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MarkJarvis

Will we see a new firmware with any major update?

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Already discussed? lol...it never ends. One of these threads pops up, or an old one is resurrected, every 11 minutes or so (every 7 minutes the month before NAMM happens)...inviting days to weeks of 100% evidence-free speculation and blind guessing. Not to mention the obligatory moaning that the previous update still didn't include a voucher for a cappuccino machine or panini press...

 

Time to get cracking folks! Wish lists to the right, and whining about what should have been included in the last update to the left. No shoving in line...;)

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From DI over on TGP:

 

"Lonestar and Friedman clean channels. A few new effects, but no poly stuff. No new firmware features, but Helix Native gets MIDI control. HX Effects gets full HX Edit support. Several hundred (!) bug fixes."

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16 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

Already discussed? lol...it never ends. One of these threads pops up, or an old one is resurrected, every 11 minutes or so (every 7 minutes the month before NAMM happens)...inviting days to weeks of 100% evidence-free speculation and blind guessing. Not to mention the obligatory moaning that the previous update still didn't include a voucher for a cappuccino machine or panini press...

 

Time to get cracking folks! Wish lists to the right, and whining about what should have been included in the last update to the left. No shoving in line...;)

Hello mate...
Do you know if there is a "roadmap" for the Helix life? And if there is, if it would be good (or not) to show all of us....
Cheers!
Leo

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There is no "roadmap". I guess there are other companies that have regularly timed updates but not so with the Helix. It starts with a "somethings coming" from someone who would know and then massive conjecture about when that will be with no confirmation as to when until the day before or the day it is released. Apparently one is in the works as you can see from the thread with the longest title ever.

 

 

Let the conjecture begin!!!!

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22 minutes ago, l_sap120394 said:

Hello mate...
Do you know if there is a "roadmap" for the Helix life? And if there is, if it would be good (or not) to show all of us....
Cheers!
Leo

 

I will preface this by saying that the following is not a criticism... it's just the way it is:

 

L6 has a long and glorious history of refusing to divulge the time of day, much less future products, or plans for existing products. They play everything close to the vest...whether that's good or bad is relative, and largely dependent on how impatient you are. Personally, I couldn't care less. Stuff comes when it comes...and no amount of hand wringing, lamenting, whining, or guessing will change the arrival date, or what's in the package when it gets here.  

 

Like all companies interested in turning a profit, their decisions are made by what they judge to be good for business... and their track record clearly demonstrates that they've decided that keeping their mouths shut most of the time, is the way to go. When something's ready, it gets released. Prior build-up and hint-dropping are few and far between. 

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1 hour ago, l_sap120394 said:

Hello mate...
Do you know if there is a "roadmap" for the Helix life? And if there is, if it would be good (or not) to show all of us....
Cheers!
Leo

 

Oh, there’s a roadmap, at least generally speaking... It’s just not something Line 6 is going to publicize for the world to see.

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Well, I'm speculating that what ever we're going to get, it will be announced and released at NAMM. So, Thursday or Friday may be a good Helix day. On the other hand, I know nothing!

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6 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

I will preface this by saying that the following is not a criticism... it's just the way it is:

 

L6 has a long and glorious history of refusing to divulge the time of day, much less future products, or plans for existing products. They play everything close to the vest...whether that's good or bad is relative, and largely dependent on how impatient you are. Personally, I couldn't care less. Stuff comes when it comes...and no amount of hand wringing, lamenting, whining, or guessing will change the arrival date, or what's in the package when it gets here.  

 

Like all companies interested in turning a profit, their decisions are made by what they judge to be good for business... and their track record clearly demonstrates that they've decided that keeping their mouths shut most of the time, is the way to go. When something's ready, it gets released. Prior build-up and hint-dropping are few and far between. 

 

I think we should recognise the legal implications of making statements about future releases...from share price to being sued for fraud...No business can risk divulging this sort of infomation with impunity.
My personal view is that Line 6 provides stunning support and goes far beyond expectations in contining to upgrade products like Helix.  It was a superb product when it was released...and it just keeps getting better!

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4 hours ago, lawrence_Arps said:

 

I think we should recognise the legal implications of making statements about future releases...

That's weird...every car manufacturer for the last 100+ years has released all kinds of info about their new models in advance. I guess they didn't get the "legal implications" memo. lol

Also I'm pretty sure that I see months of advance commercials touting the features of the next model I-Phone or Samsung Galaxy long before they are released.

I've read this many times on here that it's some kind of legal mumbo-jumbo.
But reality is...it's simply Line 6 company policy. They CHOOSE not to divulge what and when the next updates are going to be. 
I'm sure they have good reasons in their minds. It could be as simple as not wanting to show their hand to the competition for all we know.

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12 hours ago, lawrence_Arps said:

 

I think we should recognise the legal implications of making statements about future releases...from share price to being sued for fraud...No business can risk divulging this sort of infomation with impunity.
My personal view is that Line 6 provides stunning support and goes far beyond expectations in contining to upgrade products like Helix.  It was a superb product when it was released...and it just keeps getting better!

 

We can "consider" anything and everything until the cows come home,  and we'll never leave square one.

Legal, moral, ethical reasons...or maybe they're just really superstitious and think it's "bad juju". My point is, who cares? They ain't talkin'... the reason(s), whatever they may be, are wholly irrelevant.

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Wait a minute...Line 6 offers updates to their equipment?

 

Lonestar Clean channel model...Yes please!

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On 6/26/2018 at 10:31 PM, robbieb61 said:

That's weird...every car manufacturer for the last 100+ years has released all kinds of info about their new models in advance. I guess they didn't get the "legal implications" memo. lol

Also I'm pretty sure that I see months of advance commercials touting the features of the next model I-Phone or Samsung Galaxy long before they are released.

I've read this many times on here that it's some kind of legal mumbo-jumbo.
But reality is...it's simply Line 6 company policy. They CHOOSE not to divulge what and when the next updates are going to be. 
I'm sure they have good reasons in their minds. It could be as simple as not wanting to show their hand to the competition for all we know.

 

For those that are interested, I've been here awhile and there was a time when Line 6 was more open about what they were doing and when they thought whatever they were doing was gong to come out. It basically would pretty much always turn into a sh**storm of "you said this and it didn't happen". It got bad. Imagine the speculation we have now about updates 1,000 fold and really nasty. So that was when they decided to keep it close to the vest. It just got too adversarial, controversial, etc.. I'm not saying that's whats going on now. But that's what was going on when they first decided to stop being, at the time, very open about what was going on.

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Given the competitive environment Line6 produces products in, between existing companies and new ones coming on the scene, I understand why they would be relatively tight-lipped about what is in the pipeline lest they see it come out on a competitor's product first.

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I think we don't have to counfond a new device and an improvement.

The strategie is really not the same. Every trademark uses to announce new products long time before to keep customers and prevents them from switching.

 

On the other hand, the device is already sold. I've seen nowhere that it was a must for line6 to bring a new firmware every X months....

Are the customers happy with it ?

Even if there wouldn't be any improvement, i love my HX (and i'll keep it) !!!! Every improvements are some plus and i'm pleased to take them but they're not also a revolution... 

And i believe, i anticipate the next one who will ask : when will arrive the 2.7 firmeware and so on......

 

Last point : what is a major update ? Philosophical subject ! You've got 4 hours..... :)

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I am happy you 'love' your Helix. For me, I have been struggling with getting a good (ie smooth) higher gain distortion sound. I find that mostly everything sounds harsh and fizzy when you pull up the gain/drive. In fact I have to battle just to get a tone that I like and am inspired by. There are other platforms out there (AXFX) that seem more pleasing out of the box but 

maybe you dont agree? I have added third party IR and bought some patch bundles because I was thinking I just was doing something wrong. I then realized my patches were actually better (for me) then anything I heard or bought. That said..I am hoping Helix will get a much needed update to its distortion and gain amps so. I just want it sound sound better without having to add a block to remove unwanted freq..i mean why does it have unwanted freq and fizz (not good fizz but harsh fizz) I am no hater on Line 6, I have had all the Pods and Helix i just want it to sound better than it does. (in my opinion)

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I like to look at it as the models have all the frequencies if I want them, but I can EQ or whatever to shape the tone to my preferences...

 

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Regarding 'I like to look at it as the models have all the frequencies if I want them, but I can EQ or whatever to shape the tone to my preferences..'

 

well you may like to spin it that way but in my opinion and all the hours of using it thats sub optimal and no all the frequencies are NOT there 

..well maybe they are but what a PIA to get rid of them..  and yeah you 'can' make it sound useful and in a mix sure it 'can' sound good but what i am saying 

is not new. I would expect that a flagship product would not need some much tweaking to get it to 'sound good' for high gain and distortion. in fact I feel its a problem in how every single amp and distortion was modeled. They should never have been allowed to be released like that. The product team at Line 6 who are no dummies, should have fixed this long ago.

Sorry just ranting cuz the price tag of a AFX 3 is way way too high..but looking back maybe not as expensive as all the time tweaking the Helix.

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5 minutes ago, MarkJarvis said:

 I just want it sound sound better without having to add a block to remove unwanted freq..i mean why does it have unwanted freq and fizz (not good fizz but harsh fizz) I am no hater on Line 6, I have had all the Pods and Helix i just want it to sound better than it does. (in my opinion)

 

You will probably remain disappointed on that front. If you stick your head right up to your favorite amp, you'll hear plenty of unwanted high end fizz from that, too...but once you're listening several feet away and way off-axis, it disappears. Good or bad, that is exactly what's being captured in the modeling process: a close mic-ed cabinet, warts and all. Pump that through FRFR speakers and you're gonna have some  unwanted frequencies.... much the same as you would mic-ing a cabinet in the studio. It is what it is. The necessity for low and high cuts isn't going away anytime soon. 

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Yes it could be fizzy and you need to adjust it but imo i think it depends what you are playing it thru.I had a balckstar ht 60 and i used  the 4cm and I also had 15 inch speakers frfr witha powr amp I had mackie thumps 12 and i even used roland 10 inch drum monitors.Then I bought a power stage 170 and use it with a 212 blackstar and so far its the best combo.Yes its might add a bit clor to sound im not gonna go crazy and tech about it,it just sound smooth and better than every else i used

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10 minutes ago, MarkJarvis said:

Regarding 'I like to look at it as the models have all the frequencies if I want them, but I can EQ or whatever to shape the tone to my preferences..'

 

well you may like to spin it that way but in my opinion and all the hours of using it thats sub optimal and no all the frequencies are NOT there 

..well maybe they are but what a PIA to get rid of them..  and yeah you 'can' make it sound useful and in a mix sure it 'can' sound good but what i am saying 

is not new. I would expect that a flagship product would not need some much tweaking to get it to 'sound good' for high gain and distortion. in fact I feel its a problem in how every single amp and distortion was modeled. They should never have been allowed to be released like that. The product team at Line 6 who are no dummies, should have fixed this long ago.

Sorry just ranting cuz the price tag of a AFX 3 is way way too high..but looking back maybe not as expensive as all the time tweaking the Helix.

 

The problem is not the device, it's your expectations. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's the truth. It's not an amp... if you try and treat it like one, you will be disappointed with the results. Modeling takes some getting used to...

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Your right about that..my expectation is that Helix should sound great. So for reference, the way i use Helix is only with the XLR out to an interface (focusrite) and also via SPDIF

I use the liquid channels on the interface because they do provide some smooth out quality over SPDIF ..that said one thing i was thinking is that the headphone out of Helix sounds way different than using it xlr to an interface. (I dont use the USB I/O because the device driver latency is too high)

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I think this is a situation where you can't please all the people all of the time. If L6 had made a huge R&D effort the last three years to make Helix a metal platform, I wouldn't own one. It seems to me like most general use products don't fit in to what the metal crowd needs. I don't think Helix is the only one with that weak point.

Overall the biggest problem with modelers and frfr systems is that sizzle and fizz that we deal with which mainly emanates from the HF driver. That's why I moved to a PC+, to try to deal with that a little better.  

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28 minutes ago, MarkJarvis said:

I am happy you 'love' your Helix. For me, I have been struggling with getting a good (ie smooth) higher gain distortion sound. I find that mostly everything sounds harsh and fizzy when you pull up the gain/drive. In fact I have to battle just to get a tone that I like and am inspired by. There are other platforms out there (AXFX) that seem more pleasing out of the box but 

maybe you dont agree? I have added third party IR and bought some patch bundles because I was thinking I just was doing something wrong. I then realized my patches were actually better (for me) then anything I heard or bought. That said..I am hoping Helix will get a much needed update to its distortion and gain amps so. I just want it sound sound better without having to add a block to remove unwanted freq..i mean why does it have unwanted freq and fizz (not good fizz but harsh fizz) I am no hater on Line 6, I have had all the Pods and Helix i just want it to sound better than it does. (in my opinion)

 

I'm pretty proud of my message. It made you react.

At first, i wanted to tell that a "major update" means nothing or not so much because each one doesn't wait for the same things.....

Finally, you explain that you are bothered with fizz, etc.....I think we are far from the amount of new amps that could arrived....

It's clearer now !

 

I agree with you. I use a variax with the helix.

I've just changed my pickups on my Gibb SG and my fender strat.

When i plugged them in HX, there was a lot of buzz, fizz, etc.....More than with VDI cable.

At first, i thought it was from the guitar....I adjust my guitars because i thought it comes from frets....

Then, i discovered the noisegate and it's better....Even if i'm not entirely satisfied.

 

I've learnt (and had to) a lot of things with modeling, position of effects, how to make a signal path and i believe that's not finished.

I hear that clean amps gives really good results, the responsiveness and dynamic has no comparison with my last FX and have heared good disto sounds.

Today, i think that i have still things to learn to improve my sounds and work this way....

 

 

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I think this is a situation where you can't please all the people all of the time

 

Uh, no thats not it at all..a metal platform? hardly and i dont need more razor blade tones or rectifiers  i just want the distotion and gain to sound right when you turn them on..

currently they dont

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PowerCab+  There are a few new powered cab products that are trying to bridge the gap between an frfr and a guitar cab. The L6 PowerCab and PowerCab+ are two of them. It's not a perfect answer but it's given me a new angle to play with and I like it so far. But I'm keeping my DXR12 in case the honeymoon wears off. 

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2 hours ago, MarkJarvis said:

Your right about that..my expectation is that Helix should sound great.

 

And it can. But it won't happen magically, or without effort.... which seems to be what you want. Most things dont work that way. If that's what you're holding out for in terms of a firmware update,  you might as well sell it now and go back to a tube amp. Ultimately,  you've got two choices:

 

1) Continue to blame the device because it wasn't designed the way you think it should have been. 

 

or

 

2) Learn how to use it, as the rest of us did. As shown by the myriad threads on this topic, most (if not all)  users who are now perfectly happy with Helix, did not achieve tonal nirvana just by turning it on. 

 

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cruisinon2 , Oh and I seriously doubt that you 'all' have mastered using Helix...but that said, lets hear what some of your sound tones are like. Not to put you on the spot just more curious to hear how great you managed to make it sound. 

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Someone quoted about AxeFx...
Did someone here, try to get a tone from AxeFX and was very happy with it just dialling it for a few minutes? I had the the fractal for several years and you spent a lot of time on it. Never saw anyone complaining about it. With Helix, I can't understand the expectation for something PERFECT out of the box. Gotta learn how the controls work, how they sound. That's the way modelers are nowadays. I could give so many examples of knobs in the axe fx that I could turn and could hear no difference in sound. Ok, I am not a pro, don't make music for living, but we gotta stop blaming the unit. Even the loved AxeFx sound terrible if you don't make "adjustments". We gotta be happy with what we have so far...

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1 hour ago, MarkJarvis said:

cruisinon2 , Oh and I seriously doubt that you 'all' have mastered using Helix...but that said, lets hear what some of your sound tones are like. Not to put you on the spot just more curious to hear how great you managed to make it sound. 

 

I made no claims about "mastering" anything. There's always something else to learn. I said I learned how to get what I wanted from it.... but we're all in the same boat the day we open the box. It took several weeks before I was happy with the results. 

 

I'm happy to upload some tones if you like, but it'll have to be later this evening when I get home. I have a few things on my phone, but it won't allow me to attach anything for some reason.... crappy phone and/or browser I guess.  I'll do it from my laptop later. Whether or not you'll judge it to be "great" tone, is anybody's guess.... as I really have no idea exactly what it is you wish to achieve. 

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1 hour ago, MarkJarvis said:

Please do..I will as well maybe people here can tell me what i am doing wrong

 

also this was pretty helpful..https://helixhelp.com/models/amps/

 

 

"Smooth" high gain or "smooth" distortion is really a matter of taste. I use a mix of stock cabs and IRs to get high gain sounds I love with nothing more advanced than turning the "High Cut" in the IR/Cab block down to 9-10K or so.

 

Take a listen for yourself. This one is stock cabs:

 

 

This one is with a JST Zilla IR:

 

 

 

Easy peasy.

 

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4 hours ago, MarkJarvis said:

Chunk fest..pretty cool

 

Here is a recent live recording, my current tone....

 

 

https://hearthis.at/joejeffries/sumo-2018-5-11/

 

I really don't think that tone sounds all that bad...but you're the one who has to spend time with it, lol. What don't you like about it?

 

Anyway, here's a couple of things...two very different styles, but all the guitars are Helix. Files were too big to dump in here directly, so I threw them up on soundcloud.

 

https://soundcloud.com/user-100603322/here-goes-nuthin-final-edit

https://soundcloud.com/user-100603322/this-really-needs-a-title

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7 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

I really don't think that tone sounds all that bad...but you're the one who has to spend time with it, lol. What don't you like about it?

 

Anyway, here's a couple of things...two very different styles, but all the guitars are Helix. Files were too big to dump in here directly, so I threw them up on soundcloud.

 

https://soundcloud.com/user-100603322/here-goes-nuthin-final-edit

https://soundcloud.com/user-100603322/this-really-needs-a-title

 

Respect! Great sounds and excellent chops! Would like to see these presets up on CustomTone.

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