gunpointmetal Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 1 minute ago, codamedia said: The difference is between "listening" and "creating". You can listen so a finished album on a budget set of speakers but that album could not be created on that budget set of speakers. I find the same to be true when setting up tones. When you use good speakers (in a proper environment and volume) to setup your tones, your tones will translate back to budget speakers and volume levels with grace. When you use budget speaker to setup your tones, you will over correct the deficiencies. You are not likely to ever get the tone you really want, and when heard back on better systems your over corrections will be exposed... often with negative results. This 1000X. A good guitar tone dialed in through a quality monitor system will still sound good (or at least OK) through a crap monitor system. A tone dialed in to sound good on a crap monitor system will sound like buckets of doodoo on a quality monitor system. Mixing/mastering is designed to make music sound good on most reproduction systems. Nobody is mixing and mastering through some desktop computer speakers to any reasonable effect and then having that sound great through studio monitors. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 3 hours ago, cruisinon2 said: That's what we need! Shut it down! Mr. Moderator, please rescue us from this terribly upsetting exchange of ideas... somebody might get offended. Which way to the safe space? And be sure to have my crayons and emotional support tortoise ready, just in case. Enormous reptiles are the only thing that soothe my fraying nerves. ;) Well, EXCUUUUSE me! Maybe it's time to walk your Enormous Reptile....just KEEP IT OFF MY LAWN :-). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Niarolf's now deleted thread "How to make Helix sound warm and fat". His last post - "SMH this community is the worst " Are we still trying to help this guy? Must've been Brue58ski's post - "How to make a Helix warm and fat? Put it in a warm bath and feed it donuts. " I thought that was right on point! :-) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 28 minutes ago, rd2rk said: Niarolf's now deleted thread "How to make Helix sound warm and fat". His last post - "SMH this community is the worst " Are we still trying to help this guy? Must've been Brue58ski's post - "How to make a Helix warm and fat? Put it in a warm bath and feed it donuts. " I thought that was right on point! :-) Nah, now he's over on TGP not letting anyone actually help him, too. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brue58ski Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 On 3/28/2019 at 9:52 AM, rd2rk said: Niarolf's now deleted thread "How to make Helix sound warm and fat". His last post - "SMH this community is the worst " Are we still trying to help this guy? Must've been Brue58ski's post - "How to make a Helix warm and fat? Put it in a warm bath and feed it donuts. " I thought that was right on point! :-) I hope I didn't offend anyone. I was just funnin'. Didn't mean nuthin' by it. I hadn't even read any of the posts. That's just the joke that popped into my head when I saw the heading. There must've been a heated exchange going on before I posted. Do I have to go to the principle's office? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Just now, brue58ski said: I hope I didn't offend anyone. I was just funnin'. Didn't mean nuthin' by it. I hadn't even read any of the posts. That's just the joke that popped into my head when I saw the heading. There must've been a heated exchange about that. Do I have to see the principle? I've been to awful communities. I don't see how this one could even end up on the scale of an awful community. Do some people just hate friendly ribbing? I think it makes it fun. I thought it was extremely admirable how people kept trying to offer feedback and advice when (IMHO) it looked clear that his opinion on the device was already pretty unshakable. Going to TGP is even more evidence of that. Why is this dead horse being beat so much? I never agonize over any product this much. Trust your feelings - if you hate it you hate it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 2 hours ago, gunpointmetal said: What guitar? What pickups? Is the input pad activated? There are so many variable to "nailing" someone else's tone. Even if I had the EXACT tone as what you're looking for, if your gear is different than mine, or you play with a heavier/lighter touch, or your input levels are louder/quieter its not going to be EXACT when you play through it. At this point it would seem you're trying to NOT solve a problem and blame everything besides the only consistent variable. WTF dude literally the only thing i've been doing the past 5 days is trying to get closer to the tone i want, but i'm just not getting there. 3 hours ago, Kilrahi said: Honestly, if the problem were the logitech speakers you would probably hate the Axe sounds as well. I would generally agree that logitech speakers probably aren't solid items for doing music, BUT we're talking about youtube videos here, and both the Axe and the Helix are going through the same system so whatever the system's deficits both products are getting equal treatment. I think the odds of buying a very expensive mixing setup and it solving your problems are near null. Some common sense at last, thank you for understanding, the "it's your playback system" comments are driving me crazy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 1 hour ago, gunpointmetal said: Nah, now he's over on TGP not letting anyone actually help him, too. on TGP not letting anyone help me?? did you even read the thread? I even took the time to learn the parts of the tones that are in the ballpark of what i'm trying to get so that it's easier for the people there to compare them to the original and suggest changes... but no i MUST be a trolling SHILL bought out by the EVIL FRACTAL CORPORATION goddamnit. i deleted the thread here because it was probably even worse and less useful than the response i got on TGP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Nobody said you were a shill. You keep jumping over aspects of the chain people are asking about, posting examples and ignoring really good advice on how/why even in the ballpark its not gonna sound the same. A whole lot of people have put in more time than anyone deserves in a situation like this, lol. Thinking that monitoring/playback system and comparing a mixed/mastered tone in the hands of one of the current masters of the instruments isn't going to be an issue is the same thing as when people wonder why they're crate 4x12 doesn't sound as good as a Mesa 4x12 even though both cabs are being driven by the same amp. At some point it's down to digging in or giving up, because no two sets of ears, no two sets of gear are the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 25 minutes ago, niarolf said: i deleted the thread here because it was probably even worse and less useful than the response i got on TGP Your last post in that deleted thread was "SMH this community is the worst ". And yet, you're still here! Look, this whole exercise is pointless. You've done the best you could to describe your problem. You've received the best advice possible from the most helpful members of this community. The hostility/frustration level (and I include myself here) is rising, is totally unnecessary and not at all constructive. At this point, it's really simple - and I've said it before - Time to return the Helix and get what you wanted in the first place - an AXE! Don't blame the Helix. Don't blame the community. Say "THANK YOU" to those who've tried to help, and LET IT GO! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 6 minutes ago, rd2rk said: Your last post in that deleted thread was "SMH this community is the worst ". And yet, you're still here! Look, this whole exercise is pointless. You've done the best you could to describe your problem. You've received the best advice possible from the most helpful members of this community. The hostility/frustration level (and I include myself here) is rising, is totally unnecessary and not at all constructive. At this point, it's really simple - and I've said it before - Time to return the Helix and get what you wanted in the first place - an AXE! Don't blame the Helix. Don't blame the community. Say "THANK YOU" to those who've tried to help, and LET IT GO! "get what you wanted in the first place - an AXE!" I never wanted an axe fx, the portability of the helix stomp is what made me get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Well, let's not get this post escalating. If I contributed to that my apologies. For example, I didn't even read the TGP post so I shouldn't have even commented on that. At the end of the day I think we're all well meaning. Everyone wants Niarolf to enjoy the gear they got. We can try to guess at why it hasn't worked out. We can try to give input and feedback as to the reasons to try to help, but if it doesn't work at the end of the day we'll probably never know for sure why. A friend of mine hates Toyota - I love the damn things. WTF. The Stomp is a really cool idea. I adore mine (used it for another 3 hours last night). I'm saddened it isn't that way for everyone. I'm a longtime Star Trek fan who despises Star Trek: Discovery - my hatred of it baffles current fans of the show, and I personally don't know what they're smoking. Life is weird but altogether too short. Good luck finding a suitable alternative! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 It's just one of those things, I suppose. I've literally sat in the room with Sarah Longfield playing her guitar through her setup and I sound nothing like what she does with the same patches/instrument. There is nothing inherently scooped or harsh about HX tones, as evidenced by the large number of people using them on a regular basis and multiple professionals incorporating them into their rigs. It's not trying to be an lollipop, but if the gear is giving this big of a headache, its best to find other gear that does what you need without all the hassle. Upgrading your playback system is still highly recommended. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 On 3/27/2019 at 5:00 AM, niarolf said: Maybe it's user error or I have a faulty unit, but it's not living up to fractal standards so far. 34 minutes ago, niarolf said: I never wanted an axe fx, the portability of the helix stomp is what made me get it. You wanted Helix portability with Fractal sound. I get it. You tried, it didn't work for you. If the trade-off is minor, like, Helix is 95% there, then portability might win out, but you don't seem to be happy AT ALL with Helix. None of our suggestions work for you. Time to move on, before your return window closes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 On 1/5/2018 at 4:34 PM, DecayingWings said: I recently bought Helix LT. I've been extremely disappointed in it. I can't get a decent metal tone out of it. Like EVH type of stuff. Or Metallica, Megadeth etc. I even bought some IR:s from OwnHammer. Bought EVH cab, some Engl cabs etc. Doesn't make much of a different. Sounds like absolute garbage. Been trying out Engl model with EVH IR and different high gain heads/amps like 5150 and Soldano. They all suck pretty badly. Also tried to put Tubescreamer in front of the amp. You could try the FREMEN amp-packs. It costs some money, but this guy makes some really good metal tones(some of the few packs that are worth buying, in my opinion). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 1 hour ago, rd2rk said: You wanted Helix portability with Fractal sound. I get it. You tried, it didn't work for you. If the trade-off is minor, like, Helix is 95% there, then portability might win out, but you don't seem to be happy AT ALL with Helix. None of our suggestions work for you. Time to move on, before your return window closes! I guess the 5% that's missing are the mids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 20 minutes ago, niarolf said: I guess the 5% that's missing are the mids. For your ears only. The rest of us hear mids just fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 10 minutes ago, rd2rk said: For your ears only. The rest of us hear mids just fine. nope, even with a spectrum analyzer it shows you can't get anything but scooped tones, but i can imagine that to be fine for the majority Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueD Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 48 minutes ago, niarolf said: nope, even with a spectrum analyzer it shows you can't get anything but scooped tones, but i can imagine that to be fine for the majority Screenshot + patch or GTFO. For everyone else, why do you still bother? 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codamedia Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 58 minutes ago, niarolf said: nope, even with a spectrum analyzer it shows you can't get anything but scooped tones, Marshall Plexi Jump.... stock settings, stock cab... stock mic.... We must not view "scoop" the same way.... a slight bass bump maybe, but nothing that a single notch on the bass control wouldn't take care of. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 9 minutes ago, BlueD said: Screenshot + patch or GTFO. For everyone else, why do you still bother? Honestly up until this point I thought he was well intentioned, but if he's now gonna claim that in a spectrum analyzer, no matter WHAT you do to an EQ, it ends up scooped . . . Most of us have stared at spectrum analysis's of our Helix recordings numerous time and know that's a bogus claim. That's troll level territory. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueD Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 Just now, Kilrahi said: Honestly up until this point I thought he was well intentioned I appreciate your innocent spirit, wish I had it too. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 5 minutes ago, codamedia said: Marshall Plexi Jump.... stock settings, stock cab... stock mic.... We must not view "scoop" the same way.... Rotate 180°... maybe he's standing on his head. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 1 hour ago, niarolf said: nope, even with a spectrum analyzer it shows you can't get anything but scooped tones, but i can imagine that to be fine for the majority You know what... you're right. We're all deluding ourselves. You and you alone are blessed with golden ears, and perception so keen that you may well be the next step in human evolution. By comparison we all may as well be deaf, and have clearly squandered $1500 on equipment that not a single one of us knows how to use properly. There...that do it for ya? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 3 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said: You know what... you're right. We're all deluding ourselves. You and you alone are blessed with golden ears, and perception so keen that you may well be the next step in human evolution. By comparison we all may as well be deaf, and have clearly squandered $1500 on equipment that not a single one of us knows how to use properly. There... that do it for ya? Not only does Niarolf possess superior ears, even his Spectrum Analyzer is superior! Just like other terrible people in this horrible community, I was forced to re-evaluate the evidence of my ears. By application of a spectrum analyzer, I discovered some amazing facts about this POS NO-MIDS Helix! SOME AMPS HAVE LESS MIDS THAN OTHERS! I arrived at this shocking conclusion by setting all tone controls at 5 (nominally flat - not always true for every tone stack). Then I did some WILD experiments! I turned down the BASS and TREBLE, and turned UP the mids. Amazingly, the mids displayed in the spectrum analyzer stayed the same - until I turned UP the channel volume. SURPRISE! MORE MIDS! And when I added a Cali Q Graphic with an inverted smiley face - MORE MIDS! It's so obvious to me now that, not only are my ears defective, MY SPECTRUM ANALYZER IS A PAID AGENT OF THE MIDS HATING EVIL LINE6 ENGINEERS! My Conclusion - We are SO lucky to have Niarolf to show us the TRUE PATH to sonic nirvana! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 I would have "liked" or laughed at several of the recent threads everyone has posted, but alas, Line 6 has deemed myself to have emoted too much today. That's how much this crazy thread has got me going. I done spent all of my daily emote privilege! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 lmao you guys get so triggered, it's a great product, but the juicy mids are nowhere to be found If anyone can recreate the EQ of this sound with the helix (thick mids and no harsh high end) you might change my mind, but until now all the helix community has done is all bark and no bite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 8 minutes ago, soundog said: not until i heard the elusive juicy, thick and warm helix mids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 37 minutes ago, niarolf said: This sounds awful!!! No mids. No lows even. Why are you trying to post garbage? Who does that help? Give me another clip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 11 minutes ago, Kilrahi said: No mids. Lol nice trolling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 1 minute ago, niarolf said: Lol nice trolling Me?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarolf Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 11 minutes ago, Kilrahi said: Me?! yup, that clip is all mids Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 DANGER Kilrahi, DANGER! Textbook definition of TROLL! When shown proof, he ignores it and demands DIFFERENT proof. He's getting off on pushing our buttons. NOW can we lock this thread? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 1 minute ago, niarolf said: yup, that clip is all mids I put it through a spectrum analysis. There were clearly no mids, or even lows. Damndest thing I've ever heard. As if people like torture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 The magic ingredient in Andy Summers’ “Message In A Bottle” tone: warm, fat mids. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 3 hours ago, cruisinon2 said: Rotate 180°... maybe he's standing on his head. ;) Then it would be a nasty clip, caused by no tuner in the editor... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerLefty Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 8 hours ago, Kilrahi said: Honestly up until this point I thought he was well intentioned, but if he's now gonna claim that in a spectrum analyzer, no matter WHAT you do to an EQ, it ends up scooped . . . Most of us have stared at spectrum analysis's of our Helix recordings numerous time and know that's a bogus claim. That's troll level territory. He always has been trolling. Honestly, he does not deserve your apologies or sympathy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 7 hours ago, Verne-Bunsen said: The magic ingredient in Andy Summers’ “Message In A Bottle” tone: warm, fat mids. Oh, please, no - not the return of “itsslash” or “Iamtheone”. Arrrrrgggghhh! EDIT: I just realised - “Florian” - it’s not a really scary trolling name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerLefty Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 17 minutes ago, datacommando said: Oh, please, no - not the return of “itsslash” or “Iamtheone”. Arrrrrgggghhh! EDIT: I just realised - “Florian” - it’s not a really scary trolling name. If it is supposed to be Florian, he didn’t get it quite right either, as that would have to be Nairolf. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted March 29, 2019 Share Posted March 29, 2019 1 hour ago, GingerLefty said: If it is supposed to be Florian, he didn’t get it quite right either, as that would have to be Nairolf. Oops! Well, let’s hope that it isn’t the other tone lunatic! Now, he really was annoying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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