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aim2plz75

dialing in tones

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Hi people! I am looking for recommendations(what works for you!) in dialing in tones. Ex: I use headphones for creating a tone and it sounds very different when it`s gig time. Do I need certain headphones, home speakers, etc. What will keep consistence from dialing in tones to FOH. Thanks!
 

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If you used an amp and pedals, how would you dial in your tones? Likely by turning up the amp close to stage volume and adjusting everything until it sounds best.

 

It is no different with a Helix. When possible, plug into the same or similar setup you would use live (I know with PA's this becomes impractical) and setup your tones at "gig volume" or as close as possible to it. 

 

FWIW... this is my method. 

  1. I have a home studio, with two sets of speakers  (I A/B the speakers, I never play them both at the same time)
    • Studio grade 6.5" near field monitors
    • Consumer grade 3 ways speakers with a 10" woofer, mid and tweeter
  2. I monitor my Helix at about 85db... this takes the Fletcher Munson curve out of play which is critical to setting up tones. 
    • re: Fletcher Munson! If you monitor too quietly you are likely to increase the highs and lows to make it sound artificially louder... this often results in a "boomy, tinny & thin"  tone that disappears on a stage with the rest of the band
  3. I dial up my tones to sounds really good on each set of speakers
  4. I put on some music that I can play along with, in the style the tone was setup for - this allows me to hear the tone "in context"...
  5. Tweak tone a little as needed. If I need to drastically alter the tone, I return to step 3 to make sure it still sounds good on it's own, through each set of speakers.

The tone I end up with goes direct to console. I always tell techs to start with a FLAT strip and adjust as they desire... the majority of techs never touch the EQ after setting it flat.. it's been that reliable. 

 

 

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I go a step further than codamedia in that my setup at home for dialing in patches very closely simulates what I'll get from a PA or decent stage monitor in that I use a Yamaha DXR12 as my  home speaker standing vertically at about chest height.  I play at roughly stage volume to avoid Fletcher Munson problems and I have a laptop attached to the Helix that allows me to play the reference material so I can dial in the tone to match on my Helix.  This has been my home rig for over 4 years now and it's never failed to produce the same sound live as I get at home.

frankenstein sound lab (small).jpg

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Good advice above.

 

I recommend you  look at the discussions and youtube videos about setting the level for your Helix output xlr or 1/4. I have my XLR output set to max by not being  effected by the big output knob.  I allow the big knob to adjust my 1/4 for backline adjustment.   Also read up on gain staging so that you don't end up with digital clipping.   Essentially, you don't want to push the input of your amp models too high.  It can sound muddy, harsh, or clip weirdly.

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Posted (edited)

I use my powered wedge, which gets me about 90% dialed in to how our PA sounds....after I hear it through the main system I'll make some minor tweaks.  Gain wise, EQ wise, feel wise...whatever needs to be done.  

 

Once I have some good Core Reference tones done up, next times I create new presets, I use the core tones and copy them over....using headphones I adjust what I need....but I compensate knowing my headphones aren't a great replication of our PA.  So I don't tweak by my ear, I use my eyes/brain to know that "hey this sounds bassy/muffled in my headphones, but I know when put through the main system it'll clean up"  vs dialing it in perfect in my headphones then once its on the main system its overly bright/thin sounding. 

 

Edited: I also do what Bob suggests and disable my Big Volume Knob from signal going to the board.  that way I'm sending a consistent signal to the board and the gain structuring of my signal once it leaves my hands is consistent.

Edited by themetallikid
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5 hours ago, bobcoss said:

I have my XLR output set to max by not being  effected by the big output knob

 

5 hours ago, themetallikid said:

I also do what Bob suggests and disable my Big Volume Knob from signal going to the board.  that way I'm sending a consistent signal to the board and the gain structuring of my signal once it leaves my hands is consistent.

 

+1 to both statements above. I also do this with my LT. 

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