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"Host Sync" doesn't control modulation LFO start

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I'm writing a song that uses a square or saw tooth tremelo effect synced to the beat with a 100% intensity for the primary rhythm element.  I've found that though you can sync the tempo to the track, you can't control the start of the tremelo cycle with the DAW to sync it up with other elements.  This means that each time you start the track, the phase of the cycle may not be what you expect.

That makes it very difficult to sync up properly...

 

For example, I've set up a sine wave generator, then an instance of Helix Native with a single Modulation > Mono > Tremelo:

 

129582362_OutofSyncTremSettings.thumb.PNG.da5fe841fff88977891b1cb6d80d933f.PNG

 

I've then set up my DAW to enable the effect at a particular spot in the "song" so that the effect would theoretically start the cycle the same each time.  Then, I rendered the same section of song 3 times and added them to the project.

 

130787051_OutofSyncTrem.thumb.PNG.75fa2feb5faf2bb77270cb581e1a4e7e.PNG

 

As you can see, the first bar is the solid block sine wave, and then the tremelo effect is kicked on.  You'll notice that the phase of each cycle is quite different, even though they all are turned on at the exact same time.  (Three may have been me accidentally leaving one unmuted before the next render)

 

Next, I attempted to bypass the Helix plugin entirely, rather than just the tremelo effect block.  The same behavior is exhibited.  The start time of the cycle is entirely unpredictable, and appears to simply be running non-stop after you load the plugin into memory or something.

 

69723147_OutofSyncTremBypass.thumb.PNG.5d3f878b18c2b950ceb127f8ac1aa04a.PNG

 

As suspected, this is true for other Modulation effects as well.  Here's the same test using a whole not with the Script Mod Phase effect:

 

87703795_OutofSyncModBypass.thumb.PNG.6d7126d3096d4c49fd38dbd8cdbb260f.PNG

 

Helix Native needs to honor the Host Sync's start event (assuming that actually exists) to reset it's LFO for Modulation effects.  Otherwise, results are unpredictable and potentially unusable during rendering.  :(

 

I haven't tested the Helix Floor pedal to see if the bypass/enable of a trem effect resets the LFO, but I wouldn't be surprised if it had the same basic problem...

 

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This is a bug, which I have reported 2 years ago and was not addressed since. LFO does not appear to be syncing even on hardware units, neither via MIDI or tap tempo.

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Yes, having the same issue on HX Stomp. It seems we have to just give up and use tremolo effects from other devices like BOSS GT-100, which syncs perfectly with tempo. Having a tremolo like this in Helix products is a completely useless thing. Don't really know whats the point to have Patterns Tremolo and Bleat Chop Trem in general if you can't sync it to the song. Great job, Line6!

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Hello

 

Same here with HX Effects.
It just seem so simple. I don't get why this fonction doens't work

 

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FYI, the firmware V3 notes this bug fix: "When synced to external MIDI clock or retriggering via TAP, certain models with tremolo circuits' LFO set to square wave would invert the waveform–FIXED"


This does not affect this particular issue.  Re-rendering a sine wave with the tremelo on it still has a different time offsets.
 

image.png.02abbd1b9eba93119b77910343184e99.png

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Hi team, 

 

Has this been looked at or fixed by L6 devs?

 

Or has anyone found a usable workaround?

 

I'm sending midi clock from an Ableton session to HX Stomp and need the Trem tempo & cycle to sync perfectly with the session playback... 

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On 3/13/2021 at 4:12 PM, jskourletos said:

Hi team, 

 

Has this been looked at or fixed by L6 devs?

 

Or has anyone found a usable workaround?

 

I'm sending midi clock from an Ableton session to HX Stomp and need the Trem tempo & cycle to sync perfectly with the session playback... 

 

I vaguely remember testing it, but I heard hitting the tap tempo button may start the cycle over.  So you can possibly get them synced manually. Not ideal obviously.

 

Sending a Program Change message to select a patch might also reset the cycle?

 

 

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