snapshots Helix - Latency In Snapshot

[cameronroot]

I am a relatively new user to the Helix and I'm having an issue with latency when I'm switching between snapshots in a given bank. When I purchased the unit it had firmware 2.3 installed and I updated to the latest firmware version and everything went smoothly. I cannot say for sure but I felt like I wasn't getting a latency issue when switching between snapshots before the update and if I understand correctly I shouldn't be having that issue. Like I said, I'm not sure if the latency was existing before the update but it is definitely present now and it will make my music unplayable due to dynamics and what not. If anyone can give me some insight here that would be super appreciated, thank you.

[silverhead]

Are you perhaps confusing presets with snapshots. Your phrase 'switching between snapshots in a given bank' makes me ask. Banks contain presets; presets contain snapshots. Sounds like you may be switching between presets in the given bank where, yes, there is a lag. When switching between snapshots you remain in the same preset and there is no lag.

[cameronroot]

Thanks for replying @silverhead

So I'll describe the situation just so there is ultimate clarity. So I have 8 snapshots enables that take up my whole "bank". I've built all the sounds I would use within the 1 snapshot and then once i got everything I would plan to use for a given song and got levels pretty close I copied that Snapshot 1 to the other 7 snapshots available. I am finding some latency between all of them, its definitely not instantaneous. Like I was saying before, I feel like didn't notice it as much or at all before I updated to 2.82.

I attached picture below.

[cruisinon2]

1 hour ago, cameronroot said:

I've built all the sounds I would use within the 1 snapshot and then once i got everything I would plan to use for a given song and got levels pretty close I copied that Snapshot 1 to the other 7 snapshots available.

 

It does seem like we're getting lost in terminology here, and I'm confused by the statement "I've built all the sounds I would use within one snapshot". A snapshot is ONE sound....a capture of the state of each block in the patch's signal chain at one particular moment... one snapshot cannot contain multiple sounds. It's a single entity. Effectively, it's a "patch within a patch". (Or "preset within a preset", if you like. The terms are interchangeable). Copying any one snapshot to the remaining 7 slots would yield 8 identical snapshots and 8 identical sounds.

 

On the other hand, if what you're doing is creating 8 distinct snapshots within one patch, copying that entire patch into a separate slot, and then toggling between them, then yes there will a lag when switching between the two. That's unavoidable.

[rd2rk]

Why not attach the preset here so that we can try to duplicate/troubleshoot the problem?

A picture may be worth 1000 words, but the preset is the real deal!

[cameronroot]

This description of what I've done on my Helix is this. 

 

Running 8 Snapshots mode. In Snapshot 1 I have all the different "pedals" "EQ's" I was planning to use for a particular song. I then copied Snapshot 1 and  pasted it to the rest of my available Snapshots on my board. After that I went through and Bypassed the "pedals" "EQ's" I am not using in a particular Snapshot. 

 

My understanding is that I shouldn't have any noticeable latency in switching through these Snapshots. 

 

I appreciate the feedback and support, hoping to have a declarative answer to move forward soon. Thank You! 

 

[phil_m]

31 minutes ago, cameronroot said:

This description of what I've done on my Helix is this. 

 

Running 8 Snapshots mode. In Snapshot 1 I have all the different "pedals" "EQ's" I was planning to use for a particular song. I then copied Snapshot 1 and  pasted it to the rest of my available Snapshots on my board. After that I went through and Bypassed the "pedals" "EQ's" I am not using in a particular Snapshot. 

 

My understanding is that I shouldn't have any noticeable latency in switching through these Snapshots. 

 

I appreciate the feedback and support, hoping to have a declarative answer to move forward soon. Thank You! 

 

 It sounds to me like you might be confusing snapshots and presets, especially if you're talking about copying and pasting different blocks.

[silverhead]

1 hour ago, cameronroot said:

..... I then copied Snapshot 1 and  pasted it to the rest of my available Snapshots on my board. ....

 

This is another statement that I don't quite understand and makes me think you are indeed confusing presets and snapshots. Apologies in advance if the following seems too basic.......

 

Here's a sequence of steps I'd ask you to perform to clear up any confusion about presets and  snapshots, and about the lag that you are hearing. I suggest using a couple of Factory presets for this so we all can refer to the same presets. The selected Factory presets are ones that have some snapshots defined. They are:

- Preset 23C in the Factory 1 setlist. It is named SnpshotSanctuary.

- Preset 31C in the Factory 1 setlist. It is named SFX:Slot Machine.

- Preset 14B in the Factory 2 setlist. It is named Snapshot Hotshot.

(We don't need to worry about whether or not we like these presets. Remember - all factory presets suck.)

 

1) In Global settings -> Footswitches set the Preset Mode Switches parameter to Preset/Snap. Your footswitch display should now show the names of the 4 Presets in the current Bank in the top row and the names of snapshots 1 - 4 within the current preset on the bottom row.

2) Navigate to one of the above presets. I think SFX:Slot Machine is the best one to use for this purpose but they will all exhibit the behaviours we want to compare.

3) Note which preset is active; this is the top row LED light that is lit. Note which Snapshot is active; this is the bottom row LED light that is lit.

4) Begin playing. Use the bottom row of footswitches to move between snapshots. Notice that the preset remains the same (same top row light remains lit) while the snapshot lights on the bottom row change to reflect the currently active one. Note also how the lights change for some blocks in the Signal Flow view as their On/Off (Bypass) status changes as defined by the snapshot. There should be no audible gap/lag in the audio as you switch snapshots within a preset.

5) Keep playing. Use the top row of footswitches to move between presets within the current bank.  Notice how the preset lights change to reflect the active preset. There should be very brief but audible gap/lag in the audio as you switch presets.

 

Now, remain in this display mode (Preset/Snap) and revisit your own situation where you are noticing a lag when you are 'switching snapshots'. Are you actually switching snapshots and seeing the behaviour in #4 above, or are you really switching presets and seeing the behaviour of #5? Pay close attention to the LED lights: both in the top row that shows preset changes, and the block on/off lights in the Signal Flow view when  you use the bottom row of footswitches to change snapshots.

 

 

[DunedinDragon]

2 hours ago, cameronroot said:

I then copied Snapshot 1 and  pasted it to the rest of my available Snapshots on my board. After that I went through and Bypassed the "pedals" "EQ's" I am not using in a particular Snapshot. 

 

 

THIS is the statement that suggests you're not talking about snapshots, but are talking about presets.  Why?  Well because THERE IS NO FUNCTION FOR PASTING A SNAPSHOT.

Regardless of whether you have your unit setup for 8 snapshot mode or stomp mode or a mixed mode, if you define all the things you want to have in snapshot 1, they AUTOMATICALLY appear in snapshots 2 - 8.  There's not reason to paste anything.  Once you've defined it in snapshot one, you simply select snapshot 2 and define what actions will happen in that snapshot with all of those blocks you defined in snapshot 1 and save it as snapshot 2 in the same preset.  The same with snapshots 3 through 8.  No pasting because they already exist AND ARE A PART OF THE SAME PRESET.  If you define something new in snapshot 8, it will automatically be defined in snapshot 1 - 7.  If you delete something in snapshot 1, it's automatically deleted in snapshots 2 - 8.  Because snapshots are all a part of the same preset.

[cameronroot]

Sorry that I said I was pasting a snapshot, I am not doing that, I understand that I am using the wrong words there now. I am just selecting the different blocks to be active per 1-8 snapshots. Sorry for the confusion!

 

So now I think we all understand eachother. So simply put, I have lag between switching my snapshots. :)

[rd2rk]

3 hours ago, cameronroot said:

Sorry that I said I was pasting a snapshot, I am not doing that, I understand that I am using the wrong words there now. I am just selecting the different blocks to be active per 1-8 snapshots. Sorry for the confusion!

 

So now I think we all understand eachother. So simply put, I have lag between switching my snapshots. :)

 

On 12/15/2019 at 1:57 PM, rd2rk said:

Why not attach the preset here so that we can try to duplicate/troubleshoot the problem?

A picture may be worth 1000 words, but the preset is the real deal!

 

If you're actually looking for a solution, ATTACH THE PRESET SO WE CAN TROUBLESHOOT IT!

[cameronroot]

Here is the preset.

cameronrootORIGIN.hlx

[rd2rk]

Sorry guy, no lag whatsoever on my box.

[cameronroot]

Okay, I'll probably end up exchanging my Helix then, thank you for checking it out!

[silverhead]

I also get no lag when switching snapshots with your preset.

 

I do notice something a bit unusual and want to make sure you're doing it intentionally. Your Output blocks in Path 1 are both routed to Path 2A. Your Path 2A Input block is also assigned to Guitar. That means your incoming guitar signal is being processed twice - once through both Paths 1 and 2, and again only through Path 2. If that's not intentional try setting the Input block of Path 2A to None.

[cameronroot]

So I did change that path actually late last night and through headphones the latency was gone. My Blackstar is needing tubes replaced so I'll update when I get everything back up and running. Thank you for the help so far everyone!