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tarp21

Helix for live bass questions

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Hey all. Just got a helix and still learning it, probably for some time. Got it mainly for church with guitar and found out it has great bass tones as well. I would like to use it live but unsure if it’s capable of doing like my current rig. I’ve searched the manual and forums to no avail. My band goes ampless with in ears. I use a MB 800+ preamp with two xlr outs on it, to the mixer. One is set pre effects to FOH and post effects to in ears. I can adjust all gig long if necessary without affecting FOH. Are the xlr’s out of the helix capable of this? I see no pre/post selectors on the helix itself and find nothing in the settings to do this. Is the helix post only and if I change on the helix it also changes FOH? If so then I’ll stay with my current setup. Thanks. 

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I’ll check that out once back at home. Will that configuration allow me to make adjustments to in ears without affecting FOH? Thanks!

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Path A has Fx, and goes out the L/Mono XLR.

Path B has no Fx, and uses the RIGHT XLR.

Any Fx you add BEFORE the split go to BOTH.

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45 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Path A has Fx, and goes out the L/Mono XLR.

Path B has no Fx, and uses the RIGHT XLR.

Any Fx you add BEFORE the split go to BOTH.

Thanks! I'll check that out!

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1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

Path A has Fx, and goes out the L/Mono XLR.

Path B has no Fx, and uses the RIGHT XLR.

Any Fx you add BEFORE the split go to BOTH.

This works well! But I am limited on Path B what amp/cab I can use as it runs out of DSP. All depends what I use in Path A. But at least I have independent control of tones though. Cool! I'll find something I can live with. 

 

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3 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Why would you want different amp/cab to FOH vs IEM?

 

Just do this:

 

 

 

R Pre L Post2.hlx 10.55 kB · 0 downloads

I did. I don't want different amp/cabs I didn't explain. Found what amp/cab I could use on both paths and still have great sound and DSP left. I want bass tone to FOH but not necessarily the same EQ. It might sound completely different! In ear speakers vs 18" subs. What sounds great in one doesn't mean it'll sound that great through the other end. I've been doing this for years and it always sounds fantastic. I'll keep FOH, R PRE set flat and make the EQ adjustments at the mixer via iPad out front using the looper function while the band is playing, that's cool. This way I'll have the exact same base to start off at every venue. Plus we save snapshots of our venues so if everything is set flat on my end, dialing in is no problem. Both paths get a +3 db boost during small solo's, a compressor, slight plate reverb on slow music to give it air. I don't run distortion of any kind, I have guitar players that handle that quite well, I want clean, clean tones.  Thanks again!

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2 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Why would you want different amp/cab to FOH vs IEM?

 

Just do this:

 

 

 

R Pre L Post2.hlx 10.55 kB · 0 downloads

With your example setup I'll have the exact same EQ for FOH and In Ears, which I don't prefer to run that way. I want independent control over everything. You gave me the idea and I ran with it LOL. 

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7 hours ago, tarp21 said:

With your example setup I'll have the exact same EQ for FOH and In Ears, which I don't prefer to run that way. I want independent control over everything. You gave me the idea and I ran with it LOL. 

 

Not so. You can EQ each path entirely separately, using either Helix EQs or external EQs.

.

It looks like you modded the first sample I sent, not the second, which uses two separate paths.

With two entirely separate paths and outputs, you can still EQ either path separately either using Helix EQs or external EQs or both. Additionally, since (in your alternative) all of your blocks are dependent on a single processor, your DSP and # of available blocks are limited. Also, since you've used the one available split in that path, you can't run parallel paths in each signal chain as I show in the attached.

 

Bottom line, whatever works for you. The important part of my suggestions is the split and panned outputs. The example presets were not intended as definitive solutions, simply food for thought, and clearly, they accomplished that goal. Now you should look carefully at the attached example preset to see how to optimize the resources available to you. For example, I've split both paths and placed reverb and delay in separate sub paths. This is a common method of cleaning up a signal by not having the delay repeats reverbed into ambient mud. You may not NEED this right now, but, again, it's there as an example and food for thought.

 

 

R Pre L Post3.hlx

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23 hours ago, rd2rk said:

Path A has Fx, and goes out the L/Mono XLR.

Path B has no Fx, and uses the RIGHT XLR.

Any Fx you add BEFORE the split go to BOTH.

Thanks! I figured there was a way to do it. Now question is to have a very dry, raw signal go to FOH or at least have the amp and cab in the path only and set to flat eq and make my adjustments through the mixer like I normally do? I’ll have to experiment with an active speaker to see if I can make tonal adjustments through in ears side without changing the speaker. Thanks again. 

 

1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

 

Not so. You can EQ each path entirely separately, using either Helix EQs or external EQs.

.

It looks like you modded the first sample I sent, not the second, which uses two separate paths.

With two entirely separate paths and outputs, you can still EQ either path separately either using Helix EQs or external EQs or both. Additionally, since (in your alternative) all of your blocks are dependent on a single processor, your DSP and # of available blocks are limited. Also, since you've used the one available split in that path, you can't run parallel paths in each signal chain as I show in the attached.

 

Bottom line, whatever works for you. The important part of my suggestions is the split and panned outputs. The example presets were not intended as definitive solutions, simply food for thought, and clearly, they accomplished that goal. Now you should look carefully at the attached example preset to see how to optimize the resources available to you. For example, I've split both paths and placed reverb and delay in separate sub paths. This is a common method of cleaning up a signal by not having the delay repeats reverbed into ambient mud. You may not NEED this right now, but, again, it's there as an example and food for thought.

 

 

R Pre L Post3.hlx 21 kB · 0 downloads

I thought you sent the same link, didn’t realize you sent one with separate paths. Been away from home and the helix. I’ll check out your second and third and get back to you. I did notice the split and panned outputs in the first one you sent. I still have a guitar wireless and power conditioner strip to incorporate into this helix setup that’s still on my pedalboard. Wondering if I can do similar with a helix stomp since it’s such a small footprint. But I know I get less blocks to work with, no XLR’s etc. I may have to look at racking those items and placing them by my bass on the back line. Thanks for your help!

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Using an HXS you'd  use the SEND as the output of Path B. Using two amps would be very limiting DSP wise.

Be aware that using a wireless defeats the Input Impedance circuit by loading the guitar's pickups at 1M up front. Probably doesn't matter for bass though, as I don't think any of the bass fx are <1M input impedance, and the attenuated hi frequencies matter more on a guitar than a bass anyway.

If you put your Helix in the backline, you might consider getting a MIDI Foot controller for up front control.

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Got it all figured out. Had a gig last weekend. Sent one signal to FOH and another, totally different EQ etc. to IEM's. Even figured up another one where I can add my cab on stage if needed. The helix is extremely flexible and sounds incredible. Thanks for your help. 

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