Anyone using a Jackson PC1 with Helix?

[Paulzx]

Is anyone here using a Jackson PC1 with their Helix?

 

I think I might have a problem with the guitar actually because those bridge pick ups are Dimarzio super 3's I think and they are supposed

to be very hot and aggressive, yet my high gain tones sound a bit under powered when I use the PC1.

 

When i use my budget Jackson JS32, the same high gain patches sound really good, so unless I need a different approach to get a PC1 

to sound any good with a Helix, there must be a problem with that pick up surely? I wondered if anyone else here was using a PC1

so I could get a direct comparison/opinion etc?

[cruisinon2]

I seriously doubt there's anything wrong with the pickups  themselves...its hard to destroy guitar pickups unless you actually try. There could be any number of wiring/ toggle switch/ input jack issues however, that having nothing to do with the pickups themselves. You might also have a simple setup/ pickup height issue. If you're not familiar with what goes on under the hood, take it to someone who is.

 

But no matter what the cause of the symptoms may be, someone else's subjective assessment of the same guitar's performanc cannot even remotely be considered a "direct comparison", and it won't help you gain much insight into what's going on with your particular instrument. If you really want to compare the pickups' output to those in another instrument, get a multimeter and measure the outputs... that's the only way to know if one is actually hotter than the other.

 

Failing that, you could just plug the PC1 into something other than Helix, and see if it still sounds anemic... if not, then the problem is not likely the guitar, though this is a far less scientific approach as it introduces other variables.

[Paulzx]

3 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

I seriously doubt there's anything wrong with the pickups  themselves...its hard to destroy guitar pickups unless you actually try. There could be any number of wiring/ toggle switch/ input jack issues however, that having nothing to do with the pickups themselves. You might also have a simple setup/ pickup height issue. If you're not familiar with what goes on under the hood, take it to someone who is.

 

But no matter what the cause of the symptoms may be, someone else's subjective assessment of the same guitar's performanc cannot even remotely be considered a "direct comparison", and it won't help you gain much insight into what's going on with your particular instrument. If you really want to compare the pickups' output to those in another instrument, get a multimeter and measure the outputs... that's the only way to know if one is actually hotter than the other.

 

Failing that, you could just plug the PC1 into something other than Helix, and see if it still sounds anemic... if not, then the problem is not likely the guitar, though this is a far less scientific approach as it introduces other variables.

 

Yep, had a few of the same thoughts, I mean when I say compare how it sounds, I know that usually is very subjective, but seriously, I'm not even in subjective

territory with this guitar because the high gain output is so underwhelming even compared to my newer JS32 budget guitar, I shouldn't be hearing that or even

thinking it. Most people's experience with that Dimarzio in this guitar seems to be that it's too hot and high gain, so there's definitely something off here.

 

On another forum for Jackson guitars, someone mentioned it's probably the electronics in the older Jackson, seemingly not working properly with the newer modellers,

whereas the newer PC1's electronics presumably are updated and do work as expected. I don't know yet if there's any truth in that, it is true that the guitar is one of the older models

and the Helix relatively new, the newer JS32 works fine so maybe there is something in that.

 

I'll try it through through something different like you've suggested, I've got an older Spider 3 amp somewhere at home, will try that.

[cruisinon2]

20 minutes ago, Paulzx said:

On another forum for Jackson guitars, someone mentioned it's probably the electronics in the older Jackson, seemingly not working properly with the newer modellers,

whereas the newer PC1's electronics presumably are updated and do work as expected.

 

I won't pretend to be able to diagnose your problem remotely... all anyone can do is offer guesses. But this is really grasping at straws and  doesn't make any sense at all. With few exceptions, guitar pickup technology hasn't changed appreciably in decades...a humbucker is a humbucker. There's no earthly reason that "old pickups" won't work properly with a modeler. I have several guitars that are more than 20+ years old, with all the original electronics, and they work just fine with Helix, and any other modelers or plug-ins that I've used in recent years.

 

 

 

 

[Paulzx]

20 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

I won't pretend to be able to diagnose your problem remotely... all anyone can do is offer guesses. But this is really grasping at straws and  doesn't make any sense at all. With few exceptions, guitar pickup technology hasn't changed appreciably in decades...a humbucker is a humbucker. There's no earthly reason that "old pickups" won't work properly with a modeler. I have several guitars that are more than 20+ years old, with all the original electronics, and they work just fine with Helix, and any other modelers or plug-ins that I've used in recent years.

 

 

 

 

 

Agreed, like if I was to put that super 3 in another guitar it would work perfectly but in this guitar it's a bit lame. I think they were suggesting it might be just the internal sustainer electronics not being properly compatible with newer electronic devices.

 

I don't know, it does seem like a stretch doesn't it? I've actually got a DT50 combo I don't use, I'll try it in that too

[cruisinon2]

29 minutes ago, Paulzx said:

I don't know, it does seem like a stretch doesn't it?

 

Just a bit, lol.

 

It's bad enough that modeling, as good as it currently is, still draws ire from the "analog purists" of the world... but if it were actually the case that one's prized '72 Les Paul simply wouldn't work with a modeler because the electronics were "too old", the industry would never hear the end of it...

[Paulzx]

Yep it remains a mystery, I tried the PC1 in my spider 2 amp and although i don't really like the sound coming out of that amp,

the guitar is hotter and more punchy.

 

The go to method on helix for high gain patches has always been - add a screamer distortion pedal at zero gain, to front of chain, followed by your high gain

amp block plus whatever cab or IR, that method has worked for the most part with my other guitars, but with the PC1 I'm finding that I either want to crank the

gain on the screamer, or the amp block itself, up to max - or even add a second distortion pedal to the chain!

 

I never normally do any of that, but with the PC1 it's just lacking punch in the high gain and I end up trying the above, that shows you how underwhelming

it is, yet the guitar itself has a reputation of being the opposite!

[cruisinon2]

15 minutes ago, Paulzx said:

Yep it remains a mystery, I tried the PC1 in my spider 2 amp and although i don't really like the sound coming out of that amp,

the guitar is hotter and more punchy.

 

The go to method on helix for high gain patches has always been - add a screamer distortion pedal at zero gain, to front of chain, followed by your high gain

amp block plus whatever cab or IR, that method has worked for the most part with my other guitars, but with the PC1 I'm finding that I either want to crank the

gain on the screamer, or the amp block itself, up to max - or even add a second distortion pedal to the chain!

 

I never normally do any of that, but with the PC1 it's just lacking punch in the high gain and I end up trying the above, that shows you how underwhelming

it is, yet the guitar itself has a reputation of being the opposite!

 

Well I'm out of ideas, then.... it's obviously not the guitar, as it works with other amps. Yet at the same time, it's hard to blame the Helix because your other instruments don't produce the same symptoms. 

 

You could always throw a gain block at the front of the chain... it's "inexpensive" in terms of DSP, and might help some...but what's causing the problem is beyond me. I own a dozen guitars, with a variety of pickup types, configurations, some old, some new, etc...and I've never experienced anything remotely like what you're describing.

[Paulzx]

18 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Well I'm out of ideas, then.... it's obviously not the guitar, as it works with other amps. Yet at the same time, it's hard to blame the Helix because your other instruments don't produce the same symptoms. 

 

You could always throw a gain block at the front of the chain... it's "inexpensive" in terms of DSP, and might help some...but what's causing the problem is beyond me. I own a dozen guitars, with a variety of pickup types, configurations, some old, some new, etc...and I've never experienced anything remotely like what you're describing.

 

Same here, I own seven guitars and yet the most expensive one is the one that just doesn't sound right! In an ideal world I would borrow another PC1

and see if it's the same but of course that is a bit impractical as I don't know anyone locally with one. I'll try the gain block idea though.

 

In a really desperate attempt to get a better result, I might change these Alto speakers for something smaller. I've never felt the Alto's were giving me the

best sound anyway, and they are big PA speakers for a home setup. I know.. clutching at straws again!!

[datacommando]

3 minutes ago, Paulzx said:

In an ideal world I would borrow another PC1

Maybe you could visit your local guitar store and check out your PC1 against another. That is only if they have one in stock of course.

[Paulzx]

4 hours ago, datacommando said:

Maybe you could visit your local guitar store and check out your PC1 against another. That is only if they have one in stock of course.

 

Yep I think I need a direct comparison really.