Helix & PowerCab 112+ massive change in sound

[tmingle]

I am connected using 1 of the 1/4 outputs to the Powercab + input #1.  I also have the L6 link connected to control the Powercab.  The Digital output level is set to -120db.  I am experiencing a major change in sound when the patch's output is set to Multi, rather than 1/4".  Is this normal? 

[zappazapper]

I don't own a Powercab but I've been curious enough about them to do a little research. Maybe I can help. 

 

I know the Powercab has a few different modes as far as the speaker models are concerned and that they can be controlled by the Helix. Is it possible that when you are using the 1/4", the Powercab is no longer functioning in the same mode as the Link because maybe the Powercab's settings are no longer being controlled by the Helix? Maybe try relinquishing control of the Powercab by the Helix and set the Powercab to be in flat/FRFR mode and see what the result is. 

[PierM]

I dont have an answer here, but always been like that for me, since day one in 2016. 

[tmingle]

I use the Global EQ on the 1/4 out to the power cab & plan to split the XLR out before the cabinet.  I will then add a cabinet in Reaper for playback.  I generally use the Powercab as a monitor when recording.  I also use the Powercab when I just play or practice.  

" The MULTI Out DEFINITELY sounds different, light blanket over the amp effect? "   Mine turns to pure MUD.  Maybe its my ears.

[rd2rk]

So, being that it is what it is, use the L6 Link with digital out and put a Para EQ after the split.

Saves a DA conversion, gives you the full options of the Powercab,  and unless you're maxing on DSP, it'll work same as Global EQ.

I can't see any reason you'd NEED to use MULTI. I never do.

Tell me again what you're using the XLR out for? If you're going into a DAW with an external interface I get it (though an AI with S/PDIF would be better, unless you're using an LT?). Otherwise, why aren't you using the Helix as AI and going in via USB?

Also, unless you use something like W.O.S for your cabs in the DAW, why not put your IRs on the Powercab and take the Powercab Out to the AI? Then your recordings would sound more like the monitored Powercab.

[tmingle]

9 hours ago, rd2rk said:

So, being that it is what it is, use the L6 Link with digital out and put a Para EQ after the split.

Saves a DA conversion, gives you the full options of the Powercab,  and unless you're maxing on DSP, it'll work same as Global EQ.

I can't see any reason you'd NEED to use MULTI. I never do.

Tell me again what you're using the XLR out for? If you're going into a DAW with an external interface I get it (though an AI with S/PDIF would be better, unless you're using an LT?). Otherwise, why aren't you using the Helix as AI and going in via USB?

Also, unless you use something like W.O.S for your cabs in the DAW, why not put your IRs on the Powercab and take the Powercab Out to the AI? Then your recordings would sound more like the monitored Powercab.

The Multi output is the default & I was surprised how the sound changed when I changed it.  I did not expect that.  

I was using the Helix as my interface, but decided to add an RME UCX to my setup as well.  The XLR goes into my fireface analog ins.  The fireface doesn't have a s/pdif input.  

I like the global EQ because of the visual curve.  As far as using the Powercab out into the interface, I just haven't got that far yet.  

[PierM]

^

 

I assume it's the default to make the Helix working, out of the box, in any in/out condition. Doesnt mean it's the best option, for specific setups.

[DBCrocky]

So, the Link6 cable will carry audio AND control.  So there is no need to connect a 1/4" cable in addition.  I suspect when you set to multi, you are sending out both the L6 and 1/4", causing the Powercab to receive and mix two signals.  Then when you change to 1/4", you are no longer sending out the Link6 port, and hence your sound changes.

 

[rd2rk]

6 hours ago, DBCrocky said:

So, the Link6 cable will carry audio AND control.  So there is no need to connect a 1/4" cable in addition.  I suspect when you set to multi, you are sending out both the L6 and 1/4", causing the Powercab to receive and mix two signals.  Then when you change to 1/4", you are no longer sending out the Link6 port, and hence your sound changes.

 

 

That was my first thought, but, as I mentioned in the results of the tests I ran, disconnecting the L6 Link when using the MULTI out made no difference to the tone.

[tmingle]

If I get time this weekend, Im going to do the same test with the 1/4 & XLR's into my new interface.  

[rd2rk]

I deleted my earlier post with test info and results, based on having had more time to mess with it and getting different results.

Also, I had to do a factory reset to solve a different problem, which resulted in Helix rebuilding it's presets, and I don't know for sure that it didn't affect the result, since the other problem also had to do with the outputs. I know, confusing, PITA, etc., but what can ya do?

 

Copied/edited from previous post:

 

Interesting observation. To test, I set up the attached preset.

 

Global settings:

Pad Off

1/4" Outputs set to LINE (to balance with DIGITAL levels)

AES/EBU

Digital Output 0.0db (-60db makes no difference, not sure why)

Global EQ OFF

 

Both Path Inputs set to Guitar.

WHOWATT A + C on 1A and 2A, default settings.

Powercab setting is FLAT on both DIGITAL and MULTI Outs.

 

Paths A and B split through a GAIN Block set to 0.0db

1A=1/4"

1B=DIGITAL

2A=MULTI

2B=XLR - nothing connected. included just to make sure the split on 1A isn't affected by the GAIN Block

 

Wiring: L6 Link; 1/4" Out to PC Input 1; XLR Out to PC Input 2

 

New test preset attached. Switches for all four outs - Digital, 1/4", XLR, Multi

 

Switches 8,9,10 and 11 turn the levels OFF/ON (-120db MIN; 0.0db MAX) on Paths 1A, 1B and 2A, 2B respectively.

 

Digital, 1/4" and XLR outs sound about the same. Maybe a VERY slight difference. Due to the DA conversion on the 1/4"?

Really too slight for me to say definitively, my ears are not THAT good!

 

Here's the trick. Open the Powercab Edit App to the SYSTEM page. Switch back and forth between the Digital, 1/4" and XLR outs to get the sound in your head.

Now, disconnect the L6 Link cable. Switch to the Multi out. Alternately, drop the sliders (PC app) for Input 1 and Input 2 . With both up (0.0db) and Multi active, it's louder, but I no longer hear the blanket effect. Reconnect the L6 Link cable. Same result. With all Inputs up, louder, but no blanket effect. With L6 disconnected, removed XLR and switched back and forth between 1/4" and Multi. No difference, not even level.

 

As mentioned, between my first test and this one, I did a total factory reset. When I restored my backup AND REBOOTED, it rebuilt my presets, and seems to have resolved the issue. Not saying it will work for you, but it's worth a try. All outputs on my Helix now sound identical.

 

 

 

Output Levels.hlx