loop of my Helix LT.

 

I have notice that if I have a long delay and reverb in the Helix and I engage the effects loop (H9 is not active and is in relay bypass mode (true bypass)) the sound goes from 3 dimensional and full to 2 dimensional and flat. Does anyone wtih an H9 know how to set it up so that the fidelity of the blocks remains intact when the FX Loop is activated?

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With the H9 not engaged, you're mixing slightly delayed dry signal back with the original.

This will cause phase-cancellation (and thus sound thin/hollow).

That's perfectly normal.

If using the EFX Loop in Helix, if the H9 is off, the Loop also should be off.

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I am using this set up through headphones right now and haven't had a chance to check with an amp. When I engage the H9 it still sounds thin and hollow. I noticed that the "Hall" reverb in the Helix is only stereo.. it will not let me change it to mono. So I put a mono "Send" to the Helix and then ran stereo back from the H9 and then put the two returns directly after the send block. Still sounds AWFUL. With straight helix effects (send and return bypassed), it's a full, warm, beautiful, post rock bliss...  When I engage the send/return blocks with the H9 (both on and off), it's jarringly bad. All the warmth and life is sucked out.

 

I tried this and just got a horrible screeching noise:

 

Helix Send 1 > h9 input 1

Helix Send 2 > h9 input 2

 

H9 Output 1 > Helix Return 1

H9 Output 2 > Helix Rerturn 2

 

I'm coming from an HD500X and still trying to incorporate my pedals.

 

I plan on using this with a Fender Deluxe Reverb (Amp and Cab modeling OFF) for live situations and with headphones (Amp and Cab modeling ON) at home.

 

Any suggestions here?

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I am using this set up through headphones right now and haven't had a chance to check with an amp. When I engage the H9 it still sounds thin and hollow. I noticed that the "Hall" reverb in the Helix is only stereo.. it will not let me change it to mono. So I put a mono "Send" to the Helix and then ran stereo back from the H9 and then put the two returns directly after the send block. Still sounds AWFUL. With straight helix effects (send and return bypassed), it's a full, warm, beautiful, post rock bliss...  When I engage the send/return blocks with the H9 (both on and off), it's jarringly bad. All the warmth and life is sucked out.

 

I tried this and just got a horrible screeching noise:

 

Helix Send 1 > h9 input 1

Helix Send 2 > h9 input 2

 

H9 Output 1 > Helix Return 1

H9 Output 2 > Helix Rerturn 2

 

I'm coming from an HD500X and still trying to incorporate my pedals.

 

I plan on using this with a Fender Deluxe Reverb (Amp and Cab modeling OFF) for live situations and with headphones (Amp and Cab modeling ON) at home.

 

Any suggestions here?

 

First of all, all the reverbs on the Helix are stereo, so there aren't mono versions of them to use.

 

As far the H9, I'm nearly certain the issue is the fact that you're using separate send and receive blocks and not an FX loop block. The parameters on each of those blocks are different. In the FX Loop block, there's a Mix parameter that is set to 100% percent by default, i.e., 100% of the signal that's hitting the block is being sent to the 1/4" send. With the Send block, there's a Dry Thru parameter, and by default that's set to 0.0dB. That means the dry signal is being split between the 1/4" send and going through the internal signal in the Helix. If you were using the 1/4" send as an output, this would be what you want. But since you're creating an FX loop, the dry thru signal is causing you problems through the way of phasing. That why the H9 sounds thin and crappy. To fix it, just set the Dry Thru parameter on the Send block to its minimum level to kill it... You should be good to go then.

 

The other thing you could do, I guess, it turn on the "kill dry" function on the H9 itself. That way it would be like the H9 was in a parallel loop, and you'd be mixing in the wet signal from the H9 to the dry signal running through the Helix. It's kind of two different ways of accomplishing the same thing.

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I figured out what's going on.... 

 

I ran it in both of the ways that you described and it still sound bad when I kicked turned the Loop/H9 on. Since the Verbs in the Helix are stereo, in my headphones they sound VERY wide and spacious. When I engaged the H9 that all went away. So, I put the FX Loop with the H9 in it before the Helix Verb and it sounds fine now. (I was originally running the H9 at the end of the signal chain)

 

I think I was cutting a wide stereo tone down to mono every time I engaged the FX Loop. But mono H9 verb into Stereo Helix verb sounds excellent. 

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I figured out what's going on.... 

 

I ran it in both of the ways that you described and it still sound bad when I kicked turned the Loop/H9 on. Since the Verbs in the Helix are stereo, in my headphones they sound VERY wide and spacious. When I engaged the H9 that all went away. So, I put the FX Loop with the H9 in it before the Helix Verb and it sounds fine now. (I was originally running the H9 at the end of the signal chain)

 

I think I was cutting a wide stereo tone down to mono every time I engaged the FX Loop. But mono H9 verb into Stereo Helix verb sounds excellent. 

For some reason it sounds like your H9 is not coming through in stereo, that's why it sounded weak when placed after the HX reverb. You may have to pan left and right on your send/returns for the H9 to get it sounding wider. 

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