CMO79 Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Oh boy this one should be fun..... please help! :) Current Setup : Guitar input is in input of Helix LT Output from helix to effects return on Amp Send on helix to input of amp Return on helix to effects send on amp Helix USB to PC Windows and AMP is connected via speaker cable to a 4/12 peavey slant. I want the guitar to be amped and be able to record through the USB into a DAW using effects from both AMP and helix at the same time as can get some great sounding combinations with helix and amp + cab and want that feel but also be able to get the wet signal into the daw. Once any gain is given on amp cannot cut the feedback noise at all and recording picks up the feedback. I'm using a send block in the helix chain but in addition to the feedback having issues getting the effects of the amp in place with helix effects. I know somethings wrong and just wondering whether it's hardware or software causing it and if i need to do something else as I am now at a loss but will keep trying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Guitar>Helix Input>any Helix FX you want in front of the Spirit. Place FX Loop 1 Block in the signal chain after the FX. Take SEND 1 (INST Level) from Helix to the Spirit Input. Return the signal to Helix FX Return 1 via the Spirit FX SEND. Place further Helix FX after the FX Loop Block 1. Place FX Loop Block 2 (LINE Level) after these FX. Take SEND 2 to the Spirit FX RETURN. Get an XLR to Balanced 1/4" adaptor and take the Redbox DI to the Helix FX RETURN 2. Take the Spirit's Speaker Out to the 412. Take the XLR Out from Helix to FOH (if required). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmalle Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 Does your noise level change significantly when you plug/unplug the USB connection? Would you call that your main problem? Or is that a minor contributor to noise levels? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMO79 Posted July 21, 2021 Author Share Posted July 21, 2021 @Schmalle The feedback noise is definitely an issue and is not there when the USB is not connected. I was hoping trying what @rd2rk would have not make it an issue and be able to get both amp and helix sounds into a daw but haven't had a moment to try that out just yet. Big shout out to rd2rk really want to try that out above and give it a go..!:-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmalle Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 43 minutes ago, CMO79 said: @Schmalle The feedback noise is definitely an issue and is not there when the USB is not connected. I was hoping trying what @rd2rk would have not make it an issue and be able to get both amp and helix sounds into a daw but haven't had a moment to try that out just yet. Big shout out to rd2rk really want to try that out above and give it a go..!:-) So your issue is a common one: a ground loop that is closed when you plug in USB. If the PC is a laptop unplug the AC-adapter and you're good. Otherwise you probably need a USB isolator /ground loop eliminator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 42 minutes ago, CMO79 said: The feedback noise is definitely an issue and is not there when the USB is not connected. This is a separate issue. When you have a USB ground loop issue, connecting the USB cable will result in a high pitched squeal which, when loud enough, resembles audio feedback. The solution for THAT issue (usually) lies in finding which of your connected USB devices are causing the ground loop. My suggested audio routing just gets the sound of the Spirit Amp into the recording/FOH chain and allows you to use Helix FX such as Global EQ/EQs/Compressors for post processing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 4 minutes ago, Schmalle said: So your issue is a common one: a ground loop that is closed when you plug in USB. If the PC is a laptop unplug the AC-adapter and you're good. Otherwise you probably need a USB isolator /ground loop eliminator. I didn't have any luck with either disconnecting the laptop PSU or using a USB isolator, but I have a LOT of USB devices connected (10!), and both regular USB (powered) and USB C hubs. My solution ultimately involved switching things around to the different hubs until the noise went away. BIG PITA! I'm still not POSITIVE that it wasn't something I did inadvertently somewhere else in the system that solved it. The Isolator that I bought ($50!) I tried on every USB device, and all it ever did was ADD noise. YMMV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmalle Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 13 minutes ago, rd2rk said: I didn't have any luck with either disconnecting the laptop PSU or using a USB isolator, but I have a LOT of USB devices connected (10!), and both regular USB (powered) and USB C hubs. My solution ultimately involved switching things around to the different hubs until the noise went away. BIG PITA! I'm still not POSITIVE that it wasn't something I did inadvertently somewhere else in the system that solved it. The Isolator that I bought ($50!) I tried on every USB device, and all it ever did was ADD noise. YMMV. Interesting case... The Helix was only connected via USB? Were there monitors or any other device connected that were also connected to the laptop? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMO79 Posted July 21, 2021 Author Share Posted July 21, 2021 I found a USB port on my desktop PC that has less feedback though it still feels as a ground issue is apparent. I wasn't able to give it to much time now so will need to come back and try again when i do have the time tonight. From the quick A/B testing of different USB ports I did notice that it is only the crunch channel that has the most feedback for MY spirit 200 here but also noticed it creeping in to mix on other channels once playing.... I am aware of the USB isolators and haven't heard many success stories there either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted July 21, 2021 Share Posted July 21, 2021 5 hours ago, Schmalle said: Interesting case... The Helix was only connected via USB? Were there monitors or any other device connected that were also connected to the laptop? Helix, PC212+, Scarlett 18i20, Ext HD, Printer, Wireless Mouse, 4 MIDI controllers (KB, eDrums, nanoKontrol for DAWs, Grid controller for LIVE! - oh, yeah, I forgot the FCB1010 - that's 5 MIDI/11 USB total) . No monitors though. The Helix is connected to the PC212+ by L6 Link, and the PC212+ Outs are connected by XLR to the Scarlett. The Scarlett also connects back to the PC212+ to get amp sims into it. There's a G10 wireless connected to the Helix by 1/4" to AUX (for bass, main guitar is cabled to Guitar IN), and the G10 XLR goes to the Scarlett (for dry tracking and amp sims). Laptop audio out goes to the Scarlett also so I can get backing trax and streaming audio sources into the DAW. The Helix and Scarlett USB go straight to the laptop, everything else connects either to the powered hub or the USB C hub (regular USB ports connected to the laptop by C Port). The trick for me was to connect the external HD to the USB C hub and all the MIDI controllers and the Mouse dongle to the powered hub. Blessed silence! Naturally, after trying EVERY USB in EVERY port, with and without the Isolator, the ext HD to USB C hub was the last thing I tried..... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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