Double Take replacement....sorta

[themetallikid]

Ok, 1) I know running stereo live is useless.....lol   2) I'm not trying to really create a 'true' stereo path or sound.   However after watching Jason Sadites run through of the Double Take..I decided to try this and see if it will give me what i'm looking for.  

 

I'm trying to create a thicker (sorta double tracked) type sound...however, even with the modulation 'off' and the 'Slop" around 2.5 only on my heavier sounds I can still hear some of that chorusy phasing.  I have the voices set to '2' as that gives my direct signal a middle channel and the effected wet sound the L/R panned hard.  I have the wet output ranging from -3db to -5.0db and it helps, but its still there.

 

So my question is...being i'm not really looking for a true stereo type effect field and just looking to thicken the sound while sending 2 outs L/R to the PA (dual mono is a better term??) is there a better way to achieve this than the Double Take?  

 

I have a stereo delay just because I like how it sounds better overall.  Most rooms I play these days are 150 capacity or under so almost everyone is sorta 'in my field'.  I'm not concerned about losing 1/2 the audience really.  

[amsdenj]

It's likely no one but you will notice your stereo, unless you're playing mostly solo. But if it sounds better to you, and makes you feel better, its likely to make you play better. I use a Powercab 212 for exactly that purpose. 

 

There are other ways to stereo widen including using small amounts of pitch shifting and very short delays. But almost anything you do is likely to have some phase effect that you might or might not like. 

 

Stereo widening seems to sound nicer and have less apparently negative phasing effects when using headphones. This is probably because the sounds are mixing in your head, not the air. This can be useful with IEMs to give some space to your monitor mix.

 

[amenity421]

I spent a couple years gigging with a full stereo rig. The bass player and I had one of each of our cabs on either side of the stage which worked great for us. We just couldn't figure out how to get the audience to care that they could hear both sides of our ping pong delay

[themetallikid]

3 hours ago, amsdenj said:

It's likely no one but you will notice your stereo, unless you're playing mostly solo. But if it sounds better to you, and makes you feel better, its likely to make you play better. I use a Powercab 212 for exactly that purpose. 

 

There are other ways to stereo widen including using small amounts of pitch shifting and very short delays. But almost anything you do is likely to have some phase effect that you might or might not like. 

 

Stereo widening seems to sound nicer and have less apparently negative phasing effects when using headphones. This is probably because the sounds are mixing in your head, not the air. This can be useful with IEMs to give some space to your monitor mix.

 

Yeah I get that...I sorta figured its not a win/win type question I'm asking, lol.   And as much as the Helix can handle, I hate having complicated core tones as it just becomes a nightmare to program song specific presets then and get all the pieces of THAT tone into the preset along with other sound components.  

 

Would only adding a pitch to one side of the outputs and only going up OR down a few cents be enough to thicken it?  I monitor at home using headphones so I'm getting the effect much stronger than it would be live I'm thinking.  I get what your saying about 'real air' not causing the phasing as opposed to isolated cans really....But I dont really use a cab on stage.  We run direct and I only monitor through my front monitor.  Thinking maybe if I send seperate outputs and only pitch shift a few cents (enough to get some thicknes) but then pan each channel at the board maybe 70/30 etc....idk, too much thinking, lol....

 

2 hours ago, amenity421 said:

I spent a couple years gigging with a full stereo rig. The bass player and I had one of each of our cabs on either side of the stage which worked great for us. We just couldn't figure out how to get the audience to care that they could hear both sides of our ping pong delay

Yeah my 'monster' rig had a stereo setup between a 4x12 and 2*2x12's vertically on its side.  Sorta a wet dry wet, but didnt really use in the w/d/w config.  it sounded great where I was standing.  Eventually I wanted my other guitar player to get a 2nd cab and we were gonna do what you did, not stereo, just to have sound equalized on stage that way.  And it looked cool, lol