boynigel Posted November 11, 2021 Share Posted November 11, 2021 I have an LT that i'm considering using with my Bad Cat Cub via 4CM. What concerns me is that the effects send of the Bad Cat has a peak-to-peak output of 10 Volts. This factor always had my Eventide H9's input in the red, and although i couldn't "hear" the clipping, it was still concerning to me as i was told by Eventide that if i was constantly in the red that it could damage the pedal. to be fair, the H9 is an instrument level only input (it's only real major flaw to me). Does anyone know if the Helix LT can withstand the 10 volt peak-to-peak output of my amp's effects send? i would imagine i could pad it internally somehow but i'm still a little concerned until someone can confirm or deny that my concern is warranted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted November 11, 2021 Share Posted November 11, 2021 That won’t damage the Helix. 10V works out to +20dBV, and the Helix’s input is like +19dBV before clipping, I believe (with the input pad on). So you may need to be careful about the level of the preamp signal on your amp. But +20dBV is a very hot signal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boynigel Posted November 11, 2021 Author Share Posted November 11, 2021 4 minutes ago, phil_m said: That won’t damage the Helix. 10V works out to +20dBV, and the Helix’s input is like +19dBV before clipping, I believe (with the input pad on). So you may need to be careful about the level of the preamp signal on your amp. But +20dBV is a very hot signal. i was given the 10 volt peak to peak value by Bad Cat. They said that was the number they got "with the amp gained up" so i'm assuming they meant w/the preamp dimed, or close to it. i generally don't go past 1 o'clock on my preamp volume of the amp so maybe i'd be okay? They're actually working on a fix for this but if i can avoid shipping my amp from coast to coast... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted November 11, 2021 Share Posted November 11, 2021 In addition to what @phil_m said, the S/R Blocks have a LEVEL control for both the SEND and RETURN Levels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boynigel Posted November 11, 2021 Author Share Posted November 11, 2021 Right, I just wanted to be sure the voltage can’t do any “physical” harm at the input, before any attenuation. Maybe that’s not even a possibility but I know next to nothing about electronics so… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted November 11, 2021 Share Posted November 11, 2021 13 minutes ago, boynigel said: Right, I just wanted to be sure the voltage can’t do any “physical” harm at the input, before any attenuation. Maybe that’s not even a possibility but I know next to nothing about electronics so… With a line level signal, it’s probably not possible to actually damage the input even if you’re clipping it for an extended period of time. But it will definitely sound bad if you’re clipping it. I really don’t understand your comment about the H9 in your first post, though. It seems to me that if you’re not hearing the clipping, you’re probably OK. You might be clipping some transients, and you don’t always hear that. I don’t think you’d really damage the H9’s input of you’re not hearing or clipping. It would probably take a really hot signal way above the clipping threshold to actually damage anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boynigel Posted November 12, 2021 Author Share Posted November 12, 2021 2 hours ago, phil_m said: I really don’t understand your comment about the H9 in your first post, though. My H9 input peak light was clipping/flickering virtually all the time in the Bad Cat's fx loop. Eventide said that flickering was an "early" warning of an actual, audible clip and not to sweat it...then in the same breath said that if the peak light was solid more of the time, rather than just flickering, that it could damage the pedal. My peak light was flickering a lot but when i kicked in an overdrive pedal, the peak light would indeed stay solid. Well known and documented w/the H9. They designed its input for a guitar signal level. I don't know what the hell they were thinking, especially given that it hosts a lot of time-based effects and we all know where those like to live. My Bad Cat's ridiculously hot effects loop output is equally to blame for the issue. I can run my H9 in other amps w/no issues but the Cat sounds SO good, it's a shame i can't put the H9 in its loop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rd2rk Posted November 12, 2021 Share Posted November 12, 2021 If you put the H9 in the LT's second FX Loop set to INST and place that after the 4cm Loop and before any LT POST FX, wouldn't that accomplish the same thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boynigel Posted November 12, 2021 Author Share Posted November 12, 2021 2 hours ago, rd2rk said: If you put the H9 in the LT's second FX Loop set to INST and place that after the 4cm Loop and before any LT POST FX, wouldn't that accomplish the same thing? Right, I’m aware of that. Only mentioned the H9 issue to illustrate, from a previous experience, why I was concerned with putting stuff in the Bad Cat’s hot effects loop. I’m not looking to use the H9 with the LT just yet but I’m sure it’ll happen eventually Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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