HX Effects How do I set different tempos for different effects in a preset?

[hitlength]

So, I know it sounds weird. I only use 1 preset. I have a tremelo and a delay that I use regularly, but on different things. I don't want to have to switch presets just to get a different tempo. Can't I program the Trem to one tempo and the delay to another? It seems crazy that the tempo is locked in for every effect on that preset. Honestly, I don't even need presets. I just want to use it like a multi effects unit. Maybe I'm doing this wrong. I don't use snapshots, and don't even know how. I just built my "pedalboard" around the 6 slots I can place effects in. I don't even use all of them. It'd be great to have 3 delays with different tempos all right there without having to swap to a new preset.

 

If there's no way to set different tempos within a preset, is there a way to set up the unit to be nothing more than a single preset multi-effects board where each button press can have it's own tempo?

[hitlength]

This is the model I have...

[codamedia]

You have a lot of options to accomplish what you are after. The only effects that are tied to tempo are the ones YOU tie to tempo. 

You can set a hard value to any effect you want... many set different "fixed speeds" to  tremolo, phase, chorus, etc... etc.... and never tie it to the tempo. You can also do that with delays. 

 

Another option is to simply set different divisions to each effect when you do want it tied to tempo. One delay can be set to 1/16 note (fast), some to 1/8 or 1/4, and some to dotted 8th (syncopated). 

[codamedia]

On 6/25/2022 at 12:14 PM, hitlength said:

Honestly, I don't even need presets. I just want to use it like a multi effects unit. Maybe I'm doing this wrong. I don't use snapshots, and don't even know how. I just built my "pedalboard" around the 6 slots I can place effects in. I don't even use all of them.

 

There is nothing wrong with keeping it simple... but it almost sounds like you might not realize how capable the HX Effects really is. Watching a few video's can go a long way into expanding your knowledge.... take it slow, you don't have to learn it all at one time.

[datacommando]

On 6/25/2022 at 6:14 PM, hitlength said:

It seems crazy that the tempo is locked in for every effect on that preset.

Hi,

 

The tempo is not locked for every effect in the preset, it depends on how you set your time divisions. 
 

If you want things to work with any given tempo, 120BPM for example, you can set the note length to suit your speed.

 

You can set a dual delay to playback with both 1/4 and a dotted 1/8 note lengths but these are then controlled by whatever tempo you set either in the Global settings, or in the individual preset, or even by tapping the tempo in using the footswitch. Those note lengths will not deviate from whatever timing you choose to use. Therefore, if you opt to use “TAP” tempo and you punch in 110, or any other arbitrary timing the note lengths will always be correct.

 

On the other hand, should you decide with that dual delay example, that you want to set one at 250ms and the other at 500ms they will remain fixed at those timings no matter what tempo you play at.

For example at 120BPM the delay set to 250ms will equal 1/8 and the other at 500ms is a 1/4 note. If you change the response tempo to 110 then those millisecond times are not going to work, because at 110 an 1/8 note = 273ms and the 1/4 = 545ms.

Complex but very simple really.
 

Check the Owner’s Manual Page 17.

 

https://line6.com/data/6/0a020a411710a6112a67116f0b/application/pdf/HX Effects 3.0 Owner's Manual - Rev C - English .pdf

 

Here’s a handy calculator.

 

https://tuneform.com/tools/time-tempo-bpm-to-milliseconds-ms

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

[hitlength]

On 6/25/2022 at 2:03 PM, codamedia said:

You have a lot of options to accomplish what you are after. The only effects that are tied to tempo are the ones YOU tie to tempo. 

You can set a hard value to any effect you want... many set different "fixed speeds" to  tremolo, phase, chorus, etc... etc.... and never tie it to the tempo. You can also do that with delays. 

 

Another option is to simply set different divisions to each effect when you do want it tied to tempo. One delay can be set to 1/16 note (fast), some to 1/8 or 1/4, and some to dotted 8th (syncopated). 

Thanks for the reply. So, I don't have the unit in front of me at the moment. I won't be back to the rehearsal room until tomorrow morning. But is this what I need to dig into to change the tempo for each individual effect? Are there parameters if I click the right arrow that will allow the effect to not get tempo from the globally set tempo?

 

[datacommando]

On 6/25/2022 at 11:56 PM, hitlength said:

Are there parameters if I click the right arrow that will allow the effect to not get tempo from the globally set tempo?

 

Hi,

 

As I mentioned in the previous post, you can go to the Global settings and set the tempo to respond either globally, per preset, or snapshots. 
 

When in a preset that displays the time a milliseconds, but you want to display the timing in note values, simply press the first parameter knob (Time) to switch from one to the other. It actually states that in the “shortcut” box on the picture you posted above.

 

If it’s a situation where you want to “fine tune” the tempo BPM from whatever the current setting is, simply touch (but don’t press) the TAP footswitch and then change the BPM value on the screen.

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

[hitlength]

On 6/25/2022 at 7:51 PM, datacommando said:

 

Hi,

 

As I mentioned in the previous post, you can go to the Global settings and set the tempo to respond either globally, per preset, or snapshots. 
 

When in a preset that displays the time a milliseconds, but you want to display the timing in note values, simply press the first parameter knob (Time) to switch from one to the other. It actually states that in the “shortcut” box on the picture you posted above.

 

If it’s a situation where you want to “fine tune” the tempo BPM from whatever the current setting is, simply touch (but don’t press) the TAP footswitch and then change the BPM value on the screen.

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

Thanks. I'll try that. One other question, I also wanted to do this with the Opto Trem, but it doesn't appear to be able. I had thought that at some point the Opto Trem had updated and that was possible, but maybe that's only tap tempo? I'm guessing there's no way to set that separately other than a different preset with a different tempo?

[codamedia]

On 6/26/2022 at 9:00 AM, hitlength said:

Thanks. I'll try that. One other question, I also wanted to do this with the Opto Trem, but it doesn't appear to be able. I had thought that at some point the Opto Trem had updated and that was possible, but maybe that's only tap tempo? I'm guessing there's no way to set that separately other than a different preset with a different tempo?

 

Yes - the OPTO Trem can be set to a separate speed than the the "tempo".... and it also comes with subdivisions just like delays and other modulations do. 

 

[datacommando]

On 6/26/2022 at 3:00 PM, hitlength said:

I also wanted to do this with the Opto Trem, but it doesn't appear to be able.

 

Hi,

 

As pointed out by "codamedia" in the post above, the technique for swapping to note divisions is exactly the same. The only real difference with the Optical Trem is that first parameter knob is named "Speed" rather than "Time". This variation occurs throughout the Modulation effects, for example  Phasers are labeled "Rate", as are Flangers, and some Chorus FX are listed as"Chor Rate", and Ring Modulation is "Frequency". These may have different naming conventions but their functions are the same, i.e. division of time.

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

[datacommando]

On 6/25/2022 at 6:14 PM, hitlength said:

If there's no way to set different tempos within a preset, is there a way to set up the unit to be nothing more than a single preset multi-effects board where each button press can have it's own tempo?

 

Hi, again,

 

I just had another look at the picture attached to your OP and it struck me that all those FX assigned to the 6  footswitches are "Legacy" effects!  I also realise your post opened with "I know it sounds weird. I only use one preset"

Simple question - Why?

 

Legacy effects were essentially ported over from the old POD farm models. The whole point of Helix modelling hardware is it is a superior system, and you aren't taking advantage of it's full sonic potential.

 

Do me a favour and load up this preset (HXFX Demo) and you should see that the Mod and Delay effects are set to note divisions. You should then be able to see how it was done, after that you can play around with it as much as you like. Oh, yeah, one Opti Trem is set to 1/8th notes the other is set to 1/2 the Script Phase is a whole note sweep, and the Delay has 1/4 note repeats, and all they are all the Helix not Legacy effect blocks.

 

This should now make sense.

 

HXFX Demo.hlx

[codamedia]

On 6/26/2022 at 11:38 AM, datacommando said:

I just had another look at the picture attached to your OP and it struck me that all those FX assigned to the 6  footswitches are "Legacy" effects! ....

 

Just so the OP understands.... the choice of LEGACY effects is not the reason he can't sort out the timing.... they have the same timing options as the HELIX effects do. Even with those old effects, you can still choose a fixed time or a time subdivision that is linked to tempo. 

[datacommando]

On 6/26/2022 at 8:20 PM, codamedia said:

the choice of LEGACY effects is not the reason he can't sort out the timing

Oh, yes, that’s quite true, and not what I was intending to be the the point of my comment. 
 

As we are all aware - there are no right, or wrong ways, to utilise this digital modelling stuff. Each to their own, and whatever floats your boat, so to speak.

 

It simply struck me as quite bizarre for someone to invest in this technology and then deliberately, or maybe unintentionally, choose not use it to it’s full advantage. I’ve been my using my Helix for several years now and I reckon that I’ve still not reached it’s full potential. The thing is astonishing, but if I just wanted half a dozen previous/earlier generation effects blocks in one unit, then there would be many, many other roads to travel.

 

I am constantly amazed by some of the questions that constantly crop up in this and other forums, but it could just be me.

 

;-)

 

[hitlength]

On 6/26/2022 at 10:39 AM, codamedia said:

 

Yes - the OPTO Trem can be set to a separate speed than the the "tempo".... and it also comes with subdivisions just like delays and other modulations do. 

 

It seems like the delay works to hold the speed when I switch to ms and convert that from the bpm. But the Opto Trem only says "Speed" with a bar underneath or note divisions. I can't figure out how to input a specific tempo. Obviously I can scroll the bar faster or slower, but that's not particularly accurate. I've had this for years, and never updated it, so is it possible that there's an update that I need to do to gain this functionality? It's also possible I'm just not smart enough to figure it out. Either way, I won't have access to the unit for about a week and a half.

[datacommando]

On 6/30/2022 at 6:38 PM, hitlength said:

It's also possible I'm just not smart enough to figure it out.

The point about “Speed”, “Rate”, “Frequency” or whatever = note length (divisions of time), has been covered in the previous posts in the thread.

 

I’m sorry to say that if you don’t understand these time values, then you really don’t comprehend music. Time is how it works.

 

Example: Tempo set at 120BPM means that a delay set for 1/8 notes will repeat every 250ms.
 

If you change the Tempo to 110 BPM that same 1/8 notes will repeat every 275ms, but it will be synchronised.

 

Once more - change the Tempo to 130BPM the 1/8 note repeats every 231ms, but it will be synchronised.

 

Therefore, if you want your effects to follow the tempo use note divisions, 1/8, 1/32, 1/4, 1/2 or any other note division tied to the BPM (Tempo) to work perfectly in sync, whatever you choose. Fixed times do not work when you change tempo, unless you physically match them to the time.

 

Simple.

 

Please, download the preset I supplied and load it into your HXFX. Then simply play something through it, and without changing the note values on the effects, change the tempo and see how they stay locked together. If you want a longer/shorter synchronised delay time on the playback, change the note value, not the tempo.

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.