Power cab as stage monitor for full mix?

[scottwilliams]

Hi - 

 

I am considering a PC (or PC+).  Would be mostly for electric guitar gigs, but I'm using a bose l1 pro for acoustic gigs and sometimes might want extra monitor for that.  What I'm wondering is if for acoustic duo gigs if the PC full range mode would work OK to run the whole mix (acoustic guitar/looper, 2 vox)?   Is anybody doing this?  Results? 

 

Not a dealbreaker for me, but easier to justify if i can get more 'mileage'

 

Thanks!

[amsdenj]

It would work, but would be a bit colored compared to a PA wedge, and more directional. 

[PaulTBaker]

I thought that if you set it to "monitor" then it makes it FRFR.  Is that not the case?

 

I thought of doing that.  We use a behringer XR18 as our mixer.  I sometimes have aux four set as "grouped" (I think that is the correct term) where each channel represents what is coming out the fronts.  The thought here is to have a way to monitor (sortof) the FOH from the stage.  I usually put my pc+ (112 or 212) facing me at the front of the stage. I was thinking of sending that "grouped" aux to the PC to monitor the sound up front.  My question is how it would sound.  technically, it would have my guitar(helix) coming through the l6link with it's sound, then the "grouped" sound coming into the input 2.  Wonder what that would do to the guitar sound?  And, it wouldn't really tell me the FOH level of my guitar because it would have the l6link level coming out.

 

Sorry for the long ramble.... just wondering if anyone else has done this.

[PierM]

If it's set to FRFR it will work fine. Dont expect the same quality as a good stage monitor. Powercabs can be really boomy with busy signals, but your setup (acoustic + 2 voices) doesnt seem to complex, so it should be acceptable.

[rd2rk]

"FRFR" is a meaningless marketing term. Full Range means that it will reproduce 20-20k. Nothing we commoners can afford is truly Flat Response.

PC+ is made for guitar, and is tuned to sound like a guitar cab. IOW - it's not designed for vocals.

Will it sound OK? Only you can decide that.

Do you have a good recording of your band? Run it through the PC+. Play your guitar over it with L6 Link.

If it sounds good, it is good.

 

[OmniFace]

On 9/20/2021 at 9:34 AM, scottwilliams said:

Hi - 

 

I am considering a PC (or PC+).  Would be mostly for electric guitar gigs, but I'm using a bose l1 pro for acoustic gigs and sometimes might want extra monitor for that.  What I'm wondering is if for acoustic duo gigs if the PC full range mode would work OK to run the whole mix (acoustic guitar/looper, 2 vox)?   Is anybody doing this?  Results? 

 

Not a dealbreaker for me, but easier to justify if i can get more 'mileage'

 

Thanks!

 

If you get the PC212+, the 2nd input is designed for this.  You can run your speaker modeling on your guitar, but then have an FRFR signal for the mix to listen to.  I don't know if the 112 models support two inputs like this or not.

 

 

On 9/21/2021 at 10:30 AM, PaulTBaker said:

I thought that if you set it to "monitor" then it makes it FRFR.  Is that not the case?

 

I thought of doing that.  We use a behringer XR18 as our mixer.  I sometimes have aux four set as "grouped" (I think that is the correct term) where each channel represents what is coming out the fronts.  The thought here is to have a way to monitor (sortof) the FOH from the stage.  I usually put my pc+ (112 or 212) facing me at the front of the stage. I was thinking of sending that "grouped" aux to the PC to monitor the sound up front.  My question is how it would sound.  technically, it would have my guitar(helix) coming through the l6link with it's sound, then the "grouped" sound coming into the input 2.  Wonder what that would do to the guitar sound?  And, it wouldn't really tell me the FOH level of my guitar because it would have the l6link level coming out.

 

Sorry for the long ramble.... just wondering if anyone else has done this.

 

This is what input 2 on the PC212+ supports.  You get the colored speaker sim, but also the FRFR mix.  amsdenj's "colored" comment is true for the 112's which don't have the dual input setup (AFAIK).

 

On 9/21/2021 at 10:58 AM, rd2rk said:

"FRFR" is a meaningless marketing term. Full Range means that it will reproduce 20-20k. Nothing we commoners can afford is truly Flat Response.

PC+ is made for guitar, and is tuned to sound like a guitar cab. IOW - it's not designed for vocals.

Will it sound OK? Only you can decide that.

Do you have a good recording of your band? Run it through the PC+. Play your guitar over it with L6 Link.

If it sounds good, it is good.

 

 

Yes and no.  Obviously it won't produce below 70Hz very well (I believe that's the spec on these), but as far as I know they EQ the speaker to be flat within a few dB's tolerance.  So, I don't agree that it's entirely meaningless.  :)

[rd2rk]

6 hours ago, OmniFace said:

Yes and no.  Obviously it won't produce below 70Hz very well (I believe that's the spec on these), but as far as I know they EQ the speaker to be flat within a few dB's tolerance.  So, I don't agree that it's entirely meaningless.  :)

 

The Powercabs are tuned to sound best for guitar. That they CAN be used as mix monitors is nice, but they're far from optimum for that purpose.

Others have mentioned the TS 312. Though they're virtually the same as the FRFR112, the two speakers sound very different.

And though they're ALL marketed as FRFR, My PC212 sounds totally different than my FRFR112, and neither sounds even close to My Studio Monitors.

Different tools for different applications, but all FRFR. That's what I mean by "meaningless".

[PaulTBaker]

I believe the 112+ has the monitor option for input two.   If I have the foh feed sent to the pc, then I will hear what the audience is hearing ( at least close to anyway).  So I would hear my guitar in that mix.   I would also hear my guitar through the PC from my l6link.  So there really isn't a way for me to tell if my guitar is loud enough out front.  The guitar sound could be low in the foh mix but would be loud if I had it turned up on the l6link.   I believe that means I can't use the monitor option to get a read of the foh level for the guitar.  I could however, use it to hear the rest of the band.   

[rd2rk]

5 hours ago, PaulTBaker said:

I believe the 112+ has the monitor option for input two.   If I have the foh feed sent to the pc, then I will hear what the audience is hearing ( at least close to anyway).  So I would hear my guitar in that mix.   I would also hear my guitar through the PC from my l6link

 

 

Correct.

5 hours ago, PaulTBaker said:

So there really isn't a way for me to tell if my guitar is loud enough out front.  The guitar sound could be low in the foh mix but would be loud if I had it turned up on the l6link.

 

So it is, as it always has been. There's no cure for a bad FOH engineer. Unless you can fire him.

 

5 hours ago, PaulTBaker said:

 I believe that means I can't use the monitor option to get a read of the foh level for the guitar.  I could however, use it to hear the rest of the band.   

 

Yes.

 

[PaulTBaker]

The problem is I am the FOH guy, and the guitar guy in the band :)    So, I'm trying not to get fired :)

[rd2rk]

5 hours ago, PaulTBaker said:

The problem is I am the FOH guy, and the guitar guy in the band :)    So, I'm trying not to get fired :)

 

I'm intimately familiar with that particular conundrum. The only solution I ever found was to have a good friend whose ears I trusted come to the gigs as "adviser".

Problem was, by the time I bought him (and his GF) drinks all night, I could've hired a sound man!