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Helix LT proper live usage


molul
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I recently switched from using a Fender amp to using a Headrush FR108 and I've been so happy in the rehearsals, but I played live for the first time with this setup last week and I'm unsure whether I used it properly.

 

I connected the Headrush output to the club's PA, and I was told the output was way too loud (it was clipping with very little volume on its channel). I tried turning down the Headrush volume (it was at 50%, went down to 25%) and, while it stopped clipping, the Headrush was barely audible as a stage monitor.

 

We didn't have much time to try other things, as other bands had to do the soundcheck, so I have this doubt: should I have just connected the Helix XLR output to the PA? I think volume would have been more controllable, but I would have lost the "full range flat response thing". Still, would it have been noticeable enough?

 

Currently I'm thinking that for next gig I would keep the Headrush at home and just rely on the PA for monitoring. Do you think it's a good idea?

 

How do you use Helix+FRFR monitor when playing live? 

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Here is how I hook mine up, as I like my guitar separate from the 'band monitor mix'.

 

XLR output > front of house sound

1/4" output > monitor wedge, that I bring as my own reference for tweaking and such.  That way no sound guy can alter my guitar/monitor sound and I get a good reference to make adjustments.

 

In my global settings I change the Main Volume knob output to control the 1/4" output only so I can adjust as I need for stage volume.  Also that way the FOH sound gets a consistent signal from me every time.  No guessing where 1:00 is when trying to determine their signal level. 

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Connect the HR to Helix by 1/4", then send the Helix XLR to FOH.

Set the Helix Output Knob to control the 1/4" Out. That sets the XLR to UNITY - it won't be affected by changes in the level sent to the HR.

You can set the HR to whatever level works.

If the FOH guy knows how his Input Gain Knob works, this should make him happy, as he'll get a consistent signal all night.

 

The main consideration then becomes your having your presets levelled properly.

If you soundcheck with a mid-output preset then switch to one that's much louder or quieter by comparison, that will be a problem as it will affect the level sent to FOH.

 

The problem with simply sending your signal to FOH (no independent stage monitor) is that you're totally dependent on the FOH guy to put the right amount of you into the stage monitors (which might sound awful for guitar). Unless everybody on stage has their own monitor and separate mix (uncommon unless you're on a good IEM system), if you're loud enough for you you'll probably be too loud for someone else (probably the singer).

 

EDIT: @themetallikidwas posting as I was typing!

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One of the problems here is the signal level you are sending to the mixing board.  Mixing boards almost universally work with Mic level inputs whereas powered speakers tend to work with Line level signals which are considerably higher than Mic level.  When I used my own dedicated powered speaker I configured my 1/4" output to Line level and connected the speaker to the 1/4"output and controlled the level with my Helix volume knob.  I disengaged the volume knob from the XLR output, set the XLR output to Mic level, and sent the full signal from the XLR output to the board and managed the signal at the board through the gain/trim knob for that channel.

That worked fine for many years but now I just use the XLR output to the board and get a customized mix from the board to my powered speaker as a regular floor monitor attached to the mixer and that works MUCH better as I get a better sense of how my guitar is sitting in the mix with everyone else.  Unless you're dealing with a troglodyte running the mixing board, the soundman should know how to set you up on a separate monitor output and adjust it to your needs during sound checks.

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FWIW... I run the Helix LT XLR output to my FRFR... I set the "big volume" to control that level only. 

 

I run the 1/4" output to a Radial DI... and leave the 1/4 outs set to "line level".... the volume is not connected to this, therefore it is a consistent level for the FOH. If I encounter a room where the tech says the gain is too hot, the Radial has a PAD that I can engage for them. 

 

No tech has ever told me the signal is too hot. ... which means the techs all have the knowledge and the gear to adjust it on their end to suit their needs, as it should be.

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Thanks for the replies! So, to get it right, the right approach would be to set the volume knob to only control either 1/4" or XLR, then have one output set to line level for your FR and the other to mic level for the mixer, right?

 

Is there any benefit on sending XLR or 1/4" to the mixing board?

 

I was a bit worried about directly connecting the Helix to the mixing board and not going through the FR, as the FR would play all frequencies unlike other monitors. Glad to see it's not that important :)

 

PS: I marked the topic to notify replies but I got no email, and I got them before the forum update. It's this happening to anyone else?

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On 4/14/2022 at 9:35 AM, molul said:

Thanks for the replies! So, to get it right, the right approach would be to set the volume knob to only control either 1/4" or XLR, then have one output set to line level for your FR and the other to mic level for the mixer, right?

 

Is there any benefit on sending XLR or 1/4" to the mixing board?

 

I was a bit worried about directly connecting the Helix to the mixing board and not going through the FR, as the FR would play all frequencies unlike other monitors. Glad to see it's not that important :)

 

PS: I marked the topic to notify replies but I got no email, and I got them before the forum update. It's this happening to anyone else?

 

Use XLR to FOH set to MIC level. Cable run is usually longer and the XLR is balanced for lower noise over distance.

Set the BIG KNOB to control the 1/4" to your FRFR. That way your stage level is right at your feet, and changes do not affect the FOH signal.

 

After the update I stopped receiving ALL notifications. I had to go in and reset the preferences.

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On 4/14/2022 at 10:35 AM, molul said:

Is there any benefit on sending XLR or 1/4" to the mixing board?

 

I agree with @rd2rkabove... always send an XLR line to the mixer

However, we differ on how we approach it. 

  • He sends from Helix XLR to Mixer and Helix 1/4" to his FRFR. 
  • I send my Helix XLR to my FRFR and my Helix 1/4" to a DI BOX which connects to the MIXER via XLR. 
  • Both of us set our "Big Volume" to control the signal going to the FRFR... so it never affects the signal going to the FOH (Mixer).

Why do I do it differently? Well, the Helix does not like Phantom Power and I hate surprises. Rather than have to worry about it I simply put a DI between my Helix and the Mixer. It's just a comfort thing for me. 

 

There are always many ways to accomplish the same thing :) 

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On 4/14/2022 at 5:17 PM, codamedia said:

 

I agree with @rd2rkabove... always send an XLR line to the mixer

However, we differ on how we approach it. 

  • He sends from Helix XLR to Mixer and Helix 1/4" to his FRFR. 
  • I send my Helix XLR to my FRFR and my Helix 1/4" to a DI BOX which connects to the MIXER via XLR. 
  • Both of us set our "Big Volume" to control the signal going to the FRFR... so it never affects the signal going to the FOH (Mixer).

Why do I do it differently? Well, the Helix does not like Phantom Power and I hate surprises. Rather than have to worry about it I simply put a DI between my Helix and the Mixer. It's just a comfort thing for me. 

 

There are always many ways to accomplish the same thing :) 

 

Yep. That works too!

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  • 1 month later...

Hi Guys, thanks for all your suggestions!.

 

I have a follow up question on this matter.

my rig:

I send XLR to PA and the 1/4 jacks to a small analog mixer on my floorboard that I use to mix the signal to my InEarMonitors (IEM)

My small analog mixer also receives a stereo 'monitor mix' from the PA guy, which basically is a copy of the main FOH mix, minus my own guitar sound.

Then I mix my original guitar sound + the monitor mix (minus guitar) to what I like in my IEM.

 

This enables me to:

- always hear my direct guitar sound (without any tonal tweaks done by the PA guy)

- adjust my guitar level on my small mixer and mix it together with the monitor mix I receive from PA.

- be independent: I do not have to wait for the PA Guy. From the moment I go onstage to setup, I can directly hear my guitar in my IEM, regardless from wheter the PA mixing board is already setup.

 

The problem:

The problem arises with all the other bandmembers being also on IEM (but ofcourse on different mixes). When I'm testing/jamming before soundcheck they always complain that my jamming is heard in their IEM's as well.

 

I love your suggestion of assigning the general Volume knob to ONLY XLR. That way I could turn it all the way down when jamming so I don't send anything to the PA, nor to the other band members IEM's.

 

Questions:

is there a way of assigning the general Volume knob to a pedal? (to a volume pedal or to an ON/OFF switch)

 

thanks.

 

 

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That should be the responsibility of whoever is doing the IEM mix. You said that the others are on "different mixes". Just have them take you out of their IEM mix. You don't have your own signal in the IEM mix that comes back to your personal mixer (PM), do you? Isn't that the purpose of your 1/4" to your PM?

 

If you assign the Volume Knob to XLR you can turn it OFF without affecting the 1/4" out, which will then be at UNITY. You can then control the level of that signal from your PM. Just remember to re-assign it to 1/4" after sound check so that the UNITY signal goes to FOH and you control your own level in your PM from the LT Volume knob. PITA, which is why I suggested to look at the IEM mix first.

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