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Samdbl

*sigh*. More volume pedal troubles with hx effects

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I hate the volume pedal weirdness with this unit. 
 

so anyway, my vp jr died. I ‘upgraded’ for the replacement with a boss fv30h. Works fine *except* when the pedal is all the way to the toe down position, the volume decreases to almost zero. Heel down = silence (good), transitioning from heel to toe = volume increases (good), toe down = volume decreases dramatically (stupid). Yes I did a factory reset, yes I’m plugged in from the output of the pedal to the exp2, this problem happens with both the factory presets and custom ones, running latest version of firmware. The volume pedal should really be plug and play. I’ve spent weeks with various problems. It’s a really garbage bug in the design of this unit, imo. 
any ideas? Please let me know fast so I can return the volume pedal, if need be (too late to return the hx, unfortunately)

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39 minutes ago, Samdbl said:

I hate the volume pedal weirdness with this unit. 
 

Works fine *except* when the pedal is all the way to the toe down position, the volume decreases to almost zero. Heel down = silence (good), transitioning from heel to toe = volume increases (good), toe down = volume decreases dramatically (stupid). Yes I did a factory reset, yes I’m plugged in from the output of the pedal to the exp2

 

 

I'm not entirely sure about this, but it may be worth taking a look. 
When you did the factory reset the globals will have been reset to the default.
Did you try checking the Global settings -> EXP2 Polarity and with try both "Normal" and "Inverted".
My two external M-Audio pedals need to be on inverted polarity. 

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I tried that. I’m wondering, can you adjust the ‘position’ of the volume pedal? It shows in the position control of the volume scribble strip in real time that the pedal returns to 0% in toe down and heel down position (while increasing/decreasing normally going between the two). I have tried simply adjusting the meter to 100% while it’s in toe down, but it doesn’t save. Even after pressing save. The next time I try, it just does the same routine.

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7 hours ago, Samdbl said:

I hate the volume pedal weirdness with this unit. 
 

so anyway, my vp jr died. I ‘upgraded’ for the replacement with a boss fv30h. Works fine *except* when the pedal is all the way to the toe down position, the volume decreases to almost zero. Heel down = silence (good), transitioning from heel to toe = volume increases (good), toe down = volume decreases dramatically (stupid). Yes I did a factory reset, yes I’m plugged in from the output of the pedal to the exp2, this problem happens with both the factory presets and custom ones, running latest version of firmware. The volume pedal should really be plug and play. I’ve spent weeks with various problems. It’s a really garbage bug in the design of this unit, imo. 
any ideas? Please let me know fast so I can return the volume pedal, if need be (too late to return the hx, unfortunately)

 

You said you did a factory reset. Are you on the latest firmware as well? I suppose this could be a problem with the fv30h pedal rather than the HX Effects. Do you have access to another one you can test with? Can't explain why the toe all the way down behavior is erratic. Clutching at straws but does changing the value of the global parameter "EXP2 Pedal Position" make any difference in your tests? Also doubt it will help but have you tried setting the volume block's parameter 'Curve'="Logarithmic".  What happens when you go into the "Controller Assign" screen and set the "Max Value" for the volume pedal block to for example 90%? Granted none of these settings should make a difference but still curious if they do?

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On 6/24/2020 at 6:03 PM, Samdbl said:

The volume pedal should really be plug and play.

 

I just had another look at my M-Audio pedals because as you say, they should be ready to go right out of the box.
 

I get used to them simply being there and never having to worry, but now I checked once again and on the side of my pedals is a small rotary pot that allows you to set the Min and Max amount of output at heel down and toe down. As I play around with that little potentiometer it appears to hit 100% at the centre and then rolls of back to zero at both ends of the travel. I think this is what you are experiencing, but with mine I can set the minimum at the side until I can see 0% on heel down and 100% on toe down. As I understand it, the idea of being able to set a minimum of, for example 30% on the heel end if the travel, is for keyboard players who may only be wanting to drop the volume of certain parts in a live band scenario. It's a little odd to try and explain in a forum post, but there is a video showing what I mean. I'm not familiar with the Boss pedal so I don't know if there is an adjustment know somewhere on it - there is on the one in this vid.

 

Example video - start at 1.38

 

 

 

 

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I had this problem when I tried to use a mission expression pedal, ( not the helix brand one, a mate lent me one of there others) I’m sorry to say I never found a fix. I went back to my old ex-1 and I have had no problems. I don’t know if maybe the travel is too far For it to read or if it’s something more technical. I have seen these complaints across the net though. It seems some pedals just don’t work properly with helix family units. 
there where a couple of older threads on here somewhere where people have recommendations. 

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On 6/24/2020 at 10:03 AM, Samdbl said:

I hate the volume pedal weirdness with this unit. 
 

so anyway, my vp jr died. I ‘upgraded’ for the replacement with a boss fv30h. Works fine *except* when the pedal is all the way to the toe down position, the volume decreases to almost zero. Heel down = silence (good), transitioning from heel to toe = volume increases (good), toe down = volume decreases dramatically (stupid). Yes I did a factory reset, yes I’m plugged in from the output of the pedal to the exp2, this problem happens with both the factory presets and custom ones, running latest version of firmware. The volume pedal should really be plug and play. I’ve spent weeks with various problems. It’s a really garbage bug in the design of this unit, imo. 
any ideas? Please let me know fast so I can return the volume pedal, if need be (too late to return the hx, unfortunately)

 

Let me guess, you're using TRS cable, right?

Please try TS cable, then most likely the volume pedal will behave upside down, meaning heel down is max volume and toe down is silence. Then invert the tip polarity from global setting to make it normal (heel down silence and tow down max volume).

 

Volume (or any expression parameter) max at the middle, and min at both end is an expected symptom if you pair TRS style pedal with HX using TRS cable.

 

HTH

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I've been meaning to reply to this thread for awhile. At the heart of this issue is that all Line 6 products are designed around a TS expression pedal. They may be the only company in industry that does this. It goes back to the 4-button stomp modelers, where people using expression pedals with effects pedals was still somewhat rare, I think. The big thing with those was that you could use a regular TS-TS instrument cable to connect the pedal rather than a TRS-TRS cable. Some TRS pedals can be made to work in various way, but they aren't exactly what the EXP jack is looking for.

 

A standard TRS expression pedal circuit is like this:

image.png.c16967bf92d56549fe7fda2b635ec50e.png

 


When you move treadle, it varies the voltage going back the tip. The value of the potentiometer in this scheme isn't important, as it's not directly in the expression circuit.

The Line 6 EX-1 and Mission Engineering EP1-L6 are wired like this:

 

image.png.306656e6fcd2ca454133b37a10156dbf.png

 

With this scheme, the potentiometer is acting like a sink for the voltage coming from the EXP jack.

Because the ring connection is grounded on the TRS versions, I think that why some of those end up working. The voltage between the tip and the sleeve is still being varied by the treadle, but at some positions, it grounds out, so you get the jumps to 0 or 100.

 

 

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