Hx stomp amp sim into external speaker cabinet (not powercab)

[seymourbeetle]

Hi all, I'm new here, so thanks for taking the time to read and respond to my question. I'm interested in getting an Hx Stomp for both the effects and the amp sims but I'm curious if it's possible to use an external speaker cabinet that isn't the Powercab. I'm wondering if I'd be able to run this signal flow: guitar > hx stomp with amp sim (no impulse response) > external speaker.

 

I don't own an Hx Stomp so I'm not sure if you have control over something like 4, 8 or 16 ohms output from the pedal to match the impedance of a cabinet. If this isn't a possibility, are there any potential work arounds (something like a DI box that would convert the signal from the hx stomp to match the impedance of a cabinet)? 

 

Sorry if any of this is confusing, I'm just wondering if there's an alternative to the Powercab. Thanks for your help!!

[Kilrahi]

13 hours ago, seymourbeetle said:

Hi all, I'm new here, so thanks for taking the time to read and respond to my question. I'm interested in getting an Hx Stomp for both the effects and the amp sims but I'm curious if it's possible to use an external speaker cabinet that isn't the Powercab. I'm wondering if I'd be able to run this signal flow: guitar > hx stomp with amp sim (no impulse response) > external speaker.

 

I don't own an Hx Stomp so I'm not sure if you have control over something like 4, 8 or 16 ohms output from the pedal to match the impedance of a cabinet. If this isn't a possibility, are there any potential work arounds (something like a DI box that would convert the signal from the hx stomp to match the impedance of a cabinet)? 

 

Sorry if any of this is confusing, I'm just wondering if there's an alternative to the Powercab. Thanks for your help!!

 

There are tons of alternatives to the Powercab. Myself, I use a Line 6 Firehawk 1500, a Boss Acoustic Singer Live, a Peavey Bandit 112, and a Line 6 Spider V set to flat mode. If you do a search on this forum you'll find lots of FRFR recommendations (a popular one is the Headrush 112). 

 

You can pretty much plug it into any flat response speaker or traditional amp setup you can dream of.

 

However, if you're referring to plugging it straight into a cab itself (no amp head). . . you would need some kind of work around because the Stomp can't drive a passive speaker cabinet. 

[cruisinon2]

 

14 hours ago, seymourbeetle said:

 

I don't own an Hx Stomp so I'm not sure if you have control over something like 4, 8 or 16 ohms output from the pedal to match the impedance of a cabinet. If this isn't a possibility, are there any potential work arounds (something like a DI box that would convert the signal from the hx stomp to match the impedance of a cabinet)? 

 

 

 

Impedance matching is not relevant here, as the Stomp has no power section (nor do any of the other Helix products). It cannot drive a passive speaker cabinet. You can monitor with a traditional guitar cabinet if you like, but the juice has to come from somewhere...either a dedicated power amp, or the slaved power section of a head or combo.

[seymourbeetle]

thank you cruisinon2 and kilrahi, your replies answered a lot of questions for me. 

3 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

 

Impedance matching is not relevant here, as the Stomp has no power section (nor do any of the other Helix products). It cannot drive a passive speaker cabinet. You can monitor with a traditional guitar cabinet if you like, but the juice has to come from somewhere...either a dedicated power amp, or the slaved power section of a head or combo.

 

This makes me wonder. is it pointless to use the amp emulation if you're running the Helix Stomp straight into a traditional amp?

[Kilrahi]

11 minutes ago, seymourbeetle said:

thank you cruisinon2 and kilrahi, your replies answered a lot of questions for me. 

 

This makes me wonder. is it pointless to use the amp emulation if you're running the Helix Stomp straight into a traditional amp?

 

Largely, yes. It would be like chaining two amps together. Maybe there's a great tone in there somewhere, but it would be really hard to find it. 

 

That's why usually if using with a traditional amp, players use only the effects with no amp or cab, and connect it to the amp with the four cable method. The four cable method allows you to have effects of your choosing before the pre amp, and effects of your choosing after the pre amp (this is exactly what I do when I use the Peavey Bandit 112). 

[seymourbeetle]

16 minutes ago, Kilrahi said:

 

Largely, yes. It would be like chaining two amps together. Maybe there's a great tone in there somewhere, but it would be really hard to find it. 

 

That's why usually if using with a traditional amp, players use only the effects with no amp or cab, and connect it to the amp with the four cable method. The four cable method allows you to have effects of your choosing before the pre amp, and effects of your choosing after the pre amp (this is exactly what I do when I use the Peavey Bandit 112). 

 

So are you using the 4 cable method to run the amp emulation on the Hx Stomp before the power amp/speaker?

[Kilrahi]

15 minutes ago, seymourbeetle said:

 

So are you using the 4 cable method to run the amp emulation on the Hx Stomp before the power amp/speaker?

 

No, if you're using a real amp (so it already possesses the coloring of an amp) then you would not want to add an amp sim, or an amp cab.  Mapping out the signal chain would look something like this:

 

1. HX's Stomp  effects (distortions, compressors, etc.) >>>> Real Amp/Cab Tone >>>> HX Stomp  effects (delay, reverb, etc.). 

 

You typically would not use an HX amp or cab. 

 

Now, there is another option here. Some people really like doing a variation that, for lack of a better term, could be called "The Two Cable Method," and essentially skipping the first part of their real amp and plugging directly into their effects return. Then they use a pre-amp model from the HX Stomp to further color the tone, put HX Stomp effects after that pre amp model, and then let the real amp's take their tone the rest of the way home. So, a user doing this would plug their guitar into the HX Stomp's left main input and then plug a 1/4 cable from the HX Stomp's left main output to the effects loop return of their real amp. 

 

2. HX's Stomp effects >>>> HX Stomp pre amp of choice >>> HX Stomp effects >>>> Real Amp (FX Return only).

 

This second idea is a neat option that personally I haven't played around with much. 

[seymourbeetle]

1 hour ago, Kilrahi said:

 

No, if you're using a real amp (so it already possesses the coloring of an amp) then you would not want to add an amp sim, or an amp cab.  Mapping out the signal chain would look something like this:

 

1. HX's Stomp  effects (distortions, compressors, etc.) >>>> Real Amp/Cab Tone >>>> HX Stomp  effects (delay, reverb, etc.). 

 

You typically would not use an HX amp or cab. 

 

Now, there is another option here. Some people really like doing a variation that, for lack of a better term, could be called "The Two Cable Method," and essentially skipping the first part of their real amp and plugging directly into their effects return. Then they use a pre-amp model from the HX Stomp to further color the tone, put HX Stomp effects after that pre amp model, and then let the real amp's take their tone the rest of the way home. So, a user doing this would plug their guitar into the HX Stomp's left main input and then plug a 1/4 cable from the HX Stomp's left main output to the effects loop return of their real amp. 

 

2. HX's Stomp effects >>>> HX Stomp pre amp of choice >>> HX Stomp effects >>>> Real Amp (FX Return only).

 

This second idea is a neat option that personally I haven't played around with much. 

 

This is what I was wondering about, thanks for helping me out! It sounds like an awesome idea but I just realized that my amp (Fender Princeton) doesn't have an effects loop so all of this option wouldn't work with my current setup but I'm still interested in the Hx Stomp + powered cabinet combo since seems like it's got a convincing tube sound without some of the pain-in-the-lollipop maintenance of a tube amp.

[FilziSH]

Just for the record. A few days ago I bought a Peavey 112-6 cab with Celestion G12M Greenback dyn and connected HX Stomp directly to it. Result: sounds like total crap :D Extremely quiet on max volume level and very thin and lifeless sound, also impossible to play on high gain, really hurt for ears

[mcvmcv]

I would recomend a cheap combo amp, with a good speaker. Just make sure it has a loop so you can bypass it's preamp.

You would go: guitar-HXStomp-combo's loop return

Disable cabs/IR on the stomp (1 less block to use!)

[Json235]

I wanna use the hx stomp and just a cab. Can I link it up by using just the hx stomp, a pre amp pedal and a cab?