Can You Use Any New Variax Features That A Hd500 Has That The X3 Doesn't On An Old Variax?

[clay-man]

Hey. What new features that the HD500 does on a JTV can be applied to an original Variax?

 

I know you can't do everything that it can do on a JTV, but is there anything you can do extra on an old Variax compared to what an X3 can do on an old Variax?

 

I'm probably still going to get a HD500 for sure, but I just want to know the key differences.

[TheRealZap]

I don't think there is any benefit to a generation 1 variax with the pod HD's.

[clay-man]

I don't think there is any benefit to a generation 1 variax with the pod HD's.

I can switch patches right? I should be able to do the features the X3 could do on a Variax on an HD right?

 

It's one of the reasons I want to get an HD, to have preset room, but I was just wondering if there's anything else I can do.

[silverhead]

...What new features that the HD500 does on a JTV can be applied to an original Variax?.....

None. All new features take advantage of the new JTV platform/technology (e.g. model-independent alternate tunings, Vol/Tone knobs as controllers). No feature additions or associated firmware updates were made to the original Variax, and hence the new features cannot be exploited by the HD500.

[silverhead]

Yes, the HD500 can do anything on the older Variax models that the X3 can do.

[TheRealZap]

not sure i understand this...

but you wont get any more preset room...

but you can recall the models on your variax wiuth the pod hd's

I can switch patches right? I should be able to do the features the X3 could do on a Variax on an HD right?

 

It's one of the reasons I want to get an HD, to have preset room, but I was just wondering if there's anything else I can do.

[clay-man]

not sure i understand this...

but you wont get any more preset room...

but you can recall the models on your variax wiuth the pod hd's

What do you mean recall the models?

 

Many of you told me I can use a POD to expand the models I use on my Variax when I complained about the room I had on the model select knob.

You can throw workbench patches on a POD and assign them to your Variax, right?

[TheRealZap]

nope... not at all...

you can only recall what is stored on the variax.

 

What do you mean recall the models?

 

Many of you told me I can use a POD to expand the models I use on my Variax when I complained about the room I had on the model select knob.

You can throw workbench patches on a POD and assign them to your Variax, right?

[phil_m]

You can store custom tunings in a preset on the HD500 for the JTV. But you can't store models themselves. If you change a model on Workbench, you still have to save it on a slot on the guitar itself. You can bring up that model with a preset on the HD500. But, you can also alter the tuning of that model in a preset on the HD500, too. So it does give you extra flexibility in the sense that you don't have to use a slot on the Variax itself for every altered tuning you want to use.

[TheRealZap]

but YOU can't recall tunings... on a generation 1 variax. (just models with alt tunings)

 

You can store custom tunings in a preset on the HD500 for the JTV. But you can't store models themselves. If you change a model on Workbench, you still have to save it on a slot on the guitar itself. You can bring up that model with a preset on the HD500. But, you can also alter the tuning of that model in a preset on the HD500, too. So it does give you extra flexibility in the sense that you don't have to use a slot on the Variax itself for every altered tuning you want to use.

[clay-man]

Wait I don't get what you're talking about. I can make presets and put them on the HD500 and use that to change tunings? But I can't use it to change the models of the guitar?

 

If you're saying I can't do any of this on a regular Variax, what's the point of having a VDI port on a POD X3?

 

It sounds like I can change the tunings somehow by what you're saying. If I had a POD I could probably remove the wasted banks spent on alt tunings of duplicate models in E standard. If I did that, I could still expand and put more models by taking the wasted space off and replacing them with unique models.

 

My question is, if I can change the tuning, would switching the pickup change the tuning back to the one on the variax?

How would I switch pickups without resetting the tuning?

[TheRealZap]

you can use the pod to change models.... thats all with the original variax. (those models can be alt tuned)

tunings cannot be recalled independent of the models when using the original variax.

 

 

to switch pickups you'd have to have 2 models (or more)... tuned the same.... whatever that tuning is.... (and yes those will take up your slots)

 

the factory models... simply take up space... and you can use them or not use them... but you cannot change them.

[phil_m]

The big difference between the original Variax and the JTV is that the tuning and models are independent from one another on the JTV (mostly). You can have an altered tuning saved with the model on the JTV, but you can also easily change the tuning on any model without being connected to Workbench. You couldn't do this on the original Variax. To change tuning, you'd always have to go into Workbench, change the model there, and that's what the tuning on that slot was. You couldn't alter it any further without Workbench. On the JTV, you can change the tuning on any model by turning the tuning knob to one of the saved tunings on the tuning knob, you can create a custom tuning on the fly using virtual capo, or you can save a specific tuning with a preset on the HD500. This is all separate from the guitar model itself. You can still force a model with a preset on the HD500 like you could with the X3L. But on top of that you can add this tuning layer. It sounds a bit complicated, but it's really only as complicated as you want it to be. The main thing is that there's a whole lot more flexibility with the JTV and the HD500 than there was with the original Variax and the X3L (or the original Variax and the HD500).

[silverhead]

Another thing that needs to be understood here is that the Pod HD (and the Pod X3/xt) does not actually store a JTV (or original Variax) model definition in the Pod preset, and does not 'load' a new model into the Variax. It stores and sends information that identifies which Variax model (already loaded in the Variax) will be activated, and parameters for that model. The Variax responds by activating the identified model and adjusting its parameters as ordered.

 

In the Pod X3/xt a preset stores the location ID of a model in the Variax, determined by the positions of the Model Selector knob and the pickup switch. It also stores the position of the Tone (and, If I recall, the Vol) knob. Any alternate tuning is contained in the Variax model; the X3/xt knows nothing about this. Using Variax Workbench you can customize all 60 models that are stored in the Variax, including the factory models. Each model may or may not contain an alternate tuning as part of its definition. When a Pod X3/xt is used with a JTV, the X3 preset cannot control the newer JTV capabilities such as model-independent alternate tuning and the use of the Vol/Tone knobs as controllers.

 

In the Pod HD series, a preset stores the above information as well as additional Variax model parameter information including features that apply only to the JTV: alternate tuning that can change the tuning stored in the Variax model, and Vol/Tone knob controller information. When the preset is recalled, all of this information is sent to the Variax, which responds by activating the identified model and adjusting its parameters accordingly. When a Pod HD is used with an original Variax it cannot force the original Variax to behave as if it had the new capabilities of the JTV in terms of alternate tunings and knob controllers.

 

In both original Variax Models and in the JTV, the only way the actual models are loaded into the Variax is by using Workbench. No Pod device accepts or stores actual Variax model definitions in its presets. It stores information - model identification and parameter settings - about models already loaded into the Variax, and uses this information to control Variax model selection and parameter settings when the preset is recalled.

[clay-man]

Woah woah woah guys. If you guys are trying to tell me that the HD can't tell the Variax HOW to model, I already know that.

 

I am asking if it can load up a preset just like when editting in workbench.

 

A preset is basically data/info telling the Variax the parameters: guitar body, guitar pickups, which pickups are active, PU positions, and the rest that you can edit in workbench.

 

I know the POD doesn't store the algorithms of a Variax. I'm not stupid.

 

What I'm asking is if I can put workbench presets in POD for it to send to the Variax so it'll use that model patch. That's what I mean by "model".

 

By what you guys are saying, it either can do what I just stated above, or it just simply tells the Variax which bank on the knob to select, which is completely pointless and does NOT add to the Variax, but simply gives a new way to control how to get to your patches on the guitar.

 

If it's the latter, than I'm disappointed.

[phil_m]

What I'm asking is if I can put workbench presets in POD for it to send to the Variax so it'll use that model patch. That's what I mean by "model".

 

Yes, you can do that. Al people are saying is that with the JTV and HD500 combo you're not limited to just doing that. You can do more.

[silverhead]

.....

 

What I'm asking is if I can put workbench presets in POD for it to send to the Variax so it'll use that model patch. That's what I mean by "model".

 

....

I think Phil and I are interpreting this question differently, based on what you mean by a workbench preset. The pod has no concept of things like guitar body, pickup styles, etc. that you can adjust using workbench. You can't select or modify those things using a pod. All it can do is tell the Variax which bank on the knob to select, and the few other things described above. With the original Variax ALL you can do with a pod is bank/knob selection. With a pod HD and a JTV you can also specify alternate turnings and knob controllers. That's all. The pod is not an alternative to workbench in terms of building Variax models, if that's what you are hoping.

[clay-man]

Yes, you can do that. Al people are saying is that with the JTV and HD500 combo you're not limited to just doing that. You can do more.

 

Ok. So there's no benifits between an X3 and HD with a gen 1 Variax? 

 

That's a shame, but I understand. 

I understand what you meant about not being able to do custom tunings with the old Variaxes, because yes, the JTVs alt tuning function is programmed with a branch of the pitch shifting system to allow for more control of the alt tunings besides from the patch data.

 

I do think it would theoretically be possible to still allow the custom pitch function to work on the old Variaxes.

Since the patches on the HD can change the pitch, all you need to do is to have the HD override the pitch data on the patch your own with the custom pitch you have, and force this to happen each time you change your preset.

 

I understand that they want to try to sell the JTV with exclusive futures though.

[clay-man]

I think Phil and I are interpreting this question differently, based on what you mean by a workbench preset. The pod has no concept of things like guitar body, pickup styles, etc. that you can adjust using workbench. You can't select or modify those things using a pod. All it can do is tell the Variax which bank on the knob to select, and the few other things described above. The pod is not an alternative to workbench in terms of building Variax models, if that's what you are hoping.

 

Really? That's ridiculous. So it's just a midi controller for the Variax.

 

Why the heck am I hearing people say I can expand the patches with a POD when I bring up questions like "would you like more custom banks on your Variax"?

[TheRealZap]

you can use workbench with a pod HD...

BUT....

do not get the new x models... they will not work with the original workbench... (or any version of workbench for the time being)

 

but more or less the tone in the pod... will tell the variax which knob position to select... that's IT...

you independent of this... store whatever you want in whatever knob position....

 

it's not technically MORE presets...

but you can access the original unaltered models through the pod....

essentially doubling the number of accessible models.... (half of which you cannot alter)

[phil_m]

Why the heck am I hearing people say I can expand the patches with a POD when I bring up questions like "would you like more custom banks on your Variax"?

 

I feel like it's easier to grasp all these things once you've had the equipment in front of you. But to answer the question, you can kind of make it so it seems like you have more models available to you with the HD500 and the JTV compared to the original Variax and an X3L. Let's say you had three songs, and you wanted to use the Les Paul bridge model on all of them, however you also wanted different tunings for each song. On the original Variax, that would mean you'd need to create three custom models in Workbench and save them in available slots on the Variax. With the JTV, you wouldn't actually need to use Workbench at all to do this. You could do it the lazy man's way and simply turn the alternate tuning knob according (if you're using one of the preset tunings saved on the guitar), or you could set up three separate patches on the HD500 each with the tuning saved to patch along with forcing the Les Paul bridge model. In all three presets you'd be using the same model, or preset, on the JTV, but you'd have a custom tuning saved in the preset in the HD500. So in that sort of scenario, you could say that HD500 made it so you have condensed three Variax presets into one. I think that's probably why people say it expands the patches. It does simply because it means you don't need as many patches if what you're interested is alternate tuning.

[clay-man]

you can use workbench with a pod HD...

BUT....

do not get the new x models... they will not work with the original workbench... (or any version of workbench for the time being)

 

but more or less the tone in the pod... will tell the variax which knob position to select... that's IT...

you independent of this... store whatever you want in whatever knob position....

 

it's not technically MORE presets...

but you can access the original unaltered models through the pod....

essentially doubling the number of accessible models.... (half of which you cannot alter)

 

Original unaltered models, so basically I have the presets on my knob, and the presets on a default factory knob?

I was going to say, someone brought up the fact that one of the updates doesn't allow you to do something with the default presets/banks anymore.

[TheRealZap]

no... your presets are on the knob...

the only way to access the unaltered factory ones is by telling the pod to switch to it....

that's the hidden feature.

 

Original unaltered models, so basically I have the presets on my knob, and the presets on a default factory knob?

I was going to say, someone brought up the fact that one of the updates doesn't allow you to do something with the default presets/banks anymore.

[clay-man]

no... your presets are on the knob...

the only way to access the unaltered factory ones is by telling the pod to switch to it....

that's the hidden feature.

 

That's what I'm saying. But you're saying I can tell the POD to load default factory banks that would be on my actual knob if I left it default?

[TheRealZap]

yes exactly.... 

 

That's what I'm saying. But you're saying I can tell the POD to load default factory banks that would be on my actual knob if I left it default?

[clay-man]

Ok, everyone keeps telling me different things.

 

So I'll just load my knob with my custom guitars and use the POD for default models. Still very limiting.

[TheRealZap]

use the pod to select any model... from your custom ones to the factory ones...

 

you can only access the custom ones from the knob...

you can access ALL from the pod.

[clay-man]

Even when I replaced the ones on the knob that aren't on custom 1 and 2?

 

There are times when I wish to use a gretsch or p90 guitar, firebird, etc.

 

 

I feel like it's easier to grasp all these things once you've had the equipment in front of you. But to answer the question, you can kind of make it so it seems like you have more models available to you with the HD500 and the JTV compared to the original Variax and an X3L. Let's say you had three songs, and you wanted to use the Les Paul bridge model on all of them, however you also wanted different tunings for each song. On the original Variax, that would mean you'd need to create three custom models in Workbench and save them in available slots on the Variax. With the JTV, you wouldn't actually need to use Workbench at all to do this. You could do it the lazy man's way and simply turn the alternate tuning knob according (if you're using one of the preset tunings saved on the guitar), or you could set up three separate patches on the HD500 each with the tuning saved to patch along with forcing the Les Paul bridge model. In all three presets you'd be using the same model, or preset, on the JTV, but you'd have a custom tuning saved in the preset in the HD500. So in that sort of scenario, you could say that HD500 made it so you have condensed three Variax presets into one. I think that's probably why people say it expands the patches. It does simply because it means you don't need as many patches if what you're interested is alternate tuning.

 

I already knew this. It's one of the reasons why I think the JTV has an incredible edge over the original, even excluding the 2.0 update. I waste a LOT of spaces on my knob with the same model duplicated only for an alternate tuning of that model.

I could easily have probably twice as much models on a JTV than I do on my 600 if I didn't waste model knob banks for alt tunings.

[TheRealZap]

there are basically always 2 sets of models on the original variax...

the knob accesses one set the user set "u"

the factory set exists but can only be accessed via the pod "f"

 

when using the pod and setting it up to force the variax to pick a model, 

you can tell it to use either a "u" model or an "f" model

 

so yes you can access them all with a pod.

 

and you can do whatever you want to the "u" models. (alt tune/etc)

 

the "f" models, are what they are, and can be recalled as such via the pod... (can not be modified)

 

this applies to ALL models... in any bank custom or other.

 

Even when I replaced the ones on the knob that aren't on custom 1 and 2?

 

There are times when I wish to use a gretsch or p90 guitar, firebird, etc.

 

[clay-man]

Is the factory models from the POD or are you saying the Variax actually has virtually the models on the knob, and in the memory lies dormant the factory models?

[TheRealZap]

all variax models are in the variax... the pod will only just switch to it.

so yes... the factory presets are in the variax dormant.

i think there is a way to reset the guitar manually from the guitar... like hold down a button or whatnot...

they were there initially for that reason, at some point they allowed the pod to access them...

[clay-man]

all variax models are in the variax... the pod will only just switch to it.

so yes... the factory presets are in the variax dormant.

i think there is a way to reset the guitar manually from the guitar... like hold down a button or whatnot...

they were there initially for that reason, at some point they allowed the pod to access them...

 

I always wondered how to do that. I think it would be a nice idea.

 

I honestly think they should allow the POD to store custom patches, at least for the JTV, but I've always thought the Variax was very slow when doing that with Workbench, so I totally understand the limitation of doing that.