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oops.... I bought an Axe FX III.... but...

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6 hours ago, medbad5150 said:

Fractal customer service totally kicks Line 6 service into touch.

 

What does this mean?

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17 hours ago, medbad5150 said:

Tonewise though, not a lot you haven't heard. Both units are awesome, but the learning curve for Fractal is serious rocket science. And I had the AX2 until three months ago! Honest truth 250 amps? If you want obscure and for me unusable Fractal have the edge.

 

Yeah, I had the same feelings. With Axe-FX2 you have sooooooooooo many amps that actually instead of playing the guitar you are trying to figure out which one sounds best for you and you tweak the tone for eternity...

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10 hours ago, phil_m said:

 

What does this mean?

I think he wants to touch you Phil... ; )

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Sure as Hell can't bash Line 6 support and customer service!  I've had nothing but great experiences!

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19 minutes ago, glideman said:

Sure as Hell can't bash Line 6 support and customer service!  I've had nothing but great experiences!

Overjoyed for ya mate. 

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If I could afford it I would buy it to. I love my Helix floor but I always want more. Maybe it's a grass is always greener thing but I m just addicted to gear and toys and love playing with them. I get the best sounds I have ever got out of a processor from the Helix and I love it but I also bought it because I was under the impression there would be continuous updates. 

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On 7/4/2018 at 10:46 PM, amsdenj said:

The thing that pushes Helix over the top for me is the Variax. The models aren’t perfect. And there hasn’t been much new development for quite a while. But for a gigging musician that needs a lot of guitar tones, has to carry and setup their own gear, needs some open tunings and and occasional acoustic guitar - its really hard to beat a Variax with Helix.

 

I struggle to see the consistency with your view that there hasn’t been much development in Helix, with your devotion to S-Gear, which has had so little development over its entire history, and nothing at all for aeons. Guess what? Mike’s models aren’t perfect either. You prefer the models in S-Gear. I have found better tones in Helix in 4 weeks of owning it, than I have in 3+ years of owning S-Gear. Everyone is different. 

This speaks to the endless fractal vs Helix debate too. Frankly, the price for a III in Europe is just silly, and is not commensurate with how much better it is than Helix, which is a matter of opinion anyway. 

 

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On 7/26/2018 at 2:25 PM, phil_m said:

 

What does this mean?

Probably means that for some people, their customer service experience is different from yours and probably the majority of users on here.

 

Personally i don't feel that paying $72 dollars fully insured to ship a faulty unit that i paid $1300 for, and is still under warranty, is that good a customer experience.

You can look at it any way you like, but that is the amount i'd be required to pay to repair a faulty headphone out, and i don't think that's acceptable,...part of Line 6's t&c's ? ...yes, absolutely, still doesn't make it right though.

 

The Helix is a good unit, and Line 6 make some great products, which i will still continue to buy , but i would never buy another Helix based on my experience.

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1 hour ago, GingerLefty said:

I struggle to see the consistency with your view that there hasn’t been much development in Helix,

 

I think you misunderstood his post. He was talking about the VARIAX when he said the models were not perfect and there hasn't been much development. BUT - despite that, he still considers a VARIAX and HELIX a powerful combination that Fractal (or any other) doesn't have a comparable combination to offer. 

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On 7/26/2018 at 8:41 AM, medbad5150 said:

 Fractal customer service totally kicks Line 6 service into touch.

 

Fractal CS was not able to solve constant crashing of Axe Edit, i was unable to edit my tones on computer for 6 months. They were very nice, but they did not find the bug. Not sure about your experience with L6 CS, but so far so good for me.

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6 hours ago, codamedia said:

 

I think you misunderstood his post. He was talking about the VARIAX when he said the models were not perfect and there hasn't been much development. BUT - despite that, he still considers a VARIAX and HELIX a powerful combination that Fractal (or any other) doesn't have a comparable combination to offer. 

My bad

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7 hours ago, antonio1961 said:

Probably means that for some people, their customer service experience is different from yours and probably the majority of users on here.

 

Personally i don't feel that paying $72 dollars fully insured to ship a faulty unit that i paid $1300 for, and is still under warranty, is that good a customer experience.

You can look at it any way you like, but that is the amount i'd be required to pay to repair a faulty headphone out, and i don't think that's acceptable,...part of Line 6's t&c's ? ...yes, absolutely, still doesn't make it right though.

 

The Helix is a good unit, and Line 6 make some great products, which i will still continue to buy , but i would never buy another Helix based on my experience.

 

Sorry you had a bad experience. Did you ship your unit to Line 6 in Calabasas?

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2 hours ago, phil_m said:

 

Sorry you had a bad experience. Did you ship your unit to Line 6 in Calabasas?

No, i'm in the UK, so i contacted Line 6 , who then suggested that i contacted the shop i bought it from, who in turn put me directly to a service centre here in the UK.

 

I'm not even saying i had a bad experience, the majority of the customer service reports i saw prior to purchase had been positively glowing, so i thought i had good reason to have a certain level of expectation there.

In 20 odd years of using Boss multi fx i never had one faulty unit..my first Line 6 one though goes wrong within the first 7 months , though it was possibly faulty when purchased, it just took me that long to plug in headphones.

Still doesn't fill me with enormous confidence in the Helix , so i plan to just sell it on with the inherent fault, and if someone else wants to have it repaired under warranty then good luck to them.

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6 minutes ago, antonio1961 said:

No, i'm in the UK, so i contacted Line 6 , who then suggested that i contacted the shop i bought it from, who in turn put me directly to a service centre here in the UK.

 

I'm not even saying i had a bad experience, the majority of the customer service reports i saw prior to purchase had been positively glowing, so i thought i had good reason to have a certain level of expectation there.

In 20 odd years of using Boss multi fx i never had one faulty unit..my first Line 6 one though goes wrong within the first 7 months , though it was possibly faulty when purchased, it just took me that long to plug in headphones.

Still doesn't fill me with enormous confidence in the Helix , so i plan to just sell it on with the inherent fault, and if someone else wants to have it repaired under warranty then good luck to them.

 

Well, I know it sucks to be disappointed in stuff... But there's a lot of really cool stuff coming for the Helix that might make you change your mind.

 

The one thing is that Line 6 is dependent on the Yamaha distributors in the UK and EU for service work, so they don't have a lot of say over how they run that part of the business. I know Yamaha owns Line 6, so they're technically part of the same company. It's just kind of a complicated relationship.

 

So are you saying they didn't repair your unit?

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Yes, i appreciate that there will be some new and interesting additions in the next update , but the hardware fault so early on  for me , it doesn't really inspire confidence in the Helix.

 

They are happy to repair it , but the Helix would have to be sent to the repair centre fully insured as they request , so there is no way out of it really with it being an expensive unit , it's just the nature of the beast , and though it's seen by Line 6  as a free repair under warranty , the reality is that it's actually a $72 fix regardless of the problem.

 

Just to add, the shop i purchased it from online would also post it to the repair centre for free, but the cost for me to send it there is the same, so makes no difference unfortunately.

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Is Line 6 charging you the 72 bucks for shipping, or is FedEx/UPS charging this fee? It makes a difference as to who's the blame for the expensive shipping cost. And Line 6 is fixing it for free, and then shipping it back to you after the repair for free as well? Pardon me but that does not sound that bad a deal. As far as getting a bad unit it happens a lot these days, with everything. OTOH my Helix rack has been running well for over 2 years now, and I'd gladly pay $72.00 to have it repaired if/when it needs it. A dinner for two at a fancy restaurant is about the same cost and that price doesn't include a movie or popcorn either. ; )

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20 hours ago, antonio1961 said:

Yes, i appreciate that there will be some new and interesting additions in the next update , but the hardware fault so early on  for me , it doesn't really inspire confidence in the Helix.

 

They are happy to repair it , but the Helix would have to be sent to the repair centre fully insured as they request , so there is no way out of it really with it being an expensive unit , it's just the nature of the beast , and though it's seen by Line 6  as a free repair under warranty , the reality is that it's actually a $72 fix regardless of the problem.

 

Just to add, the shop i purchased it from online would also post it to the repair centre for free, but the cost for me to send it there is the same, so makes no difference unfortunately.

Can't blame you but I feel you on this. 12 registered products. My flextone 3 took 1 year to get repaired, since it cam broken. My pod Xt had malfuctioning pedal. The piezos of my Variax 700 died soon... My variax 300 changes models by it's own. My JTV had the shaft and string problem. And my first helix came with the scrible strip burnt pixels, while my second has a dead selector on roling. Can't say, the support is another level than anyone arround, but the quality check is bellow everything else. If I will buy another product? Yes I will, but I am prety sure it will be half broken out of the box.

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45 minutes ago, arislaf said:

Can't blame you but I feel you on this. 12 registered products. My flextone 3 took 1 year to get repaired, since it cam broken. My pod Xt had malfuctioning pedal. The piezos of my Variax 700 died soon... My variax 300 changes models by it's own. My JTV had the shaft and string problem. And my first helix came with the scrible strip burnt pixels, while my second has a dead selector on roling. Can't say, the support is another level than anyone arround, but the quality check is bellow everything else. If I will buy another product? Yes I will, but I am prety sure it will be half broken out of the box.

 

Some people just get screwed. I always get food poisoning at Red Robin .... millions don't. It's just life.

 

I would stay away if I were you too. I'm just grateful I have not had the same problems.

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18 hours ago, spikey said:

Is Line 6 charging you the 72 bucks for shipping, or is FedEx/UPS charging this fee? It makes a difference as to who's the blame for the expensive shipping cost. And Line 6 is fixing it for free, and then shipping it back to you after the repair for free as well? Pardon me but that does not sound that bad a deal. As far as getting a bad unit it happens a lot these days, with everything. OTOH my Helix rack has been running well for over 2 years now, and I'd gladly pay $72.00 to have it repaired if/when it needs it. A dinner for two at a fancy restaurant is about the same cost and that price doesn't include a movie or popcorn either. ; )

 

Ok...I gotta ask. Where exactly can one get a "fancy" dinner for 2 for $72? ;)

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18 hours ago, spikey said:

Is Line 6 charging you the 72 bucks for shipping, or is FedEx/UPS charging this fee? It makes a difference as to who's the blame for the expensive shipping cost. And Line 6 is fixing it for free, and then shipping it back to you after the repair for free as well? Pardon me but that does not sound that bad a deal. As far as getting a bad unit it happens a lot these days, with everything. OTOH my Helix rack has been running well for over 2 years now, and I'd gladly pay $72.00 to have it repaired if/when it needs it. A dinner for two at a fancy restaurant is about the same cost and that price doesn't include a movie or popcorn either. ; )

You're not quite grasping this one mate, it's just the nature of having such an expensive unit as the helix, that it has to be fully insured, it is what it is, and i never blamed anyone.

Still doesn't mean that i have to accept that, and as i mentioned earlier , i won't be either.

 

Are there really that many "Bad" units these days ?, if that is the case, then i don't think that puts Line 6 in a particularly good light, but you're quite obviously one of the lucky ones, and if you'd be happy to pay the $72 to have yours repaired whist still under warranty, then that's your prerogative.

The same amount for a unit not under warranty ?, then yes i could understand that.

2 hours ago, arislaf said:

Can't blame you but I feel you on this. 12 registered products. My flextone 3 took 1 year to get repaired, since it cam broken. My pod Xt had malfuctioning pedal. The piezos of my Variax 700 died soon... My variax 300 changes models by it's own. My JTV had the shaft and string problem. And my first helix came with the scrible strip burnt pixels, while my second has a dead selector on roling. Can't say, the support is another level than anyone arround, but the quality check is bellow everything else. If I will buy another product? Yes I will, but I am prety sure it will be half broken out of the box.

You obviously have the patience of a Saint  :-)

Seems like you've had more than your share of bad luck , or whatever else you'd like to call it , I think i may well have just thrown the towel in a lot earlier .

 

There are an awful lot of "Going beyond the call of duty" type L6 customer service stories, and i don't doubt any of them, but they only serve to alienate those other customers that may feel let down by their experience.

 

From experience ,I'd offer Mesa/Boogie, and Morley pedals as two US companies that do offer good worldwide customer support.

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29 minutes ago, antonio1961 said:

There are an awful lot of "Going beyond the call of duty" type L6 customer service stories, and i don't doubt any of them, but they only serve to alienate those other customers that may feel let down by their experience.

 

Okay, but at the same time, and I'm not saying where Line 6 falls in this, but surely we're all aware that all companies have someone who despises their customer service.

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Oh I get what you're saying. You have second thoughts after a broken unit. Hey it's all good and you do with yours what you will, as will I. I'm just saying that the cost to ship it for a repair may be cheap compared to  time spent having a blast with it later. What ever you wind up with the old saying will still apply, you usually get what you pay for. And as far as broken stuff these days out of the box, it will happen no matter what it cost, but that's not the norm again, in most cases. That includes Line6 as well. 

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On 3/23/2019 at 4:32 PM, antonio1961 said:

No, i'm in the UK, so i contacted Line 6 , who then suggested that i contacted the shop i bought it from, who in turn put me directly to a service centre here in the UK.

 

I'm not even saying i had a bad experience, the majority of the customer service reports i saw prior to purchase had been positively glowing, so i thought i had good reason to have a certain level of expectation there.

In 20 odd years of using Boss multi fx i never had one faulty unit..my first Line 6 one though goes wrong within the first 7 months , though it was possibly faulty when purchased, it just took me that long to plug in headphones.

Still doesn't fill me with enormous confidence in the Helix , so i plan to just sell it on with the inherent fault, and if someone else wants to have it repaired under warranty then good luck to them.

Sir I’d be happy to help. Send me a note describing the situation and I am sure we can figure something out.

 

all the best

 

Frank

 

Frank Ritchotte
Senior Director of Operations 
Line 6 Inc
www.line6.com
O 818 575-3955
C 818 585-9767
fritchotte@line6.com
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And theres the reason why when its all said and done, Ive kept my Helix... ^^^^^^^

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On 3/23/2019 at 8:41 PM, phil_m said:

 

Well, I know it sucks to be disappointed in stuff... But there's a lot of really cool stuff coming for the Helix that might make you change your mind.

 

The one thing is that Line 6 is dependent on the Yamaha distributors in the UK and EU for service work, so they don't have a lot of say over how they run that part of the business. I know Yamaha owns Line 6, so they're technically part of the same company. It's just kind of a complicated relationship.

 

So are you saying they didn't repair your unit?

I'm quoting you phil_m because you were the one that initially engaged me in conversation, and i'd just like to say a massive thank you, not only for that, but also for being the voice of reason. :-)

 

Massive thanks to Frank at Line 6,..and to quote spikey.

On 3/26/2019 at 12:49 AM, spikey said:

And theres the reason why when its all said and done, Ive kept my Helix... ^^^^^^^

 

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I am new to the forum and I have been a fanboy of Line 6 since 2002. I have owned them all. I haven't tested a Fractal Unit yet.

 

Back when Helix didnt exist I have always wanted a Fractal, but since the Helix came out I noticed something that has made me lose some respect to Fractal.

I will be talking from a Marketing/Business and Sales perpective as that is what I do for living. Since Helix came out Fractal has launch a bunch of new products. E.g. FX II XL, FX8, AX8 and FX III, and the stomp box shortly after HX Stomp... why? Well the answer is the white elephant noone wants to talk about and Fractal strategy says a lot actually. That means they have lost customers and market share!   it looks like they are in desperation trying to get customers back and regaining market share and profit (why are their units so expensive??) They are not the cool kid anymore and people are not buying their stuff.   Fractal's  user interface has improved but not by much as I can see in so many videos. I have 4 pro friends and they ditched their Fractals for Helix and Kempers. 

 

From a business perspective is not even profitable to invest in Fractal anymore. Think about it, dont use your ears.

 

Dont take me wrong their products and sounds are amazing, but not really that price tag amazing and not even that much noticiable againt their competitors. Effects wise, yes, they have a tone, but Helix lets you use your analog pedals. So we are missing nothing!

 

I was going to buy the Fractal

from one of my friends and honestly, because of my lost of respect and what the market is showing, is not even worth it. I went for Helix LT as this is more than enough of what I need.

 

I gues Fractal needs a new CEO. Then I will consider their products again

 

Just my two cents and food for thought

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The fact that Fractal, Kemper, and Helix (plus others) are out there competing for / trying to capture the market share is a good thing. That in itself means our options will only get better, and that's a very good thing for us, guitar players.

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38 minutes ago, spikey said:

The fact that Fractal, Kemper, and Helix (plus others) are out there competing for / trying to capture the market share is a good thing. That in itself means our options will only get better, and that's a very good thing for us, guitar players.

 

Yup, you just can't stress this enough. The more people contributing new ideas and new technology as well as generating price competition the better.

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On 5/14/2019 at 10:13 PM, omars44 said:

I am new to the forum and I have been a fanboy of Line 6 since 2002. I have owned them all. I haven't tested a Fractal Unit yet.

 

Back when Helix didnt exist I have always wanted a Fractal, but since the Helix came out I noticed something that has made me lose some respect to Fractal.

I will be talking from a Marketing/Business and Sales perpective as that is what I do for living. Since Helix came out Fractal has launch a bunch of new products. E.g. FX II XL, FX8, AX8 and FX III, and the stomp box shortly after HX Stomp... why? Well the answer is the white elephant noone wants to talk about and Fractal strategy says a lot actually. That means they have lost customers and market share!   it looks like they are in desperation trying to get customers back and regaining market share and profit (why are their units so expensive??) They are not the cool kid anymore and people are not buying their stuff.   Fractal's  user interface has improved but not by much as I can see in so many videos. I have 4 pro friends and they ditched their Fractals for Helix and Kempers. 

 

From a business perspective is not even profitable to invest in Fractal anymore. Think about it, dont use your ears.

 

Dont take me wrong their products and sounds are amazing, but not really that price tag amazing and not even that much noticiable againt their competitors. Effects wise, yes, they have a tone, but Helix lets you use your analog pedals. So we are missing nothing!

 

I was going to buy the Fractal

from one of my friends and honestly, because of my lost of respect and what the market is showing, is not even worth it. I went for Helix LT as this is more than enough of what I need.

 

I gues Fractal needs a new CEO. Then I will consider their products again

 

Just my two cents and food for thought

 

Here's the thing, we are all entitled to support whatever companies we want with our hard earned money, but it's seems like you are looking down your nose at a smaller company who is just trying to be competitive in the marketplace. 

 

It's clear that Cliff over at Fractal is following his muse in terms of constantly refining and getting closer modeling sounds and processing capabilities (hence the constant updates and new hardware units) which has bled into his business philosophy and that's great. On the flipside, it's great that Line 6 has taken to heart the needs of the everyday musician who says "I wan't the benefits of Digital modeling, but I wan't it to be intuitive, inclusive, improve my workflow no matter what situation and still have great tone. Fractal knows that it can be unique by offering the kitchen sink of amp models, processing power, programmability etc. I don't want them to try and be Line 6, or vice versa.

 

Neither philosophy is wrong. If anything, it's to the benefits of both companies that every now and then they can look over the fence and say "huh, that's actually a pretty neat idea".

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 5/15/2019 at 3:13 AM, omars44 said:

From a business perspective is not even profitable to invest in Fractal anymore. Think about it, dont use your ears.

 

Is there any evidence supporting this? I'm not actually disagreeing with the statement as such because I don't know if it is supported by any facts.

 

 

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On 7/4/2018 at 3:26 PM, spikey said:

Then I must have a bad Variax amsdenj. Not necessarily intended as negative because my Variax sounds "ok", but next to my 93 strat, Jem 7v or my 98 LP standard it just leaves me lacking tone and feel wise by comparison. Now, if you don't own those nice guitars (and don't care to either) and also need more functionality then yer right, nothing beats that combo. 

 

I too had a Variax - the 1st gen and while I'm sure they've improved, because of the piezo pickups there are going to have to be some compromises in tone.  My Variax sounded like it was already plugged into an amp no matter what you plugged it into. There was so so much missing in the high end.  I'm sure they've had to lop off quite a lot of the highs that a piezo pickup actually captures to get rid of that pingy-ness that's inherent in all of them.  Not sure if they can ever do anything about that. It also didn't really interact with an amp's input impedance, likely because of the active electronics, and that gave it sort of a dead non-reactive feel. I had that thing for a few years and it was very very convenient indeed but on that instrument, everything sounded really close... but no cigar.  I had deluded myself into being content with what it was giving me until that one fateful day when I picked up a "regular" electric guitar (a Strat). That day made me realize just how much it - and I,  was missing. The acoustic sounds were pretty stellar though and that was really 80% of my reason for buying it.

 

I'll probably check out a Variax again in the future... but it will be with very skeptical ears.

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On 5/18/2019 at 11:27 AM, BBD_123 said:
  On 5/14/2019 at 9:13 PM, omars44 said:

From a business perspective is not even profitable to invest in Fractal anymore. Think about it, dont use your ears.

On 5/18/2019 at 11:27 AM, BBD_123 said:

 

Is there any evidence supporting this? I'm not actually disagreeing with the statement as such because I don't know if it is supported by any facts.

 

 

 

He doesn't know what he's talking about.  Fractal Audio is a privately held company.  From a business perspective...it's not possible to invest in Fractal.

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20 minutes ago, millerguitar said:

 

He doesn't know what he's talking about.  Fractal Audio is a privately held company.  From a business perspective...it's not possible to invest in Fractal.

 

I think the first poster you quoted was using the term "investing" as a synonym for buying Fractal's product. It's a little silly, imo, to think of buying a piece of gear as investing, as almost any piece of gear you buy is going to have a negative ROI, at least in pure financial terms.

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You're probably correct.  I've been a long time Fractal user.  Sold my AX8 about a week before the FM3 release because I had a hunch something was on the horizon.  Once the FM3 was released, I was initially excited and have since been all over the map in which direction to go.  I could get the AxeFx III, but I really don't want to shell out the $3k to get it and a controller.  But I must admit, I'm a bit disappointed in the newest FAS release. I have no doubt it will sound great, but I am hesitant to get on board.  I want more flexibility than the Kemper will provide in terms of routing options.  The Pete Thorn videos almost have me sold on the Helix. I don't like the idea of a built in pedal, but I'm not sure I want to add a rack to haul around.  I know what to expect with the FAS gear, but the only experience I he with the L6 gear is the Pod line, most recently the HD500X.  First world problems for sure. 

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There are a handful of sketchy and/or downright slimy companies in this business (clinically psychopathic or narcissistic founders, CEOs who've been fired multiple times for sexual harassment, stop paying their licensees or vendors, sue everybody for perceived slights, blatantly copy designs and even hack firmware), but Fractal's one of the good ones. Kemper and Atomic are cool too. Always nice to see people supporting them.

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Quote

but Fractal's one of the good ones. Kemper and Atomic are cool too. Always nice to see people supporting them.

 

 

Nice of you to say that D.I. And that also makes Line-6 and the competition stay on their toes (which is good for all of us)!

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8 hours ago, Digital_Igloo said:

There are a handful of sketchy and/or downright slimy companies in this business (clinically psychopathic or narcissistic founders, CEOs who've been fired multiple times for sexual harassment, stop paying their licensees or vendors, sue everybody for perceived slights, blatantly copy designs and even hack firmware), but Fractal's one of the good ones. Kemper and Atomic are cool too. Always nice to see people supporting them.

 

I wish more companies could be this positive about their competitors.

 

Except Coke about Pepsi. *?@#! Pepsi.

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7 hours ago, Kilrahi said:

 

I wish more companies could be this positive about their competitors.

 

Except Coke about Pepsi. *?@#! Pepsi.

Now this gone personal... *?@! Coke.

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21 hours ago, Digital_Igloo said:

There are a handful of sketchy and/or downright slimy companies in this business (clinically psychopathic or narcissistic founders, CEOs who've been fired multiple times for sexual harassment, stop paying their licensees or vendors, sue everybody for perceived slights, blatantly copy designs and even hack firmware), but Fractal's one of the good ones. Kemper and Atomic are cool too. Always nice to see people supporting them.

 

I sold the AX8 to beat the AX8 mass sell off and picked up an Amplifire 6 to tide me over for the new FAS piece.  Part of my angst is knowing what I was able to accomplish with the AA6 at it's price point.  There is still a significant difference between the AA6 and FAS algorithms, but it's definitely a solid piece of gear.  So dropping $2K+ on the AFIII and another $400 on a controller is making me take pause.   Any suggestions on how to try a Helix out?  I don't know anyone who owns one and I really don't want to order one online with the intention of taking advantage of a generous return policy.

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13 minutes ago, millerguitar said:

I don't know anyone who owns one and I really don't want to order one online with the intention of taking advantage of a generous return policy.

 

Buying 3 different units at the same time, knowing full well that you're gonna return 2 of them, would be "taking advantage" of a return policy. But buying one thing, and taking the time to make sure you haven't wasted $1600 is not. If those policies were putting retailers out of business, they wouldn't exist.

 

At one point they let you download a trial version of Helix Native... don't know if they're still doing that or not. You wouldn't have the hardware obviously, but functionally the software is essentially identical.

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