Fishman amp in front of Helix

[3leggedbrain]

Hi,

I'm having a hard time finding clear information on this as a potential option. I want to know if it's possible to interface with my helix in such a manner:

 

Acoustic guitar --> Fishman amp input

Fishman amp FX out --> Helix Return

Helix Send --> Fishman FX return

 

(This is so I can make use of delay, reverb, etc. from the helix)

 

Then I can have my electric guitar going into the guitar input of my helix, and switch between guitars without having to switch out cables during a performance. Is this possible?

 

Thanks,
Brian

[rd2rk]

Even simpler:

 

Acoustic guitar --> Fishman amp input

Fishman amp FX out --> Helix Input

Helix Output --> Fishman FX return

 

In Global Settings set Helix I/O to the level required by Fishman send/return (probably Instrument), No FX block required, Helix return level adjustable with Helix Volume knob.

[3leggedbrain]

Thanks for the reply!

That's good to know that particular setup is an option, thanks.

Will the setup I mentioned also work? Because my hope is to switch effortlessly between my electric guitar and acoustic guitar without having to unplug anything on stage--I would need only switch between patches.

[rd2rk]

29 minutes ago, 3leggedbrain said:

Thanks for the reply!

That's good to know that particular setup is an option, thanks.

Will the setup I mentioned also work? Because my hope is to switch effortlessly between my electric guitar and acoustic guitar without having to unplug anything on stage--I would need only switch between patches.

 

Having re-read your OP, your idea is better. I just tried it with my amp.

I've attached two sample presets to demo how I set it up.

The acoustic preset has the Input Block set to MIC (unused, Variax would also work) to prevent any possible noise from the electric bleeding in.

Since you're not plugging anything into the XLR or 1/4" Outputs there's no need to do anything to the Output Blocks.

AcoustaFish.hlx

Electrafish.hlx

[hideout]

27 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

 

Having re-read your OP, your idea is better. I just tried it with my amp.

I've attached two sample presets to demo how I set it up.

The acoustic preset has the Input Block set to MIC (unused, Variax would also work) to prevent any possible noise from the electric bleeding in.

Since you're not plugging anything into the XLR or 1/4" Outputs there's no need to do anything to the Output Blocks.

AcoustaFish.hlx

Electrafish.hlx

Or you could go,

Acoustic Guitar > Helix Input

Helix FX Send > Fishman Input

Fishman FX Send > Helix FX Return

Helix Ouput > Fishman FX Return.

In this way, you can place the Fishman's preamp anywhere in the Helix's signal chain.

[rd2rk]

10 minutes ago, hideout said:

Or you could go,

Acoustic Guitar > Helix Input

Helix FX Send > Fishman Input

Fishman FX Send > Helix FX Return

Helix Ouput > Fishman FX Return.

In this way, you can place the Fishman's preamp anywhere in the Helix's signal chain.

 

He wants to just jump between acoustic and electric without cable swapping. That means acoustic into the Fishman Input, Electric into Helix input.

He could work that with an A/B box for the guitars, but that adds another gadget, six cables instead of four.

[Kilrahi]

3 hours ago, rd2rk said:

 

He wants to just jump between acoustic and electric without cable swapping. That means acoustic into the Fishman Input, Electric into Helix input.

He could work that with an A/B box for the guitars, but that adds another gadget, six cables instead of four.

 

I dunno. I still prefer his way because I'd rather keep all the control possible in one place and retain the most functionality.

 

He's still got an unused FX return. Connect the acoustic to it, use snapshots to switch between two guitars in a preset, or if each preset is too complex I guess switch patches, but he'd have to do that anyway.

 

[rd2rk]

2 hours ago, Kilrahi said:

 

I dunno. I still prefer his way because I'd rather keep all the control possible in one place and retain the most functionality.

 

He's still got an unused FX return. Connect the acoustic to it, use snapshots to switch between two guitars in a preset, or if each preset is too complex I guess switch patches, but he'd have to do that anyway.

 

 

So many ways to skin this cat......

[hideout]

3 hours ago, rd2rk said:

 

So many ways to skin this cat......

And therein lies the beauty of the Helix. 
oh and don’t forget about the Helix’s Aux Input. Plug the acoustic guitar there. 

[3leggedbrain]

Thanks, guys!!! I really appreciate the help. Going to give these a try.

 

-Brian

[es345tds]

On 10/29/2019 at 4:54 AM, hideout said:

And therein lies the beauty of the Helix. 
oh and don’t forget about the Helix’s Aux Input. Plug the acoustic guitar there. 

 

I was wondering why no one was talking about the aux input. Is there something about the aux that I'm missing?

[hideout]

On 11/9/2019 at 1:53 PM, es345tds said:

 

I was wondering why no one was talking about the aux input. Is there something about the aux that I'm missing?

I think it’s just something that’s easily ignored. 

[rd2rk]

On 11/9/2019 at 2:53 PM, es345tds said:

 

I was wondering why no one was talking about the aux input. Is there something about the aux that I'm missing?

 

The input impedance of the AUX in is not adjustable, and it is intended for use with active pickups. You could run the Fishman into it, but it's only available on an Input Block. IOW, you can't just pop it in anywhere in the signal path like you can with a Return Block.

[HonestOpinion]

On 10/28/2019 at 6:52 PM, 3leggedbrain said:

Hi,

I'm having a hard time finding clear information on this as a potential option. I want to know if it's possible to interface with my helix in such a manner:

 

Acoustic guitar --> Fishman amp input

Fishman amp FX out --> Helix Return

Helix Send --> Fishman FX return

 

(This is so I can make use of delay, reverb, etc. from the helix)

 

Then I can have my electric guitar going into the guitar input of my helix, and switch between guitars without having to switch out cables during a performance. Is this possible?

 

Thanks,
Brian

 

Pretty much what hideout said, what am I missing here. Looks like you essentially want a 4CM setup. Why not just go 4CM into the Fishman from the Helix, with the electric guitar in the Helix's 'Guitar In'  and the acoustic in the Helix's 'Aux In'. If you don't want to use the Helix's 'Aux In' for your acoustic guitar you could use one of the Helix returns.

[rd2rk]

4 minutes ago, HonestOpinion said:

 

Pretty much what hideout said, what am I missing here. Looks like you essentially want a 4CM setup. Why not just go 4CM into the Fishman from the Helix, with the electric guitar in the Helix's 'Guitar In'  and the acoustic in the Helix's 'Aux In'. If you don't want to use the Helix's 'Aux In' for your acoustic guitar you could use one of the Helix returns.

 

You're late to the game! We're playing "How many ways to skin the cat".

Where did that saying come from? I'm not overly fond of cats, but that seems kind of harsh.....

[HonestOpinion]

42 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

 

You're late to the game! We're playing "How many ways to skin the cat".

Where did that saying come from? I'm not overly fond of cats, but that seems kind of harsh.....

 

Dog lover myself but pretty much like most animals, even some of the two legged ones. But yeah, the psycho who came up with that could just as easily have said "more than one way to feed a cat" or "skin an orange".  But I digress. Saw the earlier posts, it just seemed like the slightly more exotic solutions were being batted around without the meat and potatoes one getting much attention.

[es345tds]

On 10/28/2019 at 6:45 PM, rd2rk said:

The acoustic preset has the Input Block set to MIC (unused, Variax would also work) to prevent any possible noise from the electric bleeding in.

Since you're not plugging anything into the XLR or 1/4" Outputs there's no need to do anything to the Output Blocks.

 

rd3rk/3leggedbrain - I see where the Electrafish has the send block being used for the output but I have a couple of ?'s for you guys. One is about the Acoustafish preset sample and the other is for 3leggedbrain about the amp useage.

1- why is the return block on the Acoustafish preset sample set to a 50% mix?

2- is the intention to use the Fishman amp for both guitars? Does that work for the electric guitar tone?

[rd2rk]

5 hours ago, es345tds said:

 

rd3rk/3leggedbrain - I see where the Electrafish has the send block being used for the output but I have a couple of ?'s for you guys. One is about the Acoustafish preset sample and the other is for 3leggedbrain about the amp useage.

1- why is the return block on the Acoustafish preset sample set to a 50% mix?

2- is the intention to use the Fishman amp for both guitars? Does that work for the electric guitar tone?

 

Your acoustic guitar is plugged into the Fishman, the electric is plugged into the Helix. When you play acoustic, you use the Acoustafish preset. That allows you to use the Fishman preamp with Helix as an FX unit.

 

When you play electric, you use the Electrafish preset. That uses the full Helix capabilities without the Fishman preamp, but the output goes back to the Fishman FX Return so that you're still using the Fishman power amp and speaker.

 

The Block settings in the EXAMPLE presets are all defaults. Adjust as necessary.

 

As for the tone, there's no reason short of extreme metal that the Fishman amp wouldn't sound just fine, and in the event of extreme metal you could have a second amp and ABY switch between the Helix and the amps. However, I suspect that OP is not an extreme metal kinda person......

 

If your Helix FX needs are minimal - you can fit the acoustic FX in one path and the electric FX in the other -  you could use the ULTRAFISH. No preset change required, just hit switch 11. In this configuration you'd use the 1/4" out to return signal to the Fishman from either the acoustic or electric path. I also threw in 1B/2B sub-paths to send signal to FOH. Obviously, you'd want to use appropriate cabs/IRs on each sub-path.

 

 

Ultrafish.hlx

[HonestOpinion]

1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

 

...

However, I suspect that OP is not an extreme metal kinda person......

 

...

 

I got the same impression. Although it is more specialized, particularly the EQ, to a lesser extent an acoustic guitar amp (Fishman), like a keyboard amp, can act as an FRFR. Would not be my first choice for electric guitar but I see no reason it can't be employed with a modeler for electric and acoustic depending on what you are playing.