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MarkJarvis

Why do IR's 'feel' different, less responsive than the built in cabs?

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Why do IR's 'feel' different, less responsive than the built in cabs? So in attempt to get better tones i started down the path of IR's trying ones from the 

 sigma, OwnHammer and others. ~While they 'can' sound great and more of an end production sound, they do not 'feel as responsive as the built in cabs

(comapring examples would be Cali v30 or the Vintage 25 to a similar IR;. I like the way they sound but the 'feel' is rough ie not fluid like the built in cabs..

 

Do you have the same opinion ? 

 

I know i could be trippin but every time i swap back to built in cabs it feels way better (not sound better) and that in turn makes me play better.

 

Are there any better IR solutions  that do feel better? More dynamic?

 

 

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I haven't noticed any real difference in responsiveness between IRs and HX cabs. The IRs I tend to use are from Rosen Digital (now Lancaster Audio), specifically the Carvin Legacy. They were recently giving away their Fire Custom, which is along the same lines as the Carvin, but more refined. I also use the Orange PPC from 3 Sigma Audio. There's also a couple from Redwirez that I might use. Other than those, I guess I do tend to prefer the HX cabs for most things.

 

Perhaps your sensitivity to dynamics might be that one cab simply works better than another for a given preset, and also within context. Or you could be suffering from a form of analysis paralysis (trippin).

 

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I haven’t noticed any difference in feel. I have a small collection of Celestion IRs. My favorites are the Redbacks and the Golds. I use the mix files that blend three different mics. Blues also sound good on an AC-30 amp model.

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4 hours ago, MarkJarvis said:

Why do IR's 'feel' different, less responsive than the built in cabs? So in attempt to get better tones i started down the path of IR's trying ones from the 

 sigma, OwnHammer and others. ~While they 'can' sound great and more of an end production sound, they do not 'feel as responsive as the built in cabs

(comapring examples would be Cali v30 or the Vintage 25 to a similar IR;. I like the way they sound but the 'feel' is rough ie not fluid like the built in cabs..

 

Do you have the same opinion ? 

 

I know i could be trippin but every time i swap back to built in cabs it feels way better (not sound better) and that in turn makes me play better.

 

Are there any better IR solutions  that do feel better? More dynamic?

 

 

 

You are asking questions that are entirely subjective, and have no real answer. Some guys like the stock cabs, some prefer IR's. Ask 10 guys, and you'll get 10 different reasons why... and nobody's "right". And if I may,  all of your recent posts suggest that you are head - first down the tweaking rabbit hole. It's easy to do, and we've all done it. But sooner or later you reach a point of diminishing returns. Tone can't get "better" forever... perception is fickle, and changes from day to day. 

 

The tiny nuances you're obsessing over disappear in a mix... yes, you'll probably be able to hear subtle differences when playing unaccompanied, but so what? Once you add even one other instrument, those subtleties vanish like a fart in the wind....just play the thing. 

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Helix Cab models include early reflections which might be perceived as dynamics, IRs by comparison might sound flat. 

 

But this is very true and insightful. 

11 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

You are asking questions that are entirely subjective, and have no real answer. Some guys like the stock cabs, some prefer IR's. Ask 10 guys, and you'll get 10 different reasons why... and nobody's "right". And if I may,  all of your recent posts suggest that you are head - first down the tweaking rabbit hole. It's easy to do, and we've all done it. But sooner or later you reach a point of diminishing returns. Tone can't get "better" forever... perception is fickle, and changes from day to day. 

 

The tiny nuances you're obsessing over disappear in a mix... yes, you'll probably be able to hear subtle differences when playing unaccompanied, but so what? Once you add even one other instrument, those subtleties vanish like a fart in the wind....just play the thing. 

 

Here's an idea: Helix has a lot of options. That's great for addressing many different needs, and for widening the market. But just because all those features are there doesn't mean each of us has to audition them all in order to find the best, most perfect tone for us. That would turn the joy of Helix into a real pain.

 

Instead, why not just try something new every so often, stick with it for a while, play a few gigs, and if it sticks fine, if it doesn't, try something else. For example, I haven't been entirely happy with my Helix clean sound. It just doesn't quite do what my old Fender Showman does with the bright switch turned on. So when 2.6 came out, I tried the two new clean amps: Placater Clean and Cali Texas Ch 1. I like them both, but still like the Archetype Clean too. I can't tell which one I like better, they're all sort of just different. So I'm just going to pick one and play it a while and see if it sticks. If it does, I won't worry about whether another might be better. If it doesn't, I'll try another. 

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I guess I'm not as much of a "cork sniffer" as some when it comes to every nuance of my tone, so I can be equally happy using either and get what I want out of either of them.  What it boils down to for me is simple workflow.  Now that I've identified the cabinets, mic placement and mixes that tend to work best for me, IRs are a much quicker tool to just drop in and move on when building a preset.  Kind of like shorthand for cabinets.

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Speakers (and cabinets, and microphones) sound different at different volumes. An IR is created at one volume... therefore the speaker tone/movement is only captured at one position - regardless of how loud you play. The core tone/reaction is captured at the level the speaker was fed and even dynamics cannot change that core tone.

 

When you can match an IR up with your preamp/tone I absolutely love the consistency they provide. But it takes time to weed through many to find the few that work best for you. 

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