gunpointmetal Posted May 14, 2018 Share Posted May 14, 2018 So is it officially done as far as development goes? Are we stuck with a compressor after all drive/amp blocks? Are we stuck with completely disabling iTunes in the app if we don't want to have the first track blast out of our headphones when we start up the app? are we stuck having to log into the App every other time we open it? this thing is soooooo close to being a worthy live backup device, but as of right now its pretty much only good for home jamming (which it is very good for), but it seems a few minor tweaks could really improve things. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipelineaudio1 Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 I was actually going to start this exact topic. Kind of sad, the Firehawk actually sounds really good, but its routing issues feel like alpha versions, showing the promise that later development would bring. The drivers could use updating to be as good as the 2009 Pod XT Live drivers as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted May 15, 2018 Author Share Posted May 15, 2018 Given where development stopped, I'm surprised they even bothered to put XLR outs on the hardware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgoddard Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 I've been using mine live for the last few months. The limitations of the device are the routing options, but the live sound is good, if you accept the fact you only have a simple setup. I use it either as an effects device using 4-Cable Method with my tube amp (not using any amp/cab sims) or as a standalone system with no amp, direct to FOH/PA/Mixer. Got it used for $280, not complaining one bit. If I had bought new for $500 when it came out I'd be upset, but it's a great piece of gear for what I use it for. As far as having a compressor after the amp block, I think if it more as an aid than a hindrance. From experience, to get a great balanced sound in a live setting, you're going to add compression to your channels. If you have a simple PA setup with just volume mixing, you're not going to get any compression. Having that compressor after the amp/cab sim is just like having a mic'd cabinet going to a mixing board with a compressor. Your soundman will compress your signal. You won't hear it in monitors because that's unprocessed (usually pre-fader signals). Things like reverb and delay you don't want compressed anyway, so having them after the compressor placed after the cabinet makes sense. I was frustrated with that fact for a bit until I spoke with a sound engineer and he was like, "Dude, if you use that compressor, I don't have to use mine! And you'll hear what you sound like at FOH" So that's what I do now. If you think that compressor block is hindering the amount of effects you can run, look up the No FX Loop patch. It replaces the FX Loop block with an additional assignable block. It takes away your FX Loop, but you gotta give a little to get a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipelineaudio1 Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 Since theres no output volume per preset except the amp volume, and the fixed compressor cannot do negative gain, its a HUGE hinderance...then again, you can just bypass it, but....Really after a product has been on the market for a bit, you learn excactly what could be done with it and that's when you do a meaningful update. Its sad to think this may end up like the Amplifi, as abandonware, when there is so much amazing potential in it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgoddard Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 4 minutes ago, pipelineaudio1 said: Since theres no output volume per preset except the amp volume, and the fixed compressor cannot do negative gain, its a HUGE hinderance...then again, you can just bypass it, but....Really after a product has been on the market for a bit, you learn excactly what could be done with it and that's when you do a meaningful update. Its sad to think this may end up like the Amplifi, as abandonware, when there is so much amazing potential in it I create all my patches to be the same level as each other. So it's not really an issue for me. Even the stock patches I will modify and save on top of itself it it's too loud/quiet. If you work within the limitations of the unit, you will find what you're looking for so much easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipelineaudio1 Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 I understand there are workarounds, but in product development terms, this is time for the first major update, if not actually just the beta testing time. Its like they stopped it in alpha. The DSP available in this thing is pretty comprehensive, there is no reason other than marketing not to get this to an incredible level and keep selling these units for the foreseeable future. I can see not wanting it to compete with the Helix, but you could still easily cripple the Firehawk enough to make the Helix desirable and still have a much more powerful Firehawk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted May 15, 2018 Author Share Posted May 15, 2018 Except I know very few sound guys that are actually running a channel compressor on high gain guitars, which is what I'm using it for. Common practice for guitar is to use the compressor AHEAD of any drive/gain stages to even out the sound that gets driven or to limit dynamics on a clean channel for stuff like finger picking or tapping. It seems kinda dumb for a guitar processor to have a compressor that can ONLY be placed after gain stages. Have you ever tried to run a compressor in the FX loop of a real amp or after a high gain distortion pedal? Feedback city at all but the lowest settings, especially if there is any drive/distortion. Even with a fully-configurable signal chain (i.e. being able to move any block anywhere in the chain) this thing would still be leagues behind the Helix and in no way encroach on its user base unless they were in way over their head with Helix, and in that case they'd probably move down to something simpler anyways. And the sounds in Helix are quite a bit better, as well as the overall quality of available FX and amp models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgoddard Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 Well, if you don't like the compressor afterwards, don't use it? There are compressor effects available... I mean the functionality is more limited than the HD500X and is priced accordingly. I hate sounding like a fanboy, but I really do enjoy my FHFX. It's great as a pedalboard replacement or whole rig replacement, depending on venue. I get the sounds I like out of it, and it is easy to use. Small details like an immovable compressor block and EQ don't bother me, if I don't want them there, I turn them off. If I want compression before the amp model, I'll put a compressor there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted May 15, 2018 Author Share Posted May 15, 2018 Doesn't make sense to give up a flex block to reiterate an effect that's already there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pipelineaudio1 Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 It definitely sounds great and works great as is. I just don't see the need to stand in the way of it getting better. Its software. It can be made better. We certainly, when buying devices of this sort we (almost, but not quite always, as we have seen even these dealt with in some products) accept the hardware limitations with the understanding that the software limitations can be dealt with. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tribal5000 Posted May 15, 2018 Share Posted May 15, 2018 On 5/14/2018 at 5:18 PM, gunpointmetal said: So is it officially done as far as development goes? Are we stuck with a compressor after all drive/amp blocks? Are we stuck with completely disabling iTunes in the app if we don't want to have the first track blast out of our headphones when we start up the app? are we stuck having to log into the App every other time we open it? this thing is soooooo close to being a worthy live backup device, but as of right now its pretty much only good for home jamming (which it is very good for), but it seems a few minor tweaks could really improve things. yeah man I feel ya I just picked up one used from gc last week and love this thing I think it sounds better than my pod hd500x . and with a few tweaks here and there this thing would bbe superb I wish the noise gate block was moveable . if thay would put all the legacy amp models in the helix I would probubley upgrade . but I'm loving being able to control firehawk with blue tooth. ill also say ipad app works really good on ipad 4gen better than my smart phone Samsung galx j3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ric1966 Posted June 24, 2018 Share Posted June 24, 2018 The stomp block can be made into a compressor in front of the amp. Is the real limitation that you can’t have a compressor AND a distortion block in front of the amp? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertgoddard Posted June 25, 2018 Share Posted June 25, 2018 You can most definitely have a compressor and a drive in front of an amp. You need to press and hold a block and move it. https://imgur.com/a/smRLAhK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunpointmetal Posted June 27, 2018 Author Share Posted June 27, 2018 Which is fine if you're doing most things. Unless you want to have a second gate in the chain, or a second EQ, then you have to give up one of those to do it. If you could move the comp block to in front of the amp/drive blocks (where literally every guitar player with a compressor pedal puts their compressor in a "real" amp rig) then I won't need to compromise on the other parts of the rig I have set up already. I'm just not seeing the benefit/need for fixed-location blocks in a single-processor system like this. You're already limited to what you can use, why limit WHERE they can be used. Seems like an easy fix from a software perspective, but it also seems like the FireHawk FX is completely done with its development and I'd be surprised if they even update the app anymore to maintain compatibility when iOS finally breaks it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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