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patrick2099

May be been given a returned unit, when buying new, at Pittsburgh Guitar Center

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I just unboxed the Helix I bought, yesterday, at Guitar Center.  There are a few reasons I am wondering if this unit was actually brand new.

 

1) The plastic bags that units typically arrive in were all piled up inside the box

2) The cables were not tied

3) There were hairs on the top of the unit

4) There doesn't appear to be protective film on any of the screens.  I may need some help with this one.  Is the protective film very noticeable?  I don't won't to go digging around and cause a problem where none exists.  I was going to leave this film on until I decide whether or not to keep this.  Also, is there supposed to be protective film on the scribble strips or just the main screen?

5) There was a very small plastic baggie, with nothing in it.  What is supposed to be in that?

6) The EXP 1 EXP2 scribble strip had some small scratches on it.

7) The circular piece of tape, sealing the box, was cut

 

I'm going to fire this up, and see if everything works properly.  Thanks for the help.

 

 

(Edit:  I just watched an unboxing video.  There are definitely no protective films.)

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I can only compare what you received to what I received with my Helix I got when they first came out. I suppose things could have changed since then but that sounds like a previously opened unit by your description. Did you receive a hex wrench for adjusting the expression pedal and USB flash memory with the manual(if they still provide this)? The plastic protectors provided with new devices on screen and scribble strips when I purchased my Helix are pretty obvious, particularly on the screen. Bags piled up in the box and hair does not sound right. Do you have a dog? Doesn't necessarily mean there is anything wrong with your Helix but it does sound like maybe you got a returned item.

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It’s common practice among retailers who offer a return policy. Even if there’s nothing wrong with the device it can be returned simply because the buyer doesn’t want to keep it (buyer’s remorse, it isn’t exactly what they thought it was, etc.). As long as there’s no reason to think anything is wrong with it the retailer will simply put it back on the shelf as new. Happens everywhere.

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13 minutes ago, silverhead said:

It’s common practice among retailers who offer a return policy. Even if there’s nothing wrong with the device it can be returned simply because the buyer doesn’t want to keep it (buyer’s remorse, it isn’t exactly what they thought it was, etc.). As long as there’s no reason to think anything is wrong with it the retailer will simply put it back on the shelf as new. Happens everywhere.

 

Aren't those typically sold at a discount, as "Open Box", and not new items?

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17 minutes ago, silverhead said:

Happens everywhere.

 

Yes it does... but it shouldn't. If I'm buying something "new", then I have the reasonable expectation of being the first owner. Whether it works or not is irrelevant. I shouldn't have to accept something that's obviously already been pawed-at because of the retailer's chosen return policy. That's not my problem. It's their problem.

 

If their rules allow people to return stuff penalty-free, then that's a cost of doing business that they're voluntarily taking on. By all means re-sell it, but at an "open box" discounted price, and eat the loss. Otherwise they  just make people hate their business, and the next time they'll spend their money somewhere else. As if anyone needed another reason to not shop at GC...

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47 minutes ago, patrick2099 said:

I just unboxed the Helix I bought, yesterday, at Guitar Center.  There are a few reasons I am wondering if this unit was actually brand new.

 

1) The plastic bags that units typically arrive in were all piled up inside the box

2) The cables were not tied

3) There were hairs on the top of the unit

4) There doesn't appear to be protective film on any of the screens.  I may need some help with this one.  Is the protective film very noticeable?  I don't won't to go digging around and cause a problem where none exists.  I was going to leave this film on until I decide whether or not to keep this.  Also, is there supposed to be protective film on the scribble strips or just the main screen?

5) There was a very small plastic baggie, with nothing in it.  What is supposed to be in that?

6) The EXP 1 EXP2 scribble strip had some small scratches on it.

7) The circular piece of tape, sealing the box, was cut

 

I'm going to fire this up, and see if everything works properly.  Thanks for the help.

 

 

(Edit:  I just watched an unboxing video.  There are definitely no protective films.)

 

It was not new. Call the store manager and tell him that you're going to test it thoroughly and, on acceptance, expect an Open Box discount. OR, you can bring it back in trade for an actual NEW unit. If they prefer that you bring it back, be sure to get a discount for your trouble.

 

13 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Yes it does... but it shouldn't. If I'm buying something "new", then I have the reasonable expectation of being the first owner. Whether it works or not is irrelevant, and I shouldn't have to accept something that's obviously already been pawed at because of the retailer's chosen return policy. That's not my problem.

 

If their rules allow people to return stuff penalty-free, then that's a cost of doing business that they're voluntarily taking on. By all means re-sell it, but at an "open box" discounted price, and eat the loss. Otherwise you just make people hate your establishment, and the next time they'll spend their money somewhere else.

 

This. At the very least, they should have cleaned it and put it back in it's bags. This is the sort of carelessness that gets GC it's bad rep.

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@rd2rk, unfortunately, I live two hours from the nearest Guitar Center.  I bought the Helix in person, because I was trading in some gear.  I can't just ship it back, because I don't have the materials it would normally be packed in.  Other than the small scratches (which aren't very noticeable) and the lack of the protective films on the screens, I haven't been able to find anything wrong with it.  I called Line 6 and their very quick, helpful, and friendly support checked the serial number, to make sure it hadn't been registered.  It had not.  

 

I'm really not sure what to do.  I guess the best place to start is to email the list of what I found to the manager (and include the five hours it took to trade my gear in).  I have a bad feeling I'm going to be wasting my time and gas money, making another trip of two hours, each way.

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If you are able to register it with Line-6 and get the factory warranty, and you can't find anything wrong with it, I'd keep it. But be sure that you return to Guitar Center and tell the MANAGER what you found when you opened the box. Not that he really cares, but tell him anyway. I've had the same experience when ordering a "new" (Clarification -NEW means unopened to me) item from a major "Friend" chain (and it was not Sweetwater FYI).

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6 minutes ago, spikey said:

If you are able to register it with Line-6 and get the factory warranty, and you can't find anything wrong with it, I'd keep it. But be sure that you return to Guitar Center and tell the MANAGER what you found when you opened the box. Not that he really cares, but tell him anyway. I've had the same experience when ordering a "new" (Clarification -NEW means unopened to me) item from a major "Friend" chain (and it was not Sweetwater FYI).

 

 Spikey may be right about this.

 

BUT....it's been my experience with GC that some managers really DO care. This was a MONUMENTAL screw-up by his staff. The contents of a returned item's packaging should have been checked and the unit cleaned up for resale. Assuming you don't wait too long to call him, if you CALMLY explain the situation and logistics involved, he MAY give you a break.

 

Stranger things have happened......

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I emailed the manager, told him the situation (and also how I drove two hours, it took FIVE hours to process my trade-in, and I drove two hours home).  Hopefully they can either send me shipping materials, to send it back, or give me the open box discount.  I can't find that price on Guitar Center, but the open box discount on a Helix is $159.01.  If they give me that, I may just deal with the scratches and missing film.  If I do have to drive back, EVERYTHING is getting returned, including the rest of my order.

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Just FYI... I wasn’t advocating for the practice. Just saying it happens. I too disagree with it.

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I just received a call from Guitar Center, in Pittsburgh.  They are going to send me packaging material to send it back, and after receiving this one, they will send me a new one.  They offered an additional $100 off, to keep the one I have, but I'd rather have something with the plastic on the screens and without the scratches.  Still sucks that I'm going to have to go through this hassle, and then wait another 7-10 days, or so, to get my Helix, but at least they are trying to make it right. 

 

They are also supposedly going to start my 45 day trial from the date I receive a new one.

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8 minutes ago, patrick2099 said:

I just received a call from Guitar Center, in Pittsburgh.  They are going to send me packaging material to send it back, and after receiving this one, they will send me a new one.  They offered an additional $100 off, to keep the one I have, but I'd rather have something with the plastic on the screens and without the scratches.  Still sucks that I'm going to have to go through this hassle, and then wait another 7-10 days, or so, to get my Helix, but at least they are trying to make it right. 

 

They are also supposedly going to start my 45 day trial from the date I receive a new one.

 

Nice! That's the way it should be. They were playing the odds that you either wouldn't notice that it was scratched and covered in pet hair (though how that could escape anyone's attention is beyond me, lol) or just wouldn't want to go through the hassle of returning it. People getting taken advantage of really chaps my a$$, but you didn't just let it happen. You should get what you pay for. Well done.

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6 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Nice! That's the way it should be. They were playing the odds that you either wouldn't notice that it was scratched and covered in pet hair (though how that could escape anyone's attention is beyond me, lol) or just wouldn't want to go through the hassle of returning it. People getting taken advantage of really chaps my a$$, but you didn't just let it happen. You should get what you pay for. Well done.

 

Thanks.  According to the manager, who took the responsibility as the one who grabbed it, it was mixed in with all of the actual new units.  I'm sure people try to scam them as much as they try to scam us, so at least he didn't give me a hassle.  He was probably surprised that I would rather have the new one (and all the hassle) than the $100 off.  I know that, more likely than not, other than the scratches, the unit was fine.  I just don't know for sure why it was returned, and I would probably get more than $100 worth of worries over why it was returned.  

 

I did get a chance to test it out, through my XiTone MBritt powered cab, and it sounded really good -- even with my only experience being a few hours in the Helix Native trial. SO much easier to dial in a good sound than the HD500x.  They really need to update the firmware on the in-store model (because a lot of people wouldn't do the high and low cuts on the cab), and run it through a nice FRFR.  Had I tried the in-store test Helix, without knowing what I knew from the Kemper and Helix Native (and how Helix Native sounded on my gear), I probably wouldn't have bought it.  

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4 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Yes it does... but it shouldn't. If I'm buying something "new", then I have the reasonable expectation of being the first owner. Whether it works or not is irrelevant. I shouldn't have to accept something that's obviously already been pawed-at because of the retailer's chosen return policy. That's not my problem. It's their problem.

 

If their rules allow people to return stuff penalty-free, then that's a cost of doing business that they're voluntarily taking on. By all means re-sell it, but at an "open box" discounted price, and eat the loss. Otherwise they  just make people hate their business, and the next time they'll spend their money somewhere else. As if anyone needed another reason to not shop at GC...

 

Good helpful advice to GC there in paragraph two. Repackaging and selling open/used items as new is loathsome and has caused me no end of consternation when I have been on the receiving end of it.

 

4 hours ago, silverhead said:

It’s common practice among retailers who offer a return policy. Even if there’s nothing wrong with the device it can be returned simply because the buyer doesn’t want to keep it (buyer’s remorse, it isn’t exactly what they thought it was, etc.). As long as there’s no reason to think anything is wrong with it the retailer will simply put it back on the shelf as new. Happens everywhere.

 

I have received open box items being sold as new from multiple otherwise relatively "reputable" vendors. Unfortunately no one retailer has a monopoly on this practice. I don't think this is exclusive to GC and although it could be argued that GC has put some smaller brick & mortar shops out of business I like having at least one large brick and mortar store around as they are all at risk of closing from online sales. I also think GC's forty-five day return policy is more than fair so they get some props for that. Competition also helps keep prices down so the more the merrier.

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21 hours ago, HonestOpinion said:

 

Good helpful advice to GC there in paragraph two. Repackaging and selling open/used items as new is loathsome and has caused me no end of consternation when I have been on the receiving end of it.

 

 

I have received open box items being sold as new from multiple otherwise relatively "reputable" vendors. Unfortunately no one retailer has a monopoly on this practice. I don't think this is exclusive to GC and although it could be argued that GC has put some smaller brick & mortar shops out of business I like having at least one large brick and mortar store around as they are all at risk of closing from online sales. I also think GC's forty-five day return policy is more than fair so they get some props for that. Competition also helps keep prices down so the more the merrier.

 

It is a shame that there aren't as many brick and mortar stores, because of the competition from big online retailers.  If I can get something for no more than 15% more than I can get it online, I would rather give my money to a local business.  Other than some nice acoustics, though, it is hard to find mid-grade or higher end gear near me, since I don't live in a highly populated area.  I either have to drive two hours or order online, for most of the gear I buy.  One of the few decent shops around me, that does have some nice gear, is probably going to be closing soon.  It's really sad.

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Large brick & mortar stores like GC will almost always price match an online dealer. However, you stlll have to add sales tax which, depending on your state, you're legally required to pay at tax time anyway if you buy online.

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19 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Large brick & mortar stores like GC will almost always price match an online dealer. However, you stlll have to add sales tax which, depending on your state, you're legally required to pay at tax time anyway if you buy online.

 

What the Manager of GC here does not like to do is lower the items price with the sales tax cost "included" on the unit/item to the matched price. I ordered the same thing out of state and because of those few 10s of dollars and GC (the manager) lost a sale. I'm sure he didn't go home and lose sleep over it (neither did I), but money is still money and that was still a stupid move on his part IMHO (and you just can't fix that).  ; ) 

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25 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Large brick & mortar stores like GC will almost always price match an online dealer. However, you stlll have to add sales tax which, depending on your state, you're legally required to pay at tax time anyway if you buy online.

 

I'm not sure if it is different, state by state, but anything I purchase online seems to have tax added (Music shops, Amazon, Steam, etc.).

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2 minutes ago, spikey said:

 

What the Manager of GC here does not like to do is lower the items price with the sales tax cost "included" on the unit/item to the matched price. I ordered the same thing out of state and because of those few 10s of dollars and GC (the manager) lost a sale. I'm sure he didn't go home and lose sleep over it (neither did I), but money is still money and that was still a stupid move on his part IMHO (and you just can't fix that).  ; ) 

 

If he's price matching, he's probably assuming that you'll be paying that tax on your online purchase. Further lowering the price by eating the tax gives you a BETTER price than online. He's not losing sleep because he's laughing at the guy who assumes he'll never be audited for unpaid taxes on their online purchases.

 

Unless, as I said, you're living in a state that doesn't (yet) require that you pay those taxes.........

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2 minutes ago, patrick2099 said:

 

I'm not sure if it is different, state by state, but anything I purchase online seems to have tax added (Music shops, Amazon, Steam, etc.).

 

I'm not sure how it works. Some online vendors add tax, some don't. I think it's moving towards standardizing on vendors charging the tax (as it should be IMO), but compliance deadlines may vary by state. IDK. Politics probably. It's not a big deal to implement in software, I was doing it in 1998 in SW I wrote for a small company that rented vacation properties nationally. Unless of course the SW was poorly written in the first place, not allowing for mods.

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20 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

 

I'm not sure how it works. Some online vendors add tax, some don't. I think it's moving towards standardizing on vendors charging the tax (as it should be IMO), but compliance deadlines may vary by state. IDK. Politics probably. It's not a big deal to implement in software, I was doing it in 1998 in SW I wrote for a small company that rented vacation properties nationally. Unless of course the SW was poorly written in the first place, not allowing for mods.

 

Generally I think the way it works is that the company, not the individual is on the hook for collecting state sales taxes. For many states unless the online company has a brick and mortar location within the state where the purchase is being made from, the company does not have to pay state taxes. Amazon is a good example of this. That is why for example if you have a Guitar Center in your state there is a good chance that even if you order from them online you will be charged tax when you check out. I think eventually you are right though, at the state and/or maybe even the federal level there may be a move to a model where an online tax is always charged. Then the trick becomes how to collect from multinationals who are set up outside the country.

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35 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Further lowering the price by eating the tax gives you a BETTER price than online.

 

No, it doesn't. It gives me the same price as online. He just loses the tax dollars as his profit because he can claim he sold it for "what-ever" he rings into the register. ; )

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Folks bad mouth GC, but I've had good luck there. You need to know what you want and know how to support yourself, the prices are decent, the selection is decent. I've also had good luck getting lightly used stuff for cheap from their website (which has a good used selection) ... they will ship it to your local store (you pay shipping, which is cheap) and you can return the item if you don't like it. Still, I prefer to support the smaller, independently owned shops, who will usually match GC prices. And ... I buy (and sell) a lot of gear via craigslist.

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Welp, I'm not paying tax on music gear unless I have to. And since I don't have to I save that money otherwise spent at the local GC. If they don't want to eat that tax money by cutting into their item for sale that priced 3 times what they paid for it, that's on them. ; )

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9 minutes ago, spikey said:

 

No, it doesn't. It gives me the same price as online. He just loses the tax dollars as his profit because he can claim he sold it for "what-ever" he rings into the register. ; )

 

Like I said, unless your state doesn't require you to declare untaxed online purchases (Colorado does require that), you're still going to have to pay that tax or risk audit.

Also, I didn't know you were a socialist who believes that he has the right to determine someone else's profit margin.

There's a pretty good article over on Harmony Central that summarizes just how much it costs to run a brick and mortar store, and how slim the margins really are.

 

EDIT: and while I know it's hard to believe, there ARE honest businesses and business-people.

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2 hours ago, HonestOpinion said:

For many states unless the online company has a brick and mortar location within the state where the purchase is being made from, the company does not have to pay state taxes.

 

The Supreme Court did away with the "physical presence" thing last year, which had been based on some old decision regarding interstate commerce, from long before the internet as we know it existed. It took a while for it to get up and running, and there are probably some smaller online businesses still flying under the radar that are not collecting sales tax and remitting it to the state(s) their customers reside in, but any large online retailers with nationwide reach have no choice now. The bean counters know who they are, and eventually they'll start coming after any big dollar businesses that ain't collecting for The Man. I started noticing it months ago when Dollar Shave Club suddenly started charging sales tax (at precisely my local rate, I did the math, lol). Shortly after, they sent out a rather apologetic email explaining that they had no choice. Now it's pretty much everybody, no matter what I'm buying, or where it's coming from. Shopping online still has the convenience of not having to get off the couch, but the tax savings are essentially gone.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/greatspeculations/2018/06/26/dissecting-supreme-courts-internet-sales-tax-decision/#6902d3343fbe

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2 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Also, I didn't know you were a socialist who believes that he has the right to determine someone else's profit margin.

 

I'm not a socialist. Never been one either. Unlike some, I'm just not stupid with my money. ; ) You see, I'm only concerned about what I spend, not what they make. If that's your idea of socialism then so be it. Perhaps you are a bit naive if you think they don't make a huge profit one everything they sell, as they are in the business of making money (what businesses do) and can not do so without charging YOU waaayyyyy more than they paid for it, and THEN, telling you they must also charge tax too because the state makes them. They just don't have any choice... LOL, what a load of BS. They can and do manipulate that register in any way they see fit because I've seen them do it for "me". I personally don't have a problem with paying what something is worth to me, but I also know you can trust them about as far as you can throw them money-wise, and they are NOT there to make you rich.  Other way around, and that's ok as "long as you know it". But hey If you want to pay them more please be my guest. No skin off my nose and more power to ya. I'm sure GC and the like will thank you all the way to the bank. Also, notice that I didn't call you pretentious for quickly assuming and judging me. ; )

 

 

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3 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

The Supreme Court did away with the "physical presence" thing last year, which had been based on some old decision regarding interstate commerce from long before the internet as we know it existed. It took a while for it to get up and running, and there are probably some smaller online businesses still flying under the radar that are not collecting sales tax and remitting it to the state(s) their customers reside in, but any large online retailers with nationwide reach have no choice now. The bean counters know who they are, and eventually they'll start coming after any big dollar businesses that ain't collecting for The Man. I started noticing it months ago when Dollar Shave Club suddenly started charging sales tax. Shortly after, they sent out a rather apologetic email explaining that they had no choice. Now it's pretty much everybody, no matter what I'm buying, or where it's coming from. Shopping online still has the convenience of not having to get off the couch, but the tax savings are essentially gone.

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/greatspeculations/2018/06/26/dissecting-supreme-courts-internet-sales-tax-decision/#6902d3343fbe

 

Interesting, I read up on the decision and it essentially as you indicated gets rid of the requirement for brick & mortar and gives each state the discretion to impose a tax on "remote" sellers and as a result the buyers as that cost will inevitably be passed on to them. This has yet to be imposed in many states but it looks like they can do it now if they want to, regardless of whether or not the online seller has a physical presence in their state, which the old precedent required.  I know there are still plenty of online orders I make that do not collect tax explicitly (no tax fee listed) although perhaps some online sellers are paying taxes in some form or another to their state anyway.

 

Worth noting that the court was debating how best to exempt or minimize the expense imposed by potentially fifty different states, with different tax structures, requiring a small online retailer to collect, administer, and pay each state the correct taxes. Really drives up the annual accountant fees. For a tiny online retailer selling wax candles out of a garage in Berkley those administrative fees can be an undue burden on the business and a "barrier to interstate commerce".

 

Much as I love being able to order online and not have to pay a sales tax it has always struck me as a bit of an unfair competitive advantage over the brick and mortar stores who are required to pay state tax in most states. In the past the shipping and handling fees could be a bit of an equalizer but with  new efficiencies, automation, and inexpensive shipping that has long since ceased to be the case. As Spikey referred to earlier for a Guitar Center to be competitive on price they now have to not only match the price of an online retailer but beat it by enough to account for the tax.

 

Btw, this is the first link that floats to the top in a Google search on the topic. Search engine precedence rules producing old news to push product for Intuit but it lays out the law as it was until recently.  https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tips/self-employment-taxes/sales-tax-101-for-online-sellers/L4uTQCaIx

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If you play the game like Sweetwater and Musicians Friend do, you then can compete. If you choose not to then you can more than likely live off of the Sears crowd for a while, but you will eventually fold. It's not personal, but it is cut throat business where only the ones with the best products at the most competitive (cheapest) price survives. And now with the "0" interest monthly payment plan Zzounds and others offer, I think the local Music stores may go the way of the dinosaur sooner rather than later.

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1 hour ago, spikey said:

Also, notice that I didn't call you pretentious for quickly assuming and judging me.

 

I don't need to judge you. Your rant said everything about you that needs to be said. Justify yourself anyway you like. Do I need to remind you that it was only a couple of years ago that everyone was speculating on how long it would be before GC was in bankruptcy? Did you read the article I referenced? No, you didn't even look for it, because you don't care about anything but what YOU want. If anyone dared tell you that your work wasn't worth a third what you were asking you'd pitch a fit. It's a really safe bet in some circles to make whatever claims against the filthy capitalists that it takes to justify taking whatever you want to take from them. Smash that window and TAKE that TV! Filthy capitalists don't even pay their fair share of taxes! But isn't this you trying to justify not paying your fair share? Oh, wait, that's just me, being pretentious.

 

Nobody likes paying taxes. Everybody wants the best deal they can get. The world would be a better place if all capitalists were ethical in their business practices. It would also be a better place if consumers understood that their jobs depend on their employer's profits, and that one man's rip-off capitalist is possibly his neighbor's employer.

 

"Everybody wants to go to heaven, but nobody wants to die...."

 

And that's my rant for today!

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5 hours ago, rd2rk said:

No, you didn't even look for it, because you don't care about anything but what YOU want.

 

LOL yea I guess your right, about mostly all of us in here including you.

 
 
 
 
5 hours ago, rd2rk said:

The world would be a better place if all capitalists were ethical in their business practices. Smash that window and TAKE that TV! Filthy capitalists don't even pay their fair share of taxes!  Smash that window and TAKE that TV! Filthy capitalists don't even pay their fair share of taxes!

Without getting into a whole nother reason I strongly disagree with those statements, the simple fact is getting the best deal you can is not stealing. Nope, I don't steal a thing when saving money on a sweet deal. Hey, you like GC that's kewl, as lots of people do. I don't "dislike" them either, just one manager that works there is a jerk, but he (and maybe you) probably thinks the same about me. LOL and thats OK too. Peace Brother ; )

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3 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

Guesswork aside, NY sure as hell has taken advantage of it... which is not exactly a shock. I figure our benevolent despots up in Albany are probably not more than 1 or 2 state budgets away from taxing air in this miserable sewer...

 

I grew up on Staten Island. When the pollution from NJ blows in across the dumps on the Kill Van Kull.......

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4 hours ago, spikey said:

LOL yea I guess your right, about mostly all of us in here including you.

 

Some of us are just more vocal about it than others ;-)

 

4 hours ago, spikey said:

 Without getting into a whole nother reason I strongly disagree with those statements, the simple fact is getting the best deal you can is not stealing. Nope, I don't steal a thing when saving money on a sweet deal. Hey, you like GC that's kewl, as lots of people do. I don't "dislike" them either, just one manager that works there is a jerk, but he (and maybe you) probably thinks the same about me. LOL and thats OK too. Peace Brother ; )

 

I'm not sure what you strongly disagree with here. That the world would be a better place if all capitalists were ethical? Or that I compared it to the ignorance and hypocrisy of consumers regarding basic economics? The "smash and grab" reference was, admittedly, hyperbole. It was late and I was cranky. But surely, you can't deny that MANY people have that attitude in some degree or other?

 

Obviously, this is the point where we should "agree to disagree" and get on with our lives. Peace! :-)

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On 8/5/2019 at 4:08 PM, silverhead said:

It’s common practice among retailers who offer a return policy. Even if there’s nothing wrong with the device it can be returned simply because the buyer doesn’t want to keep it (buyer’s remorse, it isn’t exactly what they thought it was, etc.). As long as there’s no reason to think anything is wrong with it the retailer will simply put it back on the shelf as new. Happens everywhere.

My local GC sells all that stuff as open-box for a slight discount. Selling you a returned unit as new, even if the previous owner never opened the box, is shady AF. My Helix came with a hex wrench, USB manual, and there was definitely protective film on the main screen because I left it on there till it started to peel off. Definitely return it for an unopened item if you're able. If the salesman gives you grief, talk to the supervisor. The last time GC tried to lollipop me around (bought a used amp that was "tested in excellent working order" from a store in a different state and when it arrived at my local store the speakers were non-functional and half the amp output wasn't working, then the out-of-state store tried to say I intentionally damaged the item IN THE GUITAR CENTER I PICKED IT UP AT) I emailed corporate and they sent me a $500 gift card. 

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Apparently the manager "getting this taken care of as soon as he got in, yesterday, and calling me afterwards" really meant, they will start working on it today, when I called to check on the situation.  The manager "was busy yesterday".  That is completely unacceptable.  I have already submitted feedback, on the Guitar Center site.  Hopefully someone actually reads it and gets back to me.

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30 minutes ago, patrick2099 said:

Apparently the manager "getting this taken care of as soon as he got in, yesterday, and calling me afterwards" really meant, they will start working on it today, when I called to check on the situation.  The manager "was busy yesterday".  That is completely unacceptable.  I have already submitted feedback, on the Guitar Center site.  Hopefully someone actually reads it and gets back to me.

 

Even when they try to make something right, they wind up kicking themselves in the butt!

I worked at GC SF for 6 months in the early 1980's. They had 3 managers in that time, and one of the assistant managers was arrested for stealing.

Very sad!

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Yep. Had the dude simply done what he said, on the original call, I would have left it alone. Mistakes happen. It's how you deal with the mistakes that matter, to me. Hell, had I not called, it may have been next week, before my packing materials even shipped. I hate to sound like I'm being a jerk over something so little, but I'm really irritated by this whole experience. 

 

Now, since they DIDN'T do what they said, they have a store complaint, a bad review, and a Better Business Bureau complaint to deal with. If it's going to be a hassle for me, it's going to be a hassle for everyone. 

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8 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Well somes states might not be pursuing the collection of sales tax from out of state merchants,  but now that they can, for the life of me I don't understand why they wouldn't. It's free money, and come the spring budget-passing season, when the a$$holes are in bloom, they're all crying poverty. Plus, in this case they don't have to actually "do" anything except yell "Gimme!", and wait for the checks to show up. The burden is entirely on the retailers...

 

It remains to be seen how much of a benefit this might be to local businesses. My guess is not much... that's just the "we care about the little guy" excuse they used to squeeze this decision from The Nine. Amazon will eventually put everybody out of business with or without sales tax, unless the govt pulls another "Ma Bell", and takes them apart. Recently I was looking for a bluetooth com unit for a motorcycle helmet...$289 everywhere I looked on the web, and in local bike shops. Identical unit on Amazon, $229... guess where I shopped. Either way, the undisputed winners here are state treasuries...what a surprise. 

 

Guesswork aside, NY sure as hell has taken advantage of it... which is not exactly a shock. I figure our benevolent despots up in Albany are probably not more than 1 or 2 state budgets away from taxing air in this miserable sewer...

 

I end up ordering off Amazon all the time as well but Amazon, the largest company in the world in market value, apparently managed to avoid paying any taxes at all last year; you can dump a lot of product on the market inexpensively with a dodge like that.

 

You're right. Why wouldn't every state in the union ultimately take advantage of this Supreme Court decision?   Prima facie you would think for simplicity's sake why not just have one state, the one the online company operates out of or is incorporated in collect the state tax. This is problematic though in a variety of ways. With a single state tax collection model all sales from around the country accrue to just the state with the online retailer. It is also all too easy I guess for an online company to incorporate in a state like Delaware with no state tax . Alternatively states that want to attract online company jobs simply woo these companies by exempting them from normal state taxes.

 

Another approach to simplify things would be to have taxes on online sales be collected once federally and then divvied up among the states but I suspect that would not go well. There would be internecine battles between the states where the wealthier states who spend more online would claim that they deserve the lion's share of the split. Federal level taxation would be incredibly sticky and it would insert a layer of administrative cost between the states and their tax money.

 

The question again also becomes how do you prevent large online companies who could now theoretically be taxed by all fifty states from picking up and moving offshore.  This is probably at least in part the motivation for giving companies like Amazon such a huge tax break. How do you effectively collect tax from a company not within your borders or legal system.

 

Surprising to some extent that this long into the online retailing revolution we are still wrestling with these taxation issues and the rules are still changing.

 

Lastly there are the anti-tax libertarians jumping into the fray saying all taxes are fascism :-)  I don't feel that way but I know there are those that do.

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