Helix HX amp models into front of an amp

[sjturbo]

I think I am in the right place to get informed answers to my question.

I am looking at getting a HX Stomp or XL and I do not have an effects loop on my MMRD50. I want to use the Litigator amp model and  wonder if it will sound good? Any suggestions?

I really can't afford to buy the HX and a new amp.

[silverhead]

If the only input on your amp is the input to its preamp section (drive/gain, tone stack, etc....) then you don't want to use an amp model in front of it. You should use the HX Stomp/XL only for FX - in which case you'd be better off getting an HX FX device. If you want to use an amp modeler you should use an amp that has an input to the power amp and cab section only, bypassing its preamp. I don't know whether your MMRD50 has this.

 

So the answer to your specific question is... No - the Litigator (or any other amp model) will not sound good if you use a physical amp's preamp after it.

[sjturbo]

Thanks for the unbiased response. 

So I guess my next question is can I create the "Litigator" sound with just the HX Stomp effects into my MMRD50?

[JimGordon]

On 4/20/2021 at 10:01 AM, silverhead said:

If the only input on your amp is the input to its preamp section (drive/gain, tone stack, etc....) then you don't want to use an amp model in front of it. You should use the HX Stomp/XL only for FX - in which case you'd be better off getting an HX FX device. If you want to use an amp modeler you should use an amp that has an input to the power amp and cab section only, bypassing its preamp. I don't know whether your MMRD50 has this.

 

So the answer to your specific question is... No - the Litigator (or any other amp model) will not sound good if you use a physical amp's preamp after it.

 

With all due respect, that's just a somewhat silly blanket statement.  I've gotten very good results running the Helix into the front of my Fender Hot Rod, WITH full amp models.  In fact, when I first got the Helix, some guy there on the sales floor tried to also claim I "didn't want" the full Helix if I had a real amp because it would sound "wrong".  He insisted on not letting me play through a "real amp", instead forcing me to play through the Powercab (because he didn't want to haul a real tube amp over, probably!).  Sounded like a muffled dull washcloth to my ears with the presets present, but despite that, I took a chance that it would sound good through a good, CLEAN tube amp.  And it did....although it took a while to figure out how to build patches.

 

To answer SJTurbo's question, an HX FX has NO amp models in it.  So you wouldn't be able to get the "Litigator sound"; that sound is based around the amp modelling of tone stacks, gain, modelled power stage distortion, and so forth.

 

HOWEVER......major, major caveat, and I mean major.  If you do run it straight into an amp, how it sounds will vary greatly on the channel you use, the frequency response and range of the amplifier, how well it takes inputs without "nasty clipping", and of course, the speaker/cab.  While sending a Helix straight into an amp drive channel with some gain might have its uses, generally it will sound.....well....nasty.  Your amp is a Music Man RD50, which has a tube power section, but a solid state pre-amp.  The solid-state preamp *might* clip unpleasantly.  I remember my old, crappy solid state amp had a habit of clipping in a bad way with too much signal.  I recently swapped the tubes on my amp's preamp section for lower gain tubes, and run it into the low input jack, so the signal will not clip harshly or suddenly.  Now the Music Man hybrid amps like yours do have a good rep for a clean tone.

 

I'd suggest you think about getting the Helix from a place with a good return policy.  That way, you can try it out, and see if it works with your amp straight in to your satisfaction.  You may find that it is adequate at least, and from there, maybe start looking at investing in a cheap, clean tube amp, a Powercab, or perhaps one of those small portable power amps.

 

[cruisinon2]

And we're off! Yet again...;)

[JimGordon]

9 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

And we're off! Yet again...;)

 

I know.......I didn't see the OP's new topic until I was done with my rant......

 

 

[BigBob-Irwin]

I guess although I might be wrong that you want to use the Litigator amp to get close to a Dumble amp sound if that is the case the HX has a close approximation to a zendrive pedal it is called the Dhyana drive.