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zivdud

Can Helix model this?!?!?

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Just wondering if we could get a helix model of this in the new update? I figured it would help me have more game and increase my chances of satisfying my female audience members. Thanks!

 

 https://www.musicradar.com/news/steel-panther-court-controversy-with-lollipop-melter-signature-distortion-pedal

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I'd play "I want poosay" with it despite what ugly feminazis or femibolsheviks say...

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Lack of a sense of humor has always (going back to the '60s) been a problem with political feminists (political anything, really). The real world, practical feminists that I've known would have no problem responding by creating their own Toneprint called "Pecker Popper" or some such, to turn on "the 14 year old boys in the front row" who like Steel Panther. Back at ya!

 

42 minutes ago, BAmartin said:

I'd play "I want poosay" with it despite what ugly feminazis or femibolsheviks say...

 

THAT attitude is what feminists are talking about when they object to sexist stereotyping of outspoken women. NOT funny.

 

Could be that a thread of this nature has no business on this forum....

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18 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Lack of a sense of humor has always (going back to the '60s) been a problem with political feminists (political anything, really). The real world, practical feminists that I've known would have no problem responding by creating their own Toneprint called "Pecker Popper" or some such, to turn on "the 14 year old boys in the front row" who like Steel Panther. Back at ya!

  

"I'd play "I want poosay" with it despite what ugly feminazis or femibolsheviks say..." - BAmartin

 

THAT attitude is what feminists are talking about when they object to sexist stereotyping of outspoken women. NOT funny.

 

Could be that a thread of this nature has no business on this forum....

Exactly, my friend. The bell curve always has the fringe on either side. Yea, pun intended.

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6 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Lack of a sense of humor has always (going back to the '60s) been a problem with political feminists (political anything, really). The real world, practical feminists that I've known would have no problem responding by creating their own Toneprint called "Pecker Popper" or some such, to turn on "the 14 year old boys in the front row" who like Steel Panther. Back at ya!

 

Agreed...I pitty anyone incapable of recognizing parody and satire for what it is. Anybody taking Steel Panther at face value has either WAY too much free time, or they actually want to be offended, because finding windmills to tilt at makes them feel superior. And even if one finds no humor in it (which is a crying shame, but I digress), their personas are so cartoonish and gloriously over-the-top, that suggesting there is genuine intent to offend is beyond ludicrous. They pay homage to the music they grew up with, whilst also poking fun at the writ-large silliness of 80's hair metal. They're "Weird Al" in spandex and Aqua Net...

 

Shall we crucify them for their "Say Perhaps To Drugs" t-shirts, too? Please... if the world doesn't lighten up, we're all in serious trouble. 

 

All that being said, $200 is a bit much for a hot pink distortion box... I think I'll pass, lol. 

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50 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Agreed...I pitty anyone incapable of recognizing parody and satire for what it is. Anybody taking Steel Panther at face value has either WAY too much free time, or they actually want to be offended, because finding windmills to tilt at makes them feel superior. And even if one finds no humor in it (which is a crying shame, but I digress), their personas are so cartoonish and gloriously over-the-top, that suggesting there is genuine intent to offend is beyond ludicrous. They pay homage to the music they grew up with, whilst also poking fun at the writ-large silliness of 80's hair metal. They're "Weird Al" in spandex and Aqua Net...

 

Shall we crucify them for their "Say Perhaps To Drugs" t-shirts, too? Please... if the world doesn't lighten up, we're all in serious trouble. 

 

All that being said, $200 is a bit much for a hot pink distortion box... I think I'll pass, lol. 

 

Whenever I meet someone who enjoys getting angry and tilting at tiny windmills, I always suggest that they listen to any album By Kinky Friedman and the Texas Jewboys, or read any of Kinky's novels. A lifetime supply of political incorrectness on every page and something for everyone to be offended by in every verse!

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8 hours ago, zivdud said:

Just wondering if we could get a helix model of this in the new update? I figured it would help me have more game and increase my chances of satisfying my female audience members. Thanks!

 

 https://www.musicradar.com/news/steel-panther-court-controversy-with-lollipop-melter-signature-distortion-pedal

 

Yes, maybe it will be available in an upcoming 'Explicit Pack' which also contains some effects used by '2 Live Crew'... LOL

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I hadn’t heard of this, but if you asked me to imagine a Steel Panther pedal it would be exactly that. Who could possibly expect  anything different? I think it’s hilarious. I wonder what cheeky name they’d come up with for the Helix model?

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Well, I've never been impressed with "clever" things like this. It's just been overdone for decades. And then for people to take the supposedly moral high road with

 

"Gee golly! You're offended by that? I was just funnin'. Just exercising my free speech. You just need to lighten up."

 

What a croc. Of course that's going to be offensive to a group of people and it's actually not a character flaw for them to be offended. They have every right to be offended by anything they are offended by and have every right to exercise their free speech in expressing that offense. It's just foolish to think that it wouldn't offend someone. C'mon, really? Whether it should or not is another topic but to feign ignorance that someone would be offended by that is just stupid. Do you have a right to name your distortion pedal after genitalia? Of course you do. Big Muff Pi anyone? Free speech, right? It's just tiresome and boring that one of the main ways people seem to try to exercise and prove their freedom of speech and how powerful and clever they are, is to say something that they know will offend a group of people. It's been so overdone for decades and requires little to no intelligence. Twitter anyone? We all know any one of us could EASILY come up with something that will offend somebody and of course one of the main "how can I rattle someones cage?" go to's is genitalia and overtly sexual comments. YAWN. Gee, no one's ever done that before. :rolleyes:  And then look at the band's response. I'll bet they had most of that written out beforehand. I'm pretty sure they knew they would offend people. C'mon, they aren't stupid. Just their attempt at humor was IMHO. Am I offended by it personally? No, not really. I do think it's inappropriate but that's as far as my being offended goes. That humor has been around my whole life. It was kind of funny in the '60's and '70's. Now, it's just boring. Seen and heard it all before in some way or another. I am more offended by people acting shocked, surprised or indignant, that people would be offended by that. I think it would actually be a sad day for society when no one would be offended by that. It's much easier to tear something down than to build it up. That's why people do take the "offend somebody" route. It's much easier, requires little thought or intelligence and gives a false sense of power.

OK, I guess I've wagged my finger enough at this. You kids be good now. Sorry if I offended anyone. But hey,

 

"I was just funnin'. Just exercising my free speech. You just need to lighten up."

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I mean, who WOULDN'T be offended by people who get offended by products created specifically to be offensive to people who are easily (even RIGHTEOUSLY) offended by people who make a living from being offensive?

 

I think I'm offended by that....

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2 hours ago, rd2rk said:

I mean, who WOULDN'T be offended by people who get offended by products created specifically to be offensive to people who are easily (even RIGHTEOUSLY) offended by people who make a living from being offensive?

 

I think I'm offended by that....

 

How offended am I? The answer is "none". None more offended...;)

 

(without emojis, you'll all just have to imagine the "Harrumph!" and angry storm-off). Gotta go... so many injustices, so little time. Anybody seen my cape? ;)

 

 

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42 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

I mean, who WOULDN'T be offended by people who get offended by products created specifically to be offensive to people who are easily (even RIGHTEOUSLY) offended by people who make a living from being offensive?

 

I think I'm offended by that....

 

I wouldn't.

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What's really hysterical about this is the amount of discussion it's generated! Over on Gearpage, two or three threads have started and been shut down by the moderators. One was a poll, where the winner was "not buying, but not offended either. Different strokes...". Not everyone gets the humor, some people want everyone to know how PC they are, others how little they care about being PC. Meanwhile, a band I'd never heard of (and who some say are pretty good, if you like comedy and 80s hair metal), got a TON of free publicity. It'll be interesting to see if they actually sell a bunch of pedals. They probably will, if for no other reason than as collectibles. My bet is that it's nothing but another TS with funny paint.

 

I'm on my way over to YouTube to find out if they're any good, should be good for a laugh at least.....

 

 

EDIT: OK, so, the show I watched was from their current "Lower the Bar" tour. I won't try to describe it, I couldn't do it justice. Just a couple of comments:

 

1) It's no wonder that the critics are NOT AMUSED!

2) They're both fine musicians and excellent performers. Their audience (boys AND girls) loved every minute, and both they and the band were fully engaged with each other the whole time. And when I say "fully engaged", that's exactly what I mean.

3) I laughed my a$$ off, and was not offended. It's comedy.

 

For $200 I won't be buying one of their pedals, but I hope they sell LOTS!

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I`m just gonna finish my cut on this thread by quoting a British philosopher called Allan Watt. "Political correctness and speech codes are nothing but thought control. Because the only way available to express your thoughts is through language, and when you control the language... therefore you control the way people think". Hope Steel Panther keeps making music, sell a lot of those pedals, and keep getting a lot of poosay. That`s true life to me. You can always cut your nuts, use a buttplug or get an abortion if you don`t like it.

 

 

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2 hours ago, BAmartin said:

I`m just gonna finish my cut on this thread by quoting a British philosopher called Allan Watt. "Political correctness and speech codes are nothing but thought control. Because the only way available to express your thoughts is through language, and when you control the language... therefore you control the way people think". Hope Steel Panther keeps making music, sell a lot of those pedals, and keep getting a lot of poosay. That`s true life to me. You can always cut your nuts, use a buttplug or get an abortion if you don`t like it.

 

 

 

Another big aspect of True Life is, if you create something like that, many people will be offended. And it's not just true life to me. Like it or not, It is the way things are and the way it has been for at least my whole life. Is anyone actually surprised that there was a reaction? The debate as to whether people should be offended or not, is one I don't even care about. I won't judge either side. I've heard both points. Ad nauseum. I agree with aspects of both sides. I guess that's why I don't care about the "is it offensive?" debate. I've heard it my whole life. I see no end to it. But to be surprised or indignant or whatever because someone IS offended is incredibly unrealistic. Say all you want to about how people SHOULD react. TRUE LIFE is that people WILL react to it. Of course they will!! Isn't that part of the reason the band/guy did it? Isn't it part of their schitick? To get a reaction? Their canned response is the same tired old response we've heard for decades. Yes, you do have the freedom to pretty much say what you want (can't yell fire in a theater). But it's a two way street. People have a right to feel however they do about it. It is not a character flaw to be offended by what they did. I do understand why someone would. And they also have a right to express their feelings about it as well if they choose to. As far as it's supposed to be funny. Well, I don't laugh at poopie jokes anymore. But I am an old jaded fart. Oh, I don't laugh at fart jokes anymore. Hey, ya want to get a reaction from people. Fake a fart in an elevator. "What are you getting so offended for? It's not real". Hardee Har Har. Offending people is easy. Uplifting people is hard. Takes heart and mind. Something I see lacking these days. In the interest of full disclosure, I did used to laugh at poopie and fart jokes. It was usually during recess. This whole diatribe is not because I'm offended, but because I'm bored. Jeese would somebody please come up with something else. I mean this has already been done, and in a more clever way I think. (back to the Big Muff Pi). I did make a comment previously that I think it would be a sad day when people weren't offended by that but it was not because I think you shouldn't be able to do such a thing. It's because it would be an indication that people had stopped thinking for themselves. Their thoughts would have been controlled.

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I'm just dying to know what kind of clever name L6 would come up with for it - Kitty Creamer?  Feline Fusion?  That would be an interesting lunchroom chat to listen in on...

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18 minutes ago, ricstudioc said:

I'm just dying to know what kind of clever name L6 would come up with for it - Kitty Creamer?  Feline Fusion?  That would be an interesting lunchroom chat to listen in on...

 

That's a good one. LOL.

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Given a world that still has female circumcision, honor killing, rampant wage disparity, female infanticide, institutionalized rape(especially in times of war or civil unrest), and myriad other injustices and horrors that beggar imagination this hardly seems worth getting your panties or undies in a wad over. Gotta pick your battles when it comes to the slippery slope argument. It is kinda funny if perhaps in poor taste, dated, or even mildly mysogynistic so I can understand some people getting offended and I have no problem with those who do. Hey, at least this pedal focuses on the female orgasm, something they didn't even think existed until the 50's. I guess what I am trying to say is there are a lot of much more serious issues to get upset about than this that get completely ignored while trivialities get a ton of attention and outrage. I think if this pedal had made its appearance in "Spinal Tap" it might have gotten nothing but a laugh and I would not be surprised, given Steel Panther's similarity to that film/band, if that was mostly the spirit it was intended in. That and generating controversy and PR for the band and making a buck.

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On 8/10/2018 at 3:26 PM, HonestOpinion said:

Given a world that still has female circumcision, honor killing, rampant wage disparity, female infanticide, institutionalized rape(especially in times of war or civil unrest), and myriad other injustices and horrors that beggar imagination this hardly seems worth getting your panties or undies in a wad over. Gotta pick your battles when it comes to the slippery slope argument. It is kinda funny if perhaps in poor taste, dated, or even mildly mysogynistic so I can understand some people getting offended and I have no problem with those who do. Hey, at least it focuses on the female orgasm, something they didn't even think existed until the 50's. I guess what I am trying to say is there are a lot of much more serious issues to get upset about than this that get completely ignored while trivialities gets a ton of attention and outrage. I think if this pedal had made its appearance in "Spinal Tap" it might have gotten nothing but a laugh and I would not be surprised, given Steel Panther's similarity to that film/band, if that was mostly the spirit it was intended in. That and generating controversy and PR for the band and making a buck.

 

Precisely. Things like this become targets for "outrage of the day" because most of the world's REAL problems are much more complex and difficult to solve... but the "P*ssy Melter" is low hanging fruit. Make a big enough stink on social media and most of the time the target will fold like a cheap suit, fearful of negative publicity and the ever growing influence of the Twitter Mob. They issue the mandatory phony "apology" to placate the equally phony, self-appointed do-gooders and internet White Knights, many of whom don't even have a dog in the fight, but who desperately need to satisfy their voracious appetite for external validation...usually accomplished by making sure that they are seen, by as many people as possible, vigorously championing all the "right" things..."Look Ma, I'm caring!"...Then they claim victory, and POOF! They're "heroes", the world is a better place thanks to their "wisdom and courage", and their house-fly attention spans move on to the next "injustice"... all the while most genuine problems remain unsolved. It would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

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2 hours ago, HonestOpinion said:

Given a world that still has female circumcision, honor killing, rampant wage disparity, female infanticide, institutionalized rape(especially in times of war or civil unrest), and myriad other injustices and horrors that beggar imagination this hardly seems worth getting your panties or undies in a wad over. Gotta pick your battles when it comes to the slippery slope argument. It is kinda funny if perhaps in poor taste, dated, or even mildly mysogynistic so I can understand some people getting offended and I have no problem with those who do. Hey, at least it focuses on the female orgasm, something they didn't even think existed until the 50's. I guess what I am trying to say is there are a lot of much more serious issues to get upset about than this that get completely ignored while trivialities get a ton of attention and outrage. I think if this pedal had made its appearance in "Spinal Tap" it might have gotten nothing but a laugh and I would not be surprised, given Steel Panther's similarity to that film/band, if that was mostly the spirit it was intended in. That and generating controversy and PR for the band and making a buck.

Well said Honest!

 

I have been saying people get outraged over piddling crap, and turn a blind eye to the larger more consequential issues. Hence we get stuck with this current (horrible) administration as example.

 

Cruisinon's comment about the "low hanging fruit" is right, along with everyone wanting to be seen as a hero, or victim.

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The Spinal Tap reference is perfect... this is exactly the type of pedal they would have had and yes, I would have found it quite amusing. 

 

Now where did I put my package of Dean Markley strings with all those hidden easter eggs :) 

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No more overdrive or distortion pedals until we get a Klon in there!

 

Oops, sorry, thought I was on the Fractal forum.

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On 8/10/2018 at 12:26 PM, HonestOpinion said:

Given a world that still has female circumcision, honor killing, rampant wage disparity, female infanticide, institutionalized rape(especially in times of war or civil unrest), and myriad other injustices and horrors that beggar imagination this hardly seems worth getting your panties or undies in a wad over. Gotta pick your battles when it comes to the slippery slope argument. It is kinda funny if perhaps in poor taste, dated, or even mildly mysogynistic so I can understand some people getting offended and I have no problem with those who do. Hey, at least this pedal focuses on the female orgasm, something they didn't even think existed until the 50's. I guess what I am trying to say is there are a lot of much more serious issues to get upset about than this that get completely ignored while trivialities get a ton of attention and outrage. I think if this pedal had made its appearance in "Spinal Tap" it might have gotten nothing but a laugh and I would not be surprised, given Steel Panther's similarity to that film/band, if that was mostly the spirit it was intended in. That and generating controversy and PR for the band and making a buck.

 

I definitely agree people do seem to be looking for stuff to get upset about. But there also seems to be a lot of people who are doing/saying things that they know will upset people. Just to rattle a someone's cage. Not to solve anything. Stir the pot just because they can. And then feign indignance when anyone makes a comment about it. I can't help but feel that that's part of what's going on here. Yes, there was humor, but I'm pretty sure cage rattlin' was another part of it. Isn't that a part of Rock n Roll? I keep being told it is.

 

I'm sure there won't be any marches or protests because of it yet, it is no surprise that someone would say something about it. And I guess I can't help but think that even though I may think people are getting upset over nothing, they do have a right to do so. And I shouldn't really judge whether they are being trivial or not. They may be upset for some personal reason I don't know about. It's not up to me to determine what is legitimate for people get upset about. And you can't tell me they didn't know this would stir somebodies pot. C'mon.

 

For example, there are certainly many horrible acts that have happened because of racism, yet the N word will upset many people. We know it will. If some white guy named another pedal that incorporated that word in it and they honestly, did it just because they thought it was funny, do you think people will won't get upset? Do you think they shouldn't. I mean aren't there much bigger things to be upset and talk about? Yet using the logic that it's not as important or impactful as the other stuff, no one should get upset about it. After all isn't it just a word? They was just funnin'. Even if it is just a word and the only motivation was legitimately humor. It will upset people. It would be ridiculous to think it wouldn't. To use your Spinal Tap analogy, the N word has been used for humor in Blazing Saddles to great effect. But if a guitar FX pedal were to incorporate the N word in it's name, someone will get upset. No matter how funny someone else though it was. Even if they issued the same type of statement the band did, along with the naming. It will upset people. To think it wouldn't or maybe even shouldn't, is just unrealistic. Just some more thoughts. I sure seem to be full of a lot of them about this. Perhaps I'm actually just full of something else as well? Hah hah.

 

This thread sure is off the topic of this forum but it is nice to see that this still seems to be an honest discussion about this and not a complete flame war. Oh and did I mention, I own a Helix? Peace.

 

(By the way, I just watched Rockstar last night. So bad it's good. Of course I pretty much just fast forwarded through most of it stopping on the Panther song parts. Am I weird for actually liking the two main Steel Panther songs in there. I'm pretty sure I do because of Zakk's playing. At least it sounds like his playing.)

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2 hours ago, brue58ski said:

 

 

 

(By the way, I just watched Rockstar last night. So bad it's good.)

Is that the one with Mark Wahlberg? If so, then yea, that description is so apt. lol

But to be fair I like watching B movies.  So the its so bad, its good appeals to me already.

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21 minutes ago, Lachdanan0121 said:

Is that the one with Mark Wahlberg? If so, then yea, that description is so apt. lol

But to be fair I like watching B movies.  So the its so bad, its good appeals to me already.

 

Yes it is. I like watching B movies too. What's wrong with us?

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In my first post I pointed out that this discussion was maybe not appropriate to this forum. The fact that the moderator has not shut it down is a tribute to how civil we've all been. With that in mind I'll add:

 

The world is not black and white. As much as some people insist that it is, there are many shades of gray. It's not implausible that  there exists some degree of racism hard wired into our genetic coding. How we handle that is what matters. Boys and girls making naughty jokes about each other's genitalia is entirely different than misogyny. Comedians making jokes about racial stereotypes can be considered "edgy", but is entirely different from a bunch of dirtbags viciously asserting their imagined racial superiority. There is also a difference between criticizing someone's righteous indignation over overt racism or misogyny and kidding someone over being a snowflake. Where one falls in any of those spectrums (spectra?) depends in part on one's own life experiences. Sometimes "stirring the pot" is essential to stimulating dialog and getting people to examine their core beliefs. That has, historically, been one of the functions of art, and especially of comedy. Whether critics are being "righteously indignant" or being "snowflakes" is part of that dialog. 

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1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

In my first post I pointed out that this discussion was maybe not appropriate to this forum. The fact that the moderator has not shut it down is a tribute to how civil we've all been. With that in mind I'll add:

 

The world is not black and white. As much as some people insist that it is, there are many shades of gray. It's not implausible that  there exists some degree of racism hard wired into our genetic coding. How we handle that is what matters. Boys and girls making naughty jokes about each other's genitalia is entirely different than misogyny. Comedians making jokes about racial stereotypes can be considered "edgy", but is entirely different from a bunch of dirtbags viciously asserting their imagined racial superiority. There is also a difference between criticizing someone's righteous indignation over overt racism or misogyny and kidding someone over being a snowflake. Where one falls in any of those spectrums (spectra?) depends in part on one's own life experiences. Sometimes "stirring the pot" is essential to stimulating dialog and getting people to examine their core beliefs. That has, historically, been one of the functions of art, and especially of comedy. Whether critics are being "righteously indignant" or being "snowflakes" is part of that dialog. 

 

That's all true. But I would say, in my experience, stirring the pot more often results in people getting their hackles up and doesn't result in any real change. One side gets their hackles up, the other side pats themselves on the back for coming up with a "good one". They then both go back to their corners to talk about how wrong the other side is. It rarely results in people examining their core beliefs. What I've seen get better results is dialog. Actually talking like we have here. And despite all of the truth in what you've said, I don't really think they did it to demonstrate any high moral ideal. If they were trying to get us to examine any of our core beliefs, then what belief were they trying to get us examine? I can't come up with any. Something about language? Well Lenny Bruce and George Carlin did it better. Even their response gave no clue as to what we were suppose to examine. It just basically said we have a right to make this and we will. And they do have that right. I just think they thought it was funny, and it was fun to rattle a few cages in the process. I have no idea how much respect they do or do not have for the opposite sex.

This particular statement "Boys and girls making naughty jokes about each other's genitalia is entirely different than misogyny." I don't think is entirely true. There is some truth to it but I think it tends to normalize that kind of talk and thinking which then, can result in misogyny. I mean if that statement is true, then Mr. Trump's little comment in the bus about grabbing a women's p**** about a decade ago, is no big deal. He was just making a naughty little joke about genitalia. Well I think it was kind of a big deal, very disrespectful and, despite all the excuses, reflected a core belief of his. At the very least, a core belief he had at the time. I think this little pedal could also reflect a bad attitude toward women and perhaps all of the hoopla could considered to be a way for the people it did offend to stimulate the band into examining THEIR core beliefs. Just the fact that they seem to think it's no big deal, tells me something about their attitude. Just like what Trump said told me something about his. Free speech does go both ways. I think people tend to forget that. And by the way......

Steel Dragon forever!!!!

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1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

In my first post I pointed out that this discussion was maybe not appropriate to this forum. The fact that the moderator has not shut it down is a tribute to how civil we've all been. With that in mind I'll add:

 

The world is not black and white. As much as some people insist that it is, there are many shades of gray. It's not implausible that  there exists some degree of racism hard wired into our genetic coding. How we handle that is what matters. Boys and girls making naughty jokes about each other's genitalia is entirely different than misogyny. Comedians making jokes about racial stereotypes can be considered "edgy", but is entirely different from a bunch of dirtbags viciously asserting their imagined racial superiority. There is also a difference between criticizing someone's righteous indignation over overt racism or misogyny and kidding someone over being a snowflake. Where one falls in any of those spectrums (spectra?) depends in part on one's own life experiences. Sometimes "stirring the pot" is essential to stimulating dialog and getting people to examine their core beliefs. That has, historically, been one of the functions of art, and especially of comedy. Whether critics are being "righteously indignant" or being "snowflakes" is part of that dialog. 

Well said on all points! This has been a refreshingly civil discussion, but that said it is worth noting that the forum moderators rarely if ever demonstrate their existence under any circumstances...

 

I think that generally speaking no one is getting upset that people are reacting negatively to these sorts of things (honestly it is undoubtedly part of the motivation). Where the battle lines tend to get drawn is when the offended group decides that the thing they disagree with should not be allowed to exist because they disagree with it, or that a person expressing objectionable viewpoints must be destroyed. The free exchange of ideas and freedom to express yourself and your beliefs requires give-and-take from both sides: Yes, you are free to entertain and express unpopular thoughts and opinions. Yes, others are free to disagree loudly. For the system to work, both sides must tolerate the existence of things they don't like. When it comes to marketing ploys like this one, you are given great leverage: vote with your wallet! If Steel Panther has mis-judged their demographic, then they are going to take a hit in the pocketbook (It made me laugh, but I'm not buying one...). The same is true of the hypothetical "N-Word" guitar pedal in the illustration above: nobody is going to buy one. Problem solved. However if it were a piece of equipment marketed to rap/hip hop artists, where that word is tossed around more freely among peers, it might be a different story. At any rate I believe it comes down to recognizing that for any concept there are going to be people who think it's great and people who think it's awful and people who don't much care either way. If we find we have to do away with everything that anybody disagrees with then there isn't going to be much left. The more treacherous path I think is deciding that one small group is allowed to decide what may and what may not exist based on their own ideals.....

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27 minutes ago, Verne-Bunsen said:

The same is true of the hypothetical "N-Word" guitar pedal in the illustration above: nobody is going to buy one. Problem solved. However if it were a piece of equipment marketed to rap/hip hop artists, where that word is tossed around more freely among peers, it might be a different story.

 

I did have this thought but since, in this case, it is a male doing this i.e. a different gender than whom I'm assuming most of the offended people were, I was thinking in terms of a white person putting the N-word pedal out. That white guy would get a negative response from someone. I guess I wasn't clear in that regard. Most of the discussion seems to be more about whether they should or shouldn't have put the pedal out. I'm not making any statement in that regard. I'm just saying, right or wrong, to put the pedal that they created with that name, out there, was, of course, going to result in controversy. It just will. Ultimately, that's the only point I'm trying to make. Not whether it's right or wrong. Not whether either side should or shouldn't. Just, you can't be surprised that there was controversy. Unrealistic to think that.

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The "slippery slope" concept is certainly valid, and something that all thinking people need to be vigilant of, both in our own beliefs and in society. It is also inherent in the acceptance of the idea of the gray scale. In my opinion, Trump's "grabbing" statement, while typical of "locker room" banter, is certainly way over on the dark side.

 

I'm under no delusion that Steel Panther's stirring of the pot stems from high moral motivations. They're capitalist artists in it for a buck and their hedonistic perceptions of "good times". But whether or not an artist is consciously striving to influence society in a positive way or just making a buck doesn't change the fact that it DOES stimulate dialog through art. For better or worse is up to the participants in that dialog, and history will be the judge.

 

Has anybody else noticed that there doesn't seem to be many women on this forum? There are quite a few over on Gearpage, but the moderators seem to have shut down the discussions before they got involved. Was that the result of a chauvinistic conspiracy? My tin foil hat is vibrating......:)

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2 hours ago, brue58ski said:

 

...Most of the discussion seems to be more about whether they should or shouldn't have put the pedal out. I'm not making any statement in that regard. I'm just saying, right or wrong, to put the pedal that they created with that name, out there, was, of course, going to result in controversy... 

I didn't intend any of my comments to be directed at you, and apologize if it came across that way. I was referring to the the "culture of offense" in general. There are complications inherent in a text based discussion... As I said, this has been a refreshingly civil discussion all around!

 

2 hours ago, brue58ski said:

...Just, you can't be surprised that there was controversy. 

Now there's a point I believe we can all agree on, haha!

 

33 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Has anybody else noticed that there doesn't seem to be many women on this forum? There are quite a few over on Gearpage, but the moderators seem to have shut down the discussions before they got involved. Was that the result of a chauvinistic conspiracy? My tin foil hat is vibrating......:)

I'm only really active on a couple of guitar-centric forums, but I have certainly noticed that to be the case. There are any number of conclusions that could be drawn as to the "why" of that, who knows? Not that it's exactly what you are pointing out here, but it leads me to this thought: There is a difference between censorship and respectfully guarding ones tongue in mixed company. I suppose it is probably wise to err on the conservative side when one really doesn't know who is behind the forum screen names...

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12 minutes ago, Verne-Bunsen said:

I didn't intend any of my comments to be directed at you, and apologize if it came across that way. I was referring to the the "culture of offense" in general. There are complications inherent in a text based discussion... As I said, this has been a refreshingly civil discussion all around!

 

Now there's a point I believe we can all agree on, haha!

 

I'm only really active on a couple of guitar-centric forums, but I have certainly noticed that to be the case. There are any number of conclusions that could be drawn as to the "why" of that, who knows? Not that it's exactly what you are pointing out here, but it leads me to this thought: There is a difference between censorship and respectfully guarding ones tongue in mixed company. I suppose it is probably wise to err on the conservative side when one really doesn't know who is behind the forum screen names...

 

Another interesting (dumb?) observation - has anyone noticed that in all the hoorah about Steel Panther's sexist presentation, no one has ventured any opinion on Lexxi Foxx? Not my type, but s/he is kinda cute...but is s/he PC? Are there no LGBTQ musicians in the audience? Not that I mean to stir the pot or anything.....

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On 8/12/2018 at 10:06 AM, brue58ski said:

 

I definitely agree people do seem to be looking for stuff to get upset about. But there also seems to be a lot of people who are doing/saying things that they know will upset people. Just to rattle a someone's cage. Not to solve anything. Stir the pot just because they can. And then feign indignance when anyone makes a comment about it. I can't help but feel that that's part of what's going on here. Yes, there was humor, but I'm pretty sure cage rattlin' was another part of it. Isn't that a part of Rock n Roll? I keep being told it is.

 

I'm sure there won't be any marches or protests because of it yet, it is no surprise that someone would say something about it. And I guess I can't help but think that even though I may think people are getting upset over nothing, they do have a right to do so. And I shouldn't really judge whether they are being trivial or not. They may be upset for some personal reason I don't know about. It's not up to me to determine what is legitimate for people get upset about. And you can't tell me they didn't know this would stir somebodies pot. C'mon.

 

For example, there are certainly many horrible acts that have happened because of racism, yet the N word will upset many people. We know it will. If some white guy named another pedal that incorporated that word in it and they honestly, did it just because they thought it was funny, do you think people will won't get upset? Do you think they shouldn't. I mean aren't there much bigger things to be upset and talk about? Yet using the logic that it's not as important or impactful as the other stuff, no one should get upset about it. After all isn't it just a word? They was just funnin'. Even if it is just a word and the only motivation was legitimately humor. It will upset people. It would be ridiculous to think it wouldn't. To use your Spinal Tap analogy, the N word has been used for humor in Blazing Saddles to great effect. But if a guitar FX pedal were to incorporate the N word in it's name, someone will get upset. No matter how funny someone else though it was. Even if they issued the same type of statement the band did, along with the naming. It will upset people. To think it wouldn't or maybe even shouldn't, is just unrealistic. Just some more thoughts. I sure seem to be full of a lot of them about this. Perhaps I'm actually just full of something else as well? Hah hah.

 

This thread sure is off the topic of this forum but it is nice to see that this still seems to be an honest discussion about this and not a complete flame war. Oh and did I mention, I own a Helix? Peace.

 

(By the way, I just watched Rockstar last night. So bad it's good. Of course I pretty much just fast forwarded through most of it stopping on the Panther song parts. Am I weird for actually liking the two main Steel Panther songs in there. I'm pretty sure I do because of Zakk's playing. At least it sounds like his playing.)

 

First off, no doubt in my mind now this topic would have been better off posted in the Line6 Lounge area. We are miles away from a Helix discussion.

 

I agree with your point regarding cage rattling and then feigning innocence although there are also certainly plenty of instances where the rattler is somewhat surprised by the magnitude of the response. Steel Panther may not have been anticipating quite this level of fervor, delighted as they may be about the result. 

 

I am a believer in "political correctness" when it is used as a tool to help minimize racism, sexism, ageism, and whatever other "isms" plague us or diminish our collective unity and quality of life. Language does matter and sometimes modifying and updating it can make palpable and real changes to thought. However like many tools correctness can be used to improve, fix and repair, or too bludgeon. When political correctness becomes a tool to eliminate free speech, obfuscate the truth, or suppress any nuance or dissension in public dialogue it can start to hit a point of diminishing returns. When conversation becomes a trap to catch someone saying the "wrong thing" and all humor is excised from our speech, dialogue can become a pretty miserable proposition. Seems sometimes like this is all part of the modern social networking paradigm where the most extreme, partisan, knee-jerk, and hostile points of view are rewarded with the most likes. People have been conditioned to pounce, and with a degree of ferocity that is not commensurate with the perceived "offense"  as soon as they detect anything that might topple them from their miles high soapbox.

 

I also get your point comparing the "N" word and the "P" word (the editor replaced the word I had here originally with "lollipop"). Certainly the "P" word has been used in a derogatory fashion to indicate cowardice or in a somewhat adolescent fashion to indicate getting sex but it can also be a somewhat neutral colloquialism for a female body part. The "N" word is straight up racist and in my opinion never has any neutral connotations. It had to be "taken back" by African-Americans and the "er" switched out for an "a" just to wrench it back, defuse it and remove the power from those who would still use it to demean and dehumanize. I think the "P" word is much more contextual as in it is NOT ok to use it when you are talking about grabbing it without consent, however in some other contexts it is used benignly with no hostile intent whatsoever. Even if I may personally find them a bit prissy I also understand the perspective of those who find slang offensive in general. However the "N" word is IHMO pretty much never ok to say, particularly if you are not African-American and will always carry with it the heavy baggage of slavery. And that brings me to another point, false equivalency.

 

Not every argument has two sides and even when it does one side may be flat out wrong. Not every comparison is of two equal entities. Magnitude is important! The world is a complicated place full of grey areas, nuance, and complication. Giving equal weight to everything is just a ridiculous way to evaluate things. I think comparing the use of the "N" word to this pedal's name is a false equivalency. Using the "N" word is a much graver and more serious offense. Sure you can make some salient points of comparison but I think the two cases are substantively and substantially different. But hey, what do I know, I am a man and my point of view is admittedly subjective. I think it is our inability to recognize our "inalienable" rights are intersecting and somewhat of a balancing act that is at the heart of our failure to make some critical quality of life changes in this country right now. We have not yet been able to reconcile the fact that while most people understand in their gut that you can't yell "fire" in a crowded theater this does not comport with an absolutist view of our rights. Those discussions also almost always veer into a slippery slope argument which ends up going nowhere.

 

Anyway, as I said, despite the fact that it gave me a chuckle I have no problem with those who take offense at this pedal name although I hardly think it merits a march on Washington. Instead I tried to use the issue in my original post to draw attention to some problems I believe to be of enormous import, issues that profoundly impact women, families, and therefor all of us. These are some of the challenges that really do merit peoples' attention, resources, and initiative to fix. I hate seeing all that energy diverted, including my own, into what I still maintain is a triviality in the grand scheme of things. I think that argument can be made without it devolving into simply being a case of excusing bad behavior by saying "there are worse things in the world".  Better to use these relatively inconsequential issues as opportunities to direct our efforts at substantive issues than to blow them out of proportion which is not only counter-productive and alienates people already in our corner but also provides a smoke screen and distraction and diminishes our capacity to deal with real and actual sh*tstorms.

 

I'm also sick to death of circular firing squads where people of overwhelmingly positive intent, common values, and a record of supporting righteous causes are dragged down by some relatively and ultimately inconsequential variance from the "party line". Not saying that is necessarily the case here but this is just the kind of issue that is being used all the time now to take people down whose overarching record is one of contribution and fairness, or maybe in this case just adding a little humor or music to the world.

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3 hours ago, HonestOpinion said:

 

First off, no doubt in my mind now this topic would have been better off posted in the Line6 Lounge area. We are miles away from a Helix discussion.

 

 

Ya know you're right. I've spewed enough of my thoughts here. I think I'm basically repeating myself. I guess I just like to hear myself talk. Let me say it's been a pleasure how civil this has been. See ya all on the flip side

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20 hours ago, brue58ski said:

 

Yes it is. I like watching B movies too. What's wrong with us?

We are probably masochists on some level. Lol

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