Helix into amp input from line out on amp

[mgw5678]

Hi can any one help?

I have a fender tweed amp that has no effects loop but has a line out which bypasses the speaker for recording purposes, computer etc. I would like to connect my Helix to use the effects only with effects before and after my amp for live work with an impulse response block. Can this be done?

cheers

mark

Edited June 17, 2019 by mgw5678
Correcting mistake in title

[rd2rk]

Guitar to Helix INPUT. Insert Pre Amp Effects (Distortion, Mods, delays, whatever). Run a SEND to the amp's input (set to Instrument), then take the LINE OUT from the amp to the Helix RETURN (set to LINE - puts the Fender preamp in a Helix Loop). Put the Helix 1/4 out at he end of Path A. then wire it back back to a different return. Use that return as the input to PATH B with an IR/CAB whose output goes to the XLR OUT and on to a second amp,  PA or other FRFR cab.

 

However, it'll probably sound awful. ALL the effects in PATH A, AND the Fender preamp (I'm assuming that the LINE OUT is before the POWER AMP, as I've never seen a Fender with a Reactive Load Box built in -  certainly NOT in a Tweed) will be on that line. So now you need a POWER AMP emulation, since Helix doesn't split the Pre and Power amp sections of it's amps.

 

You can get something like the Mooer Radar (cheap - $150) which has power amp emulations and IRs. Run the LINE OUT to a Helix RETURN, use that RETURN as INPUT to a second PATH, then put the Mooer in another LOOP on that PATH with the desired after amp effects (before and/or after the Mooer Loop). PATH B OUT goes to XLY then FOH/second amp/FRFR.

 

Or you could put the Mooer between the Fender and Helix, but that restricts you to putting the effects after the IR. Either way, that would allow the after amp effects you want, but only in that signal path, they wouldn't come out of the Fender (AND you get 4 more AD/DA conversions - 2 at the Mooer and 2 for the Loop) and send that to the FOH/second amp/FRFR.

 

I count 8 AD/DA conversions at 2ms (IIRC) each for 16ms added latency and possible related Tone Suck - you're using the Fender for the TONE, right?

 

You could also get a Reactive Load Box (not cheap) which does the same thing as the Mooer (IRs) but allows for using your amp's power amp in the chain (using the amp's second speaker out IF it has one, instead of the LINE OUT) instead of an emulation, with attenuation if desired. Two Notes Torpedo Capture runs $250. There's lots of other possibilities, but those are the cheapest I know of.

 

Oh, almost forgot - if you want more effects AFTER the amp, you might be able to run a LINE OUT from the LOAD BOX back to a Helix RETURN as described above, but keep in mind what I said about AD/DA conversions and Latency.

 

To summarize, while there are no doubt other variations on the things I've mentioned, it sounds like a whole lot of expense and complication for what will probably be a less than satisfactory outcome. We all love our Fender amps, but what you're wanting to do requires a proper Effects Loop in the amp.

 

 

[mgw5678]

Thank you this is so helpful. I think it will be much easier just to put the Helix in the front of the amp like a regular pedal board. The only thing I’ve found when doing that is it’s noisy. There seems to be some electrical interference somewhere, any ideas?

thanks again 

 

 

[rd2rk]

Make sure that the amp and Helix are plugged into a Line Conditioner  - a good EMI filtered power strip should do it. Make sure the power strip isn't on the same house circuit as fluorescent lights, rheostats, refrigerators, microwaves, etc.

 

Swap out cables.

 

Check if the noise is in the headphones or just the amp. Does it have a ground switch?

 

You'll want the 1/4" OUT set to INSTRUMENT. Depending on your pickup's output (SC, HB?), you might want to set the Input Pad.

Turn on the Noise Gate. Turn down guitar volume. Turn off all the effects. Turn them back on one at a time.

 

All I can think of just now.

[mgw5678]

Many thanks for this I will check everything you’ve suggested.

Thanks

!ark