Helix to FOH - DI Box or Hum Eliminator

[kevin627]

I use my Helix for guitar and vocals. At home I usually have no issues but when plugging into a mixer hooked up to a large PA system is when I run into issues.

I find that playing at different venues, going straight from the Helix has a host of problems (humming, buzzing, hissing, etc) even when using the XLR outs and trying both positions in the ground lift switch. I’ve been using a dbx DJDI box which generally has worked well at getting rid of issues. I run the 1/4” outs to the DJDI and then XLR from the DJDI to the board. I know, if everything is working, why make any changes right. 
 

I recently played a gig at a small venue where I was just doing vocals, so I had a stereo vocal patch set up that I’ve used before. The venue just had a Yamaha Stagepass 600 and the XLR inputs on the mixer don’t have a pan knob,  but it does have stereo TS inputs. So I ran 1/4” outs from the Helix to the TS inputs at line level, wow did that sound awful (I get it, it’s an unbalanced hot signal, anything can happen).

 

My question, if I get something like an ART DTI will I be able to safely use the 1/4” and XLR outputs without worrying too much about noise? Or are there some applications where a DI box will work better. I figure the Helix already has a ground lift switch so the ground lift switch on a DI box is redundant? Does it make sense to switch to a hum eliminator with 1/4” and XLR outs? Or is a DI box  safer bet? As I understand both will block phantom power from the board. Thanks in advance.
 

 

[rvroberts]

I've been using my Helix for a good 2 years, and never had an issue with him that the ground lift hasn't fixed. No DI - ever. 

So - what's different for you?

First, I'm in Australia, and our power is generally better. Earth concerns are much better. 

But I doubt that the real issue. 

First thing to check is Phantom power on the mixer. Helix hates that. 

Next is cables. I'm betting you have done all that?

I assume you understand earth loops and try to keep your power clean?

Short of that, it's your Helix that we have to suspect. 

If you can try yours against another, that might help find the issue. 

 

 

[kevin627]

19 minutes ago, rvroberts said:

I've been using my Helix for a good 2 years, and never had an issue with him that the ground lift hasn't fixed. No DI - ever. 

So - what's different for you?

First, I'm in Australia, and our power is generally better. Earth concerns are much better. 

But I doubt that the real issue. 

First thing to check is Phantom power on the mixer. Helix hates that. 

Next is cables. I'm betting you have done all that?

I assume you understand earth loops and try to keep your power clean?

Short of that, it's your Helix that we have to suspect. 

If you can try yours against another, that might help find the issue. 

 

 

 

Thanks for the quick reply. I'm in Singapore, not sure how the power in Singapore compares to the power in Australia.

 

I've had issues even when I verify myself that phantom power is off on the channel. I have had instances where we tried 3-4 different cables, and the issue persists. Yes I work as an engineer at a studio part time so I have some experience troubleshooting pesky issues like this.

 

I also considered that it may be my Helix, but 1) I generally have no issue, it's only in some venues, and 2) I've seen enough posts on the forum with people saying that they need to use a DI box to reduce some sort of noise/hum issue situationally. Before I got the DI box, I was fine 90% of the time so it seems that the issue is not likely my Helix. Unfortunately I don't know anyone else with a Helix here to A/B against in the event that I can replicate the issue.

 

One possible explanation is that some of the "less professional" venues that I play may be less aware of issues that cause noise/hum and there is some interaction between my setup and their setup that causes the noise. A DI box generally has solved the problem for me, but again if I use 1/4" cables, it's hit or miss. Looking for a solution where it doesn't matter what I run into at a venue, noise/hum issues will not be because of my setup.

 

Edit: Note that I realize that 1/4" cables might have issues regardless. Also, I play venues that are not able to activate/deactivate phantom power on each channel, so I would need something that blocks phantom power either way. Thanks.

[MusicLaw]

A DI box may be the best solution. Nonetheless, another possible solution could be an in Line Phantom Power Eliminator. Sescom and Triton Audio make them. These are small, inexpensive and allow you to use XLR cables with confidence that any input strip of the console which may still have Phantom Power enabled will not degrade the audio coming from your Helix. B&H Video's page and probably Amazon show the unit's details.   Pyle also offers a PHE400 Box, which you can find on Amazon and B&H. 

[codamedia]

I'm in Canada and have not encountered any hum issues that couldn't be fixed with the ground control. I have a pair of home made phantom power blockers... (although I usually only use MONO output on a live gig) but I don't think that has anything to do with helping in the hum department.