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New Powercab 212+ User

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My Powercab 212+ just got delivered today but I won't be able to try it out (I'm in the middle of moving house) until my next band rehearsal in a few days time.

So I've been watching as many videos on it as I can, and reading as much as possible on the forums so I have a rough idea what I'm doing when I finally get to use it.

 

I was just wondering - What are some things you guys wish you'd known before you first plugged into the PC212+?  Any golden first time setup tips?

 

I'm seeing a lot of people saying that they were disappointed with the PC sounding muffled, so that's a slight concern!

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The key is to have the Helix Preset's output level correctly set so that the loudest notes put the Input LED in the yellow with brief spikes of red when you really dig in,.

As to the "muffled" thing, I can only call "operator error".

The output level on the PC+ needs to be turned up a bit, it's not a bedroom amp, but once you get it turned up, the highs on mine will rip your head off if you set up your presets at a bedroom level.

 

Elsewhere on this forum I've discussed in painful detail the "L6 Link/HF Driver" bug.

Specifically, the PC+ has 5 main operating modes. Ideally, they should work like this:

 

FLAT FRFR - HF Driver ON

FLAT LF Flat - HF Driver OFF

FLAT LF Raw - HF Driver OFF

SPEAKER - HF Driver OFF

USER IR - HF Driver ON

 

When using L6 Link to switch modes, the PC+ can get "out of sync(?)" with L6 Link, causing the HF Driver to be ON when it should be OFF.

The cure for this is to reboot the PC+. Most inconvenient at a gig.

Alternatively, you can add a MIDI cable and use CommandCenter Instant commands to FORCE the HF Driver to be ON (CC#5 Value 113 = 0db) or OFF (CC#5 Value 0).

PITA to have to configure on every preset.

L6 steadfastly refuses to acknowledge this or any other bug in the Powercab, nor have they made any commitment to updates or bug fixes.

Since the last update was two years ago, it appears possible that we may have an orphaned product, so it's good to know the workarounds.

 

Attached is a "Test" preset that you can use in conjunction with the PC Edit app to test the HF Driver status. Select the snapshot that corresponds with the mode you want to test, then, using the SYSTEM tab in PC Edit, manually operate the slider for the HF Driver from one end to the other while playing a chord. If L6 Link is operating correctly, you should hear a big difference in FLAT FRFR and USER IR modes, and NO difference in the other modes.

 

Don't let the above discourage you. The PC+ is a great sounding box when configured correctly.

Like any good tool, you need to learn how to use it properly to get the best results.

 

Enjoy your new toy!

 

 

Test Link Bug.hlx

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Found your post interesting to read. I cant wait to see your post soon. Good Luck for the upcoming update. This article is really very interesting and effective.

 

skylight paycards

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16 hours ago, rd2rk said:

The key is to have the Helix Preset's output level correctly set so that the loudest notes put the Input LED in the yellow with brief spikes of red when you really dig in,.

As to the "muffled" thing, I can only call "operator error".

The output level on the PC+ needs to be turned up a bit, it's not a bedroom amp, but once you get it turned up, the highs on mine will rip your head off if you set up your presets at a bedroom level.

 

Elsewhere on this forum I've discussed in painful detail the "L6 Link/HF Driver" bug.

Specifically, the PC+ has 5 main operating modes. Ideally, they should work like this:

 

FLAT FRFR - HF Driver ON

FLAT LF Flat - HF Driver OFF

FLAT LF Raw - HF Driver OFF

SPEAKER - HF Driver OFF

USER IR - HF Driver ON

 

When using L6 Link to switch modes, the PC+ can get "out of sync(?)" with L6 Link, causing the HF Driver to be ON when it should be OFF.

The cure for this is to reboot the PC+. Most inconvenient at a gig.

Alternatively, you can add a MIDI cable and use CommandCenter Instant commands to FORCE the HF Driver to be ON (CC#5 Value 113 = 0db) or OFF (CC#5 Value 0).

PITA to have to configure on every preset.

L6 steadfastly refuses to acknowledge this or any other bug in the Powercab, nor have they made any commitment to updates or bug fixes.

Since the last update was two years ago, it appears possible that we may have an orphaned product, so it's good to know the workarounds.

 

Attached is a "Test" preset that you can use in conjunction with the PC Edit app to test the HF Driver status. Select the snapshot that corresponds with the mode you want to test, then, using the SYSTEM tab in PC Edit, manually operate the slider for the HF Driver from one end to the other while playing a chord. If L6 Link is operating correctly, you should hear a big difference in FLAT FRFR and USER IR modes, and NO difference in the other modes.

 

Don't let the above discourage you. The PC+ is a great sounding box when configured correctly.

Like any good tool, you need to learn how to use it properly to get the best results.

 

Enjoy your new toy!

 

 

Test Link Bug.hlx 11.47 kB · 0 downloads

 

Thanks so much for this @rd2rk! That's some great info to have - I'll be sure to get that output level set correctly before I start!

 

I'll be using my PC with an HX stomp, so I guess I won't have to worry about the L6 Link bug (there's no L6 Link on the Stomp).  I'm looking forward to finally being able to use the amp modelling though - I've spent the last 2 years using the Stomp with a traditional amp and cab in 4CM, so it's just been a glorified multi-fx unit!  I can't wait to hear all those awesome amp tones!

 

My band rehearsal is tonight so I'm going to get there an hour early and get to grips with the PC :-)

 

Thanks again!

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@rd2rk - Just a quick question for you - I used the PC212+ with my HX Stomp at rehearsal last night and I liked it a lot! 

 

However towards the end of the night I tried running the output from the PC to the desk as well, to see how that sounded through FOH.  It sounded awful - really fizzy and nasty - almost as though there was no IR on it.  The sound from the PC was still fine, so it was only through the FOH speakers.

 

If I run my HX Stomp directly to the desk, it sounds fine, so I'm guessing maybe there's something I need to set on the PC?  I had a look through the manual and the menus on the PC but couldn't seem to get it nailed.

 

Any ideas?

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The default PC+ Preset to use with Cabs/IRs in the Stomp signal Chain is 000 - Flat Stereo.

If you're using some other PC+ Preset, don't use Cabs/IRs on the Stomp.

Doing a Factory Reset on the PC+ will get you back to the defaults, and everything should work properly from there.

Remember that if you're using a PC+ Preset that calls a Speaker emulation, the PC+ XLR/USB Outs will send an emulation of the Speaker with an added mic emulation.

To compare what's coming out the XLRs, record the output over USB (DAW needs to be set to use the PC+ as the ASIO device).

The PC+ will always sound different in the room than FOH/USB.

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5 hours ago, rd2rk said:

The default PC+ Preset to use with Cabs/IRs in the Stomp signal Chain is 000 - Flat Stereo.

If you're using some other PC+ Preset, don't use Cabs/IRs on the Stomp.

Doing a Factory Reset on the PC+ will get you back to the defaults, and everything should work properly from there.

Remember that if you're using a PC+ Preset that calls a Speaker emulation, the PC+ XLR/USB Outs will send an emulation of the Speaker with an added mic emulation.

To compare what's coming out the XLRs, record the output over USB (DAW needs to be set to use the PC+ as the ASIO device).

The PC+ will always sound different in the room than FOH/USB.

 

Thanks @rd2rk - Yeah I was on Preset 000 - Flat Stereo, and it sounded great just through the PC, but when I hooked it up to the desk, I turned down the volume on the PC and wandered out in front of the FOH speakers to hear that, and it just sounded really harsh and unpleasant - almost exactly like it does when you don't add an IR to a preset in the stomp and then try to use it through an FRFR speaker.  I can't seem to figure out what I'm doing wrong.   I'll try recording it and comparing

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Attach an example preset and I'll run it through my system.

Also, keep in mind that what doesn't sound good to you soloed, might sound perfect with the whole band. It's a well known phenomenon.

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21 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Attach an example preset and I'll run it through my system.

Also, keep in mind that what doesn't sound good to you soloed, might sound perfect with the whole band. It's a well known phenomenon.

 

Thanks so much @rd2rk - I really appreciate your help with this!

 

Here's the preset I tried - sounded nice with the PC set to 000 - Flat Stereo, but when I hooked up the PC to the desk, it sounded pretty terrible through the FOH speakers.  I've included the IR as well (taken from my Suhr Reactive Load).  Be great to get your opinion!

Hard Rock.hlx Suhr V30 412 C Hi-Gn 121+57 Cel.wav

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Instead of sending the PC+ to FOH, take the feed from the HXS L/Mono Out (1/4" TS to 1/4" TS or XLR) or stereo if you prefer (1/4" TRS to dual 1/4" or dual XLRs).

Import the attached "Suhr IR" to the PC+ (I modded it with Voxengo so it would import) and set the PC+ to USER IR (vs FLAT STEREO) set to that IR. 

Then pull the IR block with your normal Suhr IR down into Path B and separate the Outputs.

Doing it this way got rid of the harshness (to my ears).

 

OR, you could use a darker IR in the Path B IR Block, or try adding a PEQ in Path B.

Either way, that'll give you a darker sound to FOH.

 

I've also attached a modded version of your Preset as a demo of the above method. You had an FX loop that I couldn't see a purpose for, waste of a Block.

 

EDIT: REMEMBER - your FOH speakers are ALWAYS going to sound different from the PC+

Hard Rock mod.hlx Suhr IR.wav

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Thanks @rd2rk!  I'll try your modded version over the weekend (the fx loop block was in there from when I was hooking up in 4CM to my amp, but you're right, it's not needed anymore)

 

I had tried to add the Suhr IR to the PC+ but it didn't seem to like the file - I'm guessing because it needed converting first, so thank you for that as well!

 

I'll have a play with a PEQ on path B as well - that sounds like it would be a good option too

 

Thank you for all your advice on this - you've been a huge help, and I feel like I'm finally close to getting this where it needs to be!

 

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On 9/3/2021 at 3:45 AM, rd2rk said:

Instead of sending the PC+ to FOH, take the feed from the HXS L/Mono Out (1/4" TS to 1/4" TS or XLR) or stereo if you prefer (1/4" TRS to dual 1/4" or dual XLRs).

Import the attached "Suhr IR" to the PC+ (I modded it with Voxengo so it would import) and set the PC+ to USER IR (vs FLAT STEREO) set to that IR. 

Then pull the IR block with your normal Suhr IR down into Path B and separate the Outputs.

Doing it this way got rid of the harshness (to my ears).

 

OR, you could use a darker IR in the Path B IR Block, or try adding a PEQ in Path B.

Either way, that'll give you a darker sound to FOH.

 

I've also attached a modded version of your Preset as a demo of the above method. You had an FX loop that I couldn't see a purpose for, waste of a Block.

 

EDIT: REMEMBER - your FOH speakers are ALWAYS going to sound different from the PC+

Hard Rock mod.hlxUnavailable Suhr IR.wavUnavailable

 

Thanks again @rd2rk - the modded preset is great!  The sound is still super harsh when going into the FOH, I just can't seem to dial it out, I've tried 3 different desks/PA systems (although I have to admit, none of them were particularly high end).

 

I'm going to trial it at a gig on Friday and see how it performs - maybe that harshness will disappear in the full mix.  I've still got a 10 day window to return it if I need to, but I'm hoping I don't have to because I really love the sound of it (when it isn't going into the desk).

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