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Weird footswitch problem with stomp mode/command centre


Paulzx
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So I decided to get specific with one of my snapshot presets and move some stuff around in command centre.

So I go into stomp mode, and I want to re-arrange some snapshots into different positions on the lower footswitches as well as do some other stuff but i hit a problem.

 

In command centre I simply want to put one of my existing snapshots on to switch 8 and another on switch 9. The correct snapshots are assigned on a press/release, release is set to none, all good so far, the correct snapshots now show up on the scribble strips etc.

 

Problem now is when i actually hit either of the foot switches, the display turns to SNAPSHOT ARROW UP on both switches, and it stays there until I repeatedly press either footswitch up to ten times, then I eventually get the display back to the snapshots.

 

Have I done something wrong in command centre or global settings? I looked at a couple of youtube videos of people using command centre do a similar thing and this never came up when they did it!

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On 12/11/2022 at 10:29 PM, rd2rk said:

You have to configure each snapshot separately. Change one, change them all. This came about in v3.10 IIRC.

Thanks for the reply but I'm not sure specifically what you mean, in this instance? What else should I be doing to make it work properly then?

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On 12/12/2022 at 5:35 AM, Paulzx said:

Thanks for the reply but I'm not sure specifically what you mean, in this instance? What else should I be doing to make it work properly then?

 

In Global Settings>Preferences check the setting for SNAPSHOT EDITS.

If it's set to DISCARD, when editing snapshots you must SAVE the preset BEFORE moving to the next snapshot.

If set to RECALL you can edit all of your snapshots and THEN save the preset.

 

Then go into each snapshot and verify that the commands are as they should be.

 

EDIT: To be more precise - If in SS1 the button says SNAPSHOT2, and when you press it you are now in SNAPSHOT2 but the button says SNAPSHOT^, that means that in SS2 the button is set to SNAPSHOT NEXT. That is the default, and when you set a button to do something in one snapshot, all of the other snapshots are automatically set to the default value for the action you specified. In this case if you set a button in SS1 to go to SNAPSHOT2, in SS2 the button will be set for the default action of SNAPSHOT, which is NEXT. You must change the default as necessary for each snapshot.

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They 'layout' of your stomp mode can be specific to whatever snapshot your on.  So you could have snapshot 1 layout and when you go to snapshot 2 could potentially have all different buttons as your layout.  Thus, if you program buttons 8/9 in snapshot 1, they havent been assigned in snapshot 2.  The dropdown at the top of the command center window will show you what snapshot your on.  If you are going to do different layouts for each snapshot, then that is where you can plan those differences.  If you want the same layout in every snapshot, you can simply program your layout in snapshot 1 then follow these steps:

 

Right click any footswitch, choose 'Copy All'

Right click any footswitch again and choose 'Clear All' (this will exit the command center screen)

Go back into Command Center, right click any footswitch and choose 'Paste All'.  it will then apply your layout to all snapshots.  

 

Depending on how many changes you have, it might be quicker to just change the dropdown at the top, or to copy/clear/paste.  

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On 12/12/2022 at 5:16 PM, rd2rk said:

 

In Global Settings>Preferences check the setting for SNAPSHOT EDITS.

If it's set to DISCARD, when editing snapshots you must SAVE the preset BEFORE moving to the next snapshot.

If set to RECALL you can edit all of your snapshots and THEN save the preset.

 

Then go into each snapshot and verify that the commands are as they should be.

 

EDIT: To be more precise - If in SS1 the button says SNAPSHOT2, and when you press it you are now in SNAPSHOT2 but the button says SNAPSHOT^, that means that in SS2 the button is set to SNAPSHOT NEXT. That is the default, and when you set a button to do something in one snapshot, all of the other snapshots are automatically set to the default value for the action you specified. In this case if you set a button in SS1 to go to SNAPSHOT2, in SS2 the button will be set for the default action of SNAPSHOT, which is NEXT. You must change the default as necessary for each snapshot.

Excellent thanks, going to look at this

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On 12/12/2022 at 6:45 PM, themetallikid said:

They 'layout' of your stomp mode can be specific to whatever snapshot your on.  So you could have snapshot 1 layout and when you go to snapshot 2 could potentially have all different buttons as your layout.  Thus, if you program buttons 8/9 in snapshot 1, they havent been assigned in snapshot 2.  The dropdown at the top of the command center window will show you what snapshot your on.  If you are going to do different layouts for each snapshot, then that is where you can plan those differences.  If you want the same layout in every snapshot, you can simply program your layout in snapshot 1 then follow these steps:

 

Right click any footswitch, choose 'Copy All'

Right click any footswitch again and choose 'Clear All' (this will exit the command center screen)

Go back into Command Center, right click any footswitch and choose 'Paste All'.  it will then apply your layout to all snapshots.  

 

Depending on how many changes you have, it might be quicker to just change the dropdown at the top, or to copy/clear/paste.  

Probably more confusing to explain than actually do.. but yes, for the preset i'm working on, it's just stomp mode with one layout but the layout will have a couple of snapshots on some switches and the rest of the switches will just show individual effects/stomp boxes, so between this and what Rd2rk had said before, I think the problem is obviously in the way the snapshots are set up.

 

Going to investigate this properly tomorrow, and when I've completely ruined it I'll come back and ask for more help lol. 

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Well, it kind of worked then didn't. Taking the advice above of right clicking, copying all then deleting all and them pasting back in the command centre, did work initially because it allowed me in stomp mode to put four presets on specific foot switches that were out of order from their original positions, so I moved S/shot 3 into position of the first snap shot and so on - and it worked in that i didn't get them all suddenly shop up as snaphot^ on the scribble strips like they did before.

 

Even though in globals i had snap shot edits on recall, it is a bit glitchy saving the layout in command centre, it seems i had to run through the switch assigments multiple times before they all stayed where they should, unless that's just me being unfamiliar with what i'm doing.

 

I originally wanted the first three lower snapshots on the foot switches to just operate normally i.e. press & release but wanted the last footswitch for solos as a press & hold so when you come off the switch, it goes back to a specific snapshot - which you can specify in the release command which S/S that should be. I did get that to work BUT... the foot switches started acting up.

 

As soon as I had that layout working, along with the final press & release switch, some of the foot switches then required a double tap to engage them. Some of the others worked with the usual single press. Obviously this is no good. Now I'm thinking the actual switches are sticky but no, when i go back to preset mode with all my original S/S laid out, the switches are fine, it's just in stomp mode with the command centre layout, they don't all work with one press.

 

So I gave up! Maybe someone can explain where I went wrong with that? Obviously I'm not proficient using command centre so this is probably me at fault but I do have to say, as great as I think the command centre feature is, it's bloody hard to get your head around when it doesn't work as expected.

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On 12/14/2022 at 5:17 AM, Paulzx said:

Well, it kind of worked then didn't. Taking the advice above of right clicking, copying all then deleting all and them pasting back in the command centre, did work initially because it allowed me in stomp mode to put four presets on specific foot switches that were out of order from their original positions, so I moved S/shot 3 into position of the first snap shot and so on - and it worked in that i didn't get them all suddenly shop up as snaphot^ on the scribble strips like they did before.

 

Even though in globals i had snap shot edits on recall, it is a bit glitchy saving the layout in command centre, it seems i had to run through the switch assigments multiple times before they all stayed where they should, unless that's just me being unfamiliar with what i'm doing.

 

I originally wanted the first three lower snapshots on the foot switches to just operate normally i.e. press & release but wanted the last footswitch for solos as a press & hold so when you come off the switch, it goes back to a specific snapshot - which you can specify in the release command which S/S that should be. I did get that to work BUT... the foot switches started acting up.

 

As soon as I had that layout working, along with the final press & release switch, some of the foot switches then required a double tap to engage them. Some of the others worked with the usual single press. Obviously this is no good. Now I'm thinking the actual switches are sticky but no, when i go back to preset mode with all my original S/S laid out, the switches are fine, it's just in stomp mode with the command centre layout, they don't all work with one press.

 

So I gave up! Maybe someone can explain where I went wrong with that? Obviously I'm not proficient using command centre so this is probably me at fault but I do have to say, as great as I think the command centre feature is, it's bloody hard to get your head around when it doesn't work as expected.

The globals and snapshot recall setting doesnt affect how command center saves the assignments, unless I read your 2nd paragraph wrong.  

 

your 3rd paragraph - you can assign this, you need to individually assign the press and release options. I  do this as a temp lead fill.  say SS 1 is my rhythm tone, and SS 2 is my lead tone.  On your SS 2 assignment, you need to set the Press>SS 2, Release>SS1.  

 

Your 4th paragraph, I wonder if you are running into the same issue I did with a different global setting.  There is a setting that allows you to choose what a 2nd press does of a button/SS.  You can either have it just recall the current snapshot or have it revert to the previous SS used.  Great for scenarios where you have the Rhythm/Lead tone and only want to stomp button 2 to turn on lead and then revert back to rhythm, but I'd rather 'hold' like mentioned above.  However, if you have it set to the revert to previous SS setting, when you step on a SS, its possible, that you arent doing so quick enough and Helix is reading it as a 2nd press and reverting to the previous/original SS.  Once I changed that global setting, this behavior mostly disappeared for me.  

 

I think your on the right path to getting it sorted out, but yes, due to features added....troubleshooting the results can be confusing if you dont understand how features work that you arent intending to use.  

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On 12/14/2022 at 4:17 AM, Paulzx said:

So I gave up! Maybe someone can explain where I went wrong with that? Obviously I'm not proficient using command centre so this is probably me at fault but I do have to say, as great as I think the command centre feature is, it's bloody hard to get your head around when it doesn't work as expected.

 

Attach the preset and I'll fix it for you and/or explain where you're going wrong.

Also, describe in detail and in one place exactly what you want each FS to do in each snapshot.

It could be that you're wanting to do things that can't be done, or the # of posts with bits and pieces here and there is confusing me.

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On 12/14/2022 at 3:26 PM, themetallikid said:

The globals and snapshot recall setting doesnt affect how command center saves the assignments, unless I read your 2nd paragraph wrong.  

 

your 3rd paragraph - you can assign this, you need to individually assign the press and release options. I  do this as a temp lead fill.  say SS 1 is my rhythm tone, and SS 2 is my lead tone.  On your SS 2 assignment, you need to set the Press>SS 2, Release>SS1.  

 

Your 4th paragraph, I wonder if you are running into the same issue I did with a different global setting.  There is a setting that allows you to choose what a 2nd press does of a button/SS.  You can either have it just recall the current snapshot or have it revert to the previous SS used.  Great for scenarios where you have the Rhythm/Lead tone and only want to stomp button 2 to turn on lead and then revert back to rhythm, but I'd rather 'hold' like mentioned above.  However, if you have it set to the revert to previous SS setting, when you step on a SS, its possible, that you arent doing so quick enough and Helix is reading it as a 2nd press and reverting to the previous/original SS.  Once I changed that global setting, this behavior mostly disappeared for me.  

 

I think your on the right path to getting it sorted out, but yes, due to features added....troubleshooting the results can be confusing if you dont understand how features work that you arent intending to use.  

Okay you've convinced me to have another go then..

 

Yep i was individually assigning press and release options to each switch, mind you, I had it on press and the snapshot number, release set to none (as steve sterlacci said in his demo) You're saying set the release to go back to the previous snap shot - i'll try that.

 

The double press needed on two of the switches - never had any double press set ups, think it's set to recall current but I'm going to check this in the globals now

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On 12/14/2022 at 4:30 PM, rd2rk said:

 

Attach the preset and I'll fix it for you and/or explain where you're going wrong.

Also, describe in detail and in one place exactly what you want each FS to do in each snapshot.

It could be that you're wanting to do things that can't be done, or the # of posts with bits and pieces here and there is confusing me.

Thanks for volunteering to do that, I'm probably going to HAVE to take you up on that lol, I'm going to try again per metallkids suggestions and if it's still messed up I'll put it up here for you to cross examine!

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@Paulzx - Here's a little something to think about, a small demo of FS logic as relates to use with the Snapshot change function in Stomp mode, and how to think about describing what you want to do as clearly as possible - not easy, as you'll see.

Demo preset attached.

The demo assumes that you have Stomp Mode set to 10 footswitches.

I have named the snapshots as SS1=Clean; SS2=Crunch; SS3=Lead.

 

NOTES: When assigning CommandCenter functions to Stomp Mode switches, DO NOT use a FS that is assigned to Bypass or Parameter controls!

The results can be unpredictable and difficult to remedy, up to and including irrecoverable preset corruption!

Also, the Scribble Strip names are what they are, based on the Snapshot names I've assigned.

Hopefully, someday L6 will heed the hue and cry of users to allow Custom Naming for Stomp Mode SS CommandCenter assigned switches.

Do a search on Ideascale and VOTE FOR IT! Vote for all 17 suggestions for it posted by people who've somehow made it into the 21st century without understanding the concept of SEARCH BEFORE POSTING! :-)

 

SS1 - Clean

FS1 ON PRESS goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS2 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead)

 

SS2 -Crunch

FS1 ON PRESS goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS2 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead)

 

SS3 - Lead

FS1 DOES NOTHING!

FS2 ON PRESS DOES NOTHING; ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS DOES NOTHING; ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 DOES NOTHING!

 

So, now you're thinking "If, in SS3 (Lead), FS1 and 4 do nothing, why can't I use them for something else?"

You can, AS LONG AS THE SOMETHING ELSE IS A SNAPSHOT FUNCTION!

You cannot use them to change presets or perform ANY other function. If you try to do that, the function will change in ALL snapshots!

 

You might well be wondering, after examining the snapshots in CommandCenter, where the RELEASE logic is for FS2 and 3?

When you press those switches you are taken to SS3 (Lead). Therefore, the RELEASE logic is attached to those switches in SS3. That's why the ON PRESS function for FS2 and 3 in SS3 does nothing.

 

Are we having fun yet?

 

 

Paulzx1.hlx

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On 12/14/2022 at 6:15 PM, rd2rk said:

@Paulzx - Here's a little something to think about, a small demo of FS logic as relates to use with the Snapshot change function in Stomp mode, and how to think about describing what you want to do as clearly as possible - not easy, as you'll see.

Demo preset attached.

The demo assumes that you have Stomp Mode set to 10 footswitches.

I have named the snapshots as SS1=Clean; SS2=Crunch; SS3=Lead.

 

NOTES: When assigning CommandCenter functions to Stomp Mode switches, DO NOT use a FS that is assigned to Bypass or Parameter controls!

The results can be unpredictable and difficult to remedy, up to and including irrecoverable preset corruption!

Also, the Scribble Strip names are what they are, based on the Snapshot names I've assigned.

Hopefully, someday L6 will heed the hue and cry of users to allow Custom Naming for Stomp Mode SS CommandCenter assigned switches.

Do a search on Ideascale and VOTE FOR IT! Vote for all 17 suggestions for it posted by people who've somehow made it into the 21st century without understanding the concept of SEARCH BEFORE POSTING! :-)

 

SS1 - Clean

FS1 ON PRESS goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS2 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead)

 

SS2 -Crunch

FS1 ON PRESS goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS2 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead)

 

SS3 - Lead

FS1 DOES NOTHING!

FS2 ON PRESS DOES NOTHING; ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS DOES NOTHING; ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 DOES NOTHING!

 

So, now you're thinking "If, in SS3 (Lead), FS1 and 4 do nothing, why can't I use them for something else?"

You can, AS LONG AS THE SOMETHING ELSE IS A SNAPSHOT FUNCTION!

You cannot use them to change presets or perform ANY other function. If you try to do that, the function will change in ALL snapshots!

 

You might well be wondering, after examining the snapshots in CommandCenter, where the RELEASE logic is for FS2 and 3?

When you press those switches you are taken to SS3 (Lead). Therefore, the RELEASE logic is attached to those switches in SS3. That's why the ON PRESS function for FS2 and 3 in SS3 does nothing.

 

Are we having fun yet?

 

 

Paulzx1.hlx 11.56 kB · 0 downloads

I'm starting to consider going back to a real amp and cab lol.. Just kidding! After I read your summary like a rabbit caught in the headlights, I thought I better load that preset and see what you mean. Steve Sterlacci made this look so easy but now I'm thinking he didn't really explain what you need to really know to make this work.

 

I'm off to check this all out!

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rd2rk's description is spot on, but because its so accurate it is messy to understand.  This is sorta like trying to understand MIDI for the first time.  But once you get it....you get it and the door is opened to lots of other possibilities.

 

The big thing for me that made this easy to understand was I had an LAMF foot controller years ago.  That thing was a monster for options at your feet.  Every page/layout could be different. So if I ran a preset per song approach, every song could essentially have a different layout in front of my at my feet.  That helped set the groundwork to understand the 'new' Stomp/Command center behavior.  

 

If you think of it this way.  The command center used to be 1 dimensional.  Every footswitch you assigned was (for lack of a better word) global within that preset.  Assign FS 1 to your Clean SS and it stayed that way.  However, with the new behavior....every snapshot is a new layer/layout/screen where you can keep things simple or complicate the hell out of it.  Unfortunately, I think, the stock behavior is on the more complicated side and what confuses people.

 

Think of it this way, you start on SS1's layout, you program you switches....when you step on any of those SS footswitches, it is taking you THAT snapshots layout.  So what rd2rk is explaining is that if you are on SS1 and you have FS1 Press to go to SS2, when you are on SS2, that layout/buttons 'release' feature needs to match you back to SS1 if your intending a momentary thing.  

 

The alternate approach to this might be to setup your 'lead boost' blocks changes and program them to an actual FS, and make that FS momentary vs. latching.  I have done this on my kitchen sink-ish presets where I use the same blocks to boost my solos.  I assign an OD/Delay bypass states to FS 7 (usually) and set it to momentary.  

 

Flexibility is great, but can be a hindrance to get your mind wrapped around.  

 

Dont give up, lots of great minds to help here for sure!!

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On 12/14/2022 at 2:58 PM, Paulzx said:

I'm starting to consider going back to a real amp and cab lol.. Just kidding! After I read your summary like a rabbit caught in the headlights, I thought I better load that preset and see what you mean. Steve Sterlacci made this look so easy but now I'm thinking he didn't really explain what you need to really know to make this work.

 

I'm off to check this all out!

 

Here's a practical application using that preset as a template and just adding sonic components.

Paulzx2.hlx

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On 12/14/2022 at 6:15 PM, rd2rk said:

@Paulzx - Here's a little something to think about, a small demo of FS logic as relates to use with the Snapshot change function in Stomp mode, and how to think about describing what you want to do as clearly as possible - not easy, as you'll see.

Demo preset attached.

The demo assumes that you have Stomp Mode set to 10 footswitches.

I have named the snapshots as SS1=Clean; SS2=Crunch; SS3=Lead.

 

NOTES: When assigning CommandCenter functions to Stomp Mode switches, DO NOT use a FS that is assigned to Bypass or Parameter controls!

The results can be unpredictable and difficult to remedy, up to and including irrecoverable preset corruption!

Also, the Scribble Strip names are what they are, based on the Snapshot names I've assigned.

Hopefully, someday L6 will heed the hue and cry of users to allow Custom Naming for Stomp Mode SS CommandCenter assigned switches.

Do a search on Ideascale and VOTE FOR IT! Vote for all 17 suggestions for it posted by people who've somehow made it into the 21st century without understanding the concept of SEARCH BEFORE POSTING! :-)

 

SS1 - Clean

FS1 ON PRESS goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS2 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead)

 

SS2 -Crunch

FS1 ON PRESS goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS2 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead); ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 ON PRESS goes to SS3 (Lead)

 

SS3 - Lead

FS1 DOES NOTHING!

FS2 ON PRESS DOES NOTHING; ON RELEASE goes to SS1 (Clean)

FS3 ON PRESS DOES NOTHING; ON RELEASE goes to SS2 (Crunch)

FS4 DOES NOTHING!

 

So, now you're thinking "If, in SS3 (Lead), FS1 and 4 do nothing, why can't I use them for something else?"

You can, AS LONG AS THE SOMETHING ELSE IS A SNAPSHOT FUNCTION!

You cannot use them to change presets or perform ANY other function. If you try to do that, the function will change in ALL snapshots!

 

You might well be wondering, after examining the snapshots in CommandCenter, where the RELEASE logic is for FS2 and 3?

When you press those switches you are taken to SS3 (Lead). Therefore, the RELEASE logic is attached to those switches in SS3. That's why the ON PRESS function for FS2 and 3 in SS3 does nothing.

 

Are we having fun yet?

 

 

Paulzx1.hlx 11.56 kB · 0 downloads

Didn't get time to get into this tonight but did have a quick look at the foot switch assignments in command centre.

What has worked is that it has saved my four snap shots to the new locations on the switches when i'm in stomp mode. Those snap shots are in different locations when i'm in S/S mode, so that has worked.

 

However, when I assign the release commands to those four snap shots, it doesn't save my selection, it seems to go back to none. 

If i had four S/Shots in a row and just wanted each one to turn on when pressed and stay on until i press another one, just like it would work in snap shot mode, what should the release command be on each switch - none or the same snap shot? I've tried both ways of doing it but they don't save?

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On 12/14/2022 at 3:41 PM, Paulzx said:

Didn't get time to get into this tonight but did have a quick look at the foot switch assignments in command centre.

What has worked is that it has saved my four snap shots to the new locations on the switches when i'm in stomp mode. Those snap shots are in different locations when i'm in S/S mode, so that has worked.

 

However, when I assign the release commands to those four snap shots, it doesn't save my selection, it seems to go back to none. 

If i had four S/Shots in a row and just wanted each one to turn on when pressed and stay on until i press another one, just like it would work in snap shot mode, what should the release command be on each switch - none or the same snap shot? I've tried both ways of doing it but they don't save?

 

Examine in CommandCenter the settings in my demo preset and compare them to the explanation above.

The logic SHOULD become apparent. The best I can do is tell you what each FS does and provide a working demo.

 

I'm not looking over your shoulder to see exactly what you're doing, I can only guess based on mistakes I've made while learning this.

Even if you SAVE between every edit on each snapshot, if you change a function or move a switch you can end up where you started.

Remember that you can change a PARAMETER in a function (in this case the SNAPSHOT function and its action parameter) but if you change the FUNCTION it changes that FS function in every snapshot. OTOH, if you change a PARAMETER of a function it's only changed in THAT snapshot.

Sometimes copy/paste is NOT the best way to do things.

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On 12/14/2022 at 10:56 PM, rd2rk said:

 

Examine in CommandCenter the settings in my demo preset and compare them to the explanation above.

The logic SHOULD become apparent. The best I can do is tell you what each FS does and provide a working demo.

 

I'm not looking over your shoulder to see exactly what you're doing, I can only guess based on mistakes I've made while learning this.

Even if you SAVE between every edit on each snapshot, if you change a function or move a switch you can end up where you started.

Remember that you can change a PARAMETER in a function (in this case the SNAPSHOT function and its action parameter) but if you change the FUNCTION it changes that FS function in every snapshot. OTOH, if you change a PARAMETER of a function it's only changed in THAT snapshot.

Sometimes copy/paste is NOT the best way to do things.

Okay I'll have a look at your preset later and I'll attach mine if it's still not working.

 

Kudos to you two guys who have totally got your heads around this. Are you actually using custom layouts yourself in your own presets now or have you gone back to standard snapshot or stomp mode? I'm curious to know how many people actually use custom layouts. It's going to be either one of those things where you can't live without it once you get it working, or it's just not worth the effort for what it gives you?

 

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On 12/15/2022 at 4:07 AM, Paulzx said:

Okay I'll have a look at your preset later and I'll attach mine if it's still not working.

 

Kudos to you two guys who have totally got your heads around this. Are you actually using custom layouts yourself in your own presets now or have you gone back to standard snapshot or stomp mode? I'm curious to know how many people actually use custom layouts. It's going to be either one of those things where you can't live without it once you get it working, or it's just not worth the effort for what it gives you?

 

I typically use the same layout 'template'.  I create a preset per song approach with my live performances.  Here is how I generally setup my layouts.  If I dont use the switch, I'll put 'unused' but then add in parenthesis what I WOULD use it for if the need arises:

 

FS1 - Preset - Previous

FS2 - Preset  - Next

FS3 - Unused (stomp bypass of an effect)

FS4 - Unused (stomp bypass of an effect)

FS5 - Unused (stomp bypass of an effect)

FS6 - Mode - not changeable

FS7 - Snapshot/Lead Fill (momentary)/Special Effect Bypass

FS8 - Snapshot/Blank

FS9 - Snapshot/Blank

FS10 - Snapshot/Blank

FS11 - Snapshot

FS12 - Tap Tempo - not changeable

 

With this layout my upper left 2 buttons allow me to navigate through the setlist live from song to song.  If I need to jump to another song that isnt 'next' I push FS6 to exit STOMP MODE and then choose the song preset I need, then push FS6 again to enter my STOMP MODE for my performance layout.  My bottom row is my 'Action' Row.  I assign pretty much anything I need for the song.  Most times this is only Snapshots, however sometimes if a song only has 1 or 2 snapshots but I need that extra lead fill button I'll throw that on FS 7 as its furthest away from an accidental SS push.   I always Structure my SS/FS layout for the bottom row, from left to right, but they are put in right to left....confusing I know.  I always like my actual Lead Snapshot to be next to the Tap Tempo, so if I have a 2 snapshot preset, snapshot 1 - Rhythm is on FS10 and snapshot 2 - Lead is on FS11.  If I have a 4 snapshot preset, I used FS8-11.  FS 8 is my rhythm tone and FS 11 is my Lead tone, and the ones in the middle are usually in an order that makes sense for the song progression.  To add to that arrangement psychology, I also color code my snapshots consistently.  My core 'rhythm' sound is always RED, my core 'lead' tone is always GREEN.  In a 5 snapshot/preset I travel the rainbow from RED/Dark Orange/Light Orange/Yellow/Green.  I always use Blue for my special effects in the song.  If I have a 2nd lead tone I'll typically use Aqua/Teal (I forget what Helix calls it).   If I use a talkbox in a song, I'll use Purple (top row FS usually).  Just to complete the rainbow assigns, if I have any special effects that I use as actual Stomps (not SS changes) I'll use Pink.  

 

I use this template for every preset, and make changes if I have to.   For your original question of how to do a momentary Lead Fill type FS.  I've done it two ways (I'll use my template as an example)

 

Snapshot 1 - Rhythm

Snapshot 2 - Lead

Snapshot 3 - Lead Fill (a 2nd Lead snapshot of the exact tone as SS2 isnt necessary, but for layout purposes 'to me' it helps to separate the assignments)

 

FS 7 - SS 3 Lead Fill - Turqoise/Aqua Color - CC options - Type 'Snapshot', Press 'Snapshot 3', Release 'Snapshot 1' (assuming back to rhythm tone is needed) - This tells Helix upon press go to snapshot 3 until button is released which then should resort to Snapshot 1

FS 10 - SS1 Rhythm - Red - CC Options - Type 'Snapshot, Press 'Snapshot 1', Release 'none' - this tells Helix to choose SS 1 upon press, and do nothing upon release

FS 11 - SS2 Lead - Green - CC Options - Type 'Snapshot, Press 'Snapshot 2', Release 'none' - this tells Helix to choose SS 2 upon press, and do nothing upon release

 

My other approach....would be exactly as above, except for the FS 7 assigments.  The other approach would be to assign FS 7 as a momentary switch on each effect you want to activate.  For me, this would usually be an OD/EQ/Delay blocks

 

OD/EQ/Delay blocks in the right tab when selecting the block change it from Latching to Momentary.  Choose FS 7 as your button, change the label of the Switch to 'Lead Fill' and change the color to Green.  Sometimes when adding multiple blocks to that FS, you may have to retype the name and reassign the color at times.

 

Hope this helps,  having that consistent template has really helped me streamline my preset creation for performing.  Also...because I use the same layout for ALL snapshots, the copy/clear/paste approach works for me.  I create my 'layout as noted above on Snapshot 1, Copy All, Clear All, Paste All and that addresses the different snapshot layers you would potentially have.  If I didnt do the copy/clear/paste, I would need to literally do snapshot 1, change the drop down at the top of the window to snapshot 2, and reassign everything...which is where you would get funky behavior if you missing assigning something consistently.  The flexibility is super powerful and awesome to different layers for sure though and I've thought about trying some things using the single path preset spillover setting as well for sure.  

 

As always, if you have questions or anything please ask.  I dont have my helix near my laptop currently but if you want to see a preset, I can certainly try and get one uploaded for you read and 'see' what this all means.  

 

Cheers!

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On 12/15/2022 at 3:06 PM, themetallikid said:

I typically use the same layout 'template'.  I create a preset per song approach with my live performances.  Here is how I generally setup my layouts.  If I dont use the switch, I'll put 'unused' but then add in parenthesis what I WOULD use it for if the need arises:

 

FS1 - Preset - Previous

FS2 - Preset  - Next

FS3 - Unused (stomp bypass of an effect)

FS4 - Unused (stomp bypass of an effect)

FS5 - Unused (stomp bypass of an effect)

FS6 - Mode - not changeable

FS7 - Snapshot/Lead Fill (momentary)/Special Effect Bypass

FS8 - Snapshot/Blank

FS9 - Snapshot/Blank

FS10 - Snapshot/Blank

FS11 - Snapshot

FS12 - Tap Tempo - not changeable

 

With this layout my upper left 2 buttons allow me to navigate through the setlist live from song to song.  If I need to jump to another song that isnt 'next' I push FS6 to exit STOMP MODE and then choose the song preset I need, then push FS6 again to enter my STOMP MODE for my performance layout.  My bottom row is my 'Action' Row.  I assign pretty much anything I need for the song.  Most times this is only Snapshots, however sometimes if a song only has 1 or 2 snapshots but I need that extra lead fill button I'll throw that on FS 7 as its furthest away from an accidental SS push.   I always Structure my SS/FS layout for the bottom row, from left to right, but they are put in right to left....confusing I know.  I always like my actual Lead Snapshot to be next to the Tap Tempo, so if I have a 2 snapshot preset, snapshot 1 - Rhythm is on FS10 and snapshot 2 - Lead is on FS11.  If I have a 4 snapshot preset, I used FS8-11.  FS 8 is my rhythm tone and FS 11 is my Lead tone, and the ones in the middle are usually in an order that makes sense for the song progression.  To add to that arrangement psychology, I also color code my snapshots consistently.  My core 'rhythm' sound is always RED, my core 'lead' tone is always GREEN.  In a 5 snapshot/preset I travel the rainbow from RED/Dark Orange/Light Orange/Yellow/Green.  I always use Blue for my special effects in the song.  If I have a 2nd lead tone I'll typically use Aqua/Teal (I forget what Helix calls it).   If I use a talkbox in a song, I'll use Purple (top row FS usually).  Just to complete the rainbow assigns, if I have any special effects that I use as actual Stomps (not SS changes) I'll use Pink.  

 

I use this template for every preset, and make changes if I have to.   For your original question of how to do a momentary Lead Fill type FS.  I've done it two ways (I'll use my template as an example)

 

Snapshot 1 - Rhythm

Snapshot 2 - Lead

Snapshot 3 - Lead Fill (a 2nd Lead snapshot of the exact tone as SS2 isnt necessary, but for layout purposes 'to me' it helps to separate the assignments)

 

FS 7 - SS 3 Lead Fill - Turqoise/Aqua Color - CC options - Type 'Snapshot', Press 'Snapshot 3', Release 'Snapshot 1' (assuming back to rhythm tone is needed) - This tells Helix upon press go to snapshot 3 until button is released which then should resort to Snapshot 1

FS 10 - SS1 Rhythm - Red - CC Options - Type 'Snapshot, Press 'Snapshot 1', Release 'none' - this tells Helix to choose SS 1 upon press, and do nothing upon release

FS 11 - SS2 Lead - Green - CC Options - Type 'Snapshot, Press 'Snapshot 2', Release 'none' - this tells Helix to choose SS 2 upon press, and do nothing upon release

 

My other approach....would be exactly as above, except for the FS 7 assigments.  The other approach would be to assign FS 7 as a momentary switch on each effect you want to activate.  For me, this would usually be an OD/EQ/Delay blocks

 

OD/EQ/Delay blocks in the right tab when selecting the block change it from Latching to Momentary.  Choose FS 7 as your button, change the label of the Switch to 'Lead Fill' and change the color to Green.  Sometimes when adding multiple blocks to that FS, you may have to retype the name and reassign the color at times.

 

Hope this helps,  having that consistent template has really helped me streamline my preset creation for performing.  Also...because I use the same layout for ALL snapshots, the copy/clear/paste approach works for me.  I create my 'layout as noted above on Snapshot 1, Copy All, Clear All, Paste All and that addresses the different snapshot layers you would potentially have.  If I didnt do the copy/clear/paste, I would need to literally do snapshot 1, change the drop down at the top of the window to snapshot 2, and reassign everything...which is where you would get funky behavior if you missing assigning something consistently.  The flexibility is super powerful and awesome to different layers for sure though and I've thought about trying some things using the single path preset spillover setting as well for sure.  

 

As always, if you have questions or anything please ask.  I dont have my helix near my laptop currently but if you want to see a preset, I can certainly try and get one uploaded for you read and 'see' what this all means.  

 

Cheers!

Thanks for all the above, I'm sure with the help of you two guys, I will crack this.

 

In fact, your template approach is basically exactly what I was trying to achieve i.e individual effects along the top switches and snapshots along the bottom row,

I've actually kept the bank up and down switches in their original positions on the top left and bottom left but other than that, same approach.

The main problem at the moment is that although I did get the snapshots i wanted along the bottom row, they don't behave properly. As I mentioned, some come on when you push the switch, some require a double tap - plus whenever i open command centre i notice my instructions of what each switch should do on the release - has changed! If command centre actually saved each switch the way I set it up, I would have cracked this okay but as Rd2rk has said, there must be some conflict on the switches.

 

I'm not sure yet what's causing that but in a couple of hours I'm going to have a 1 on 1 with my helix and try and talk some sense into it - with a hammer if required.

On a more serious note, I'll try Rd2rk's preset and see how that is working - then if i still have issues, I'll post my preset. If you get time, post your template preset and I'll take a look. It will be interesting to see how people who know what they are doing are setting this up lol

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On 12/15/2022 at 3:07 AM, Paulzx said:

Okay I'll have a look at your preset later and I'll attach mine if it's still not working.

 

Kudos to you two guys who have totally got your heads around this. Are you actually using custom layouts yourself in your own presets now or have you gone back to standard snapshot or stomp mode? I'm curious to know how many people actually use custom layouts. It's going to be either one of those things where you can't live without it once you get it working, or it's just not worth the effort for what it gives you?

 

 

Unlike @themetallikid, I haven't been in a professional performing band in decades.

Back then I played bass and life was simple - guitar, cable, amp, rock'n'roll.

These days I also play guitar and keys, jam with friends, put together the occasional pick-up band for a party.

 

My Helix is a toy, an amusement more than a tool, but 50+ years of performance makes it impossible not to approach it with performance in mind.

That said, my presets are pretty much randomly created with my needs-of-the-moment in mind.

 

Is it worth the effort to learn how to do these things?

The old saying "Knowledge is power" is true.

Modelers are the future of performance on guitar. 

Learn, or take up knitting. Your choice!

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Here's a mod on my previous Paulzx2 preset. New concepts, more how I'd use it for performance.

 

3 amps - Clean, Crunch, Lead.

Basic FX - Wah, Chorus, Flanger, Delay. Reverb always on. You can use FS5 to toggle it if you like.

Lead snapshot adds Delay and Noise Gate (Input Block).

Solo Boost adds a CLEAN (at the Output Block) 4db boost.

 

If you want the snapshots on the bottom row (I prefer the way it is) you'll have to learn the logic. Cut and Paste won't work.

Paulzx3.hlx

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On 12/15/2022 at 9:51 AM, Paulzx said:

Thanks for all the above, I'm sure with the help of you two guys, I will crack this.

 

In fact, your template approach is basically exactly what I was trying to achieve i.e individual effects along the top switches and snapshots along the bottom row,

I've actually kept the bank up and down switches in their original positions on the top left and bottom left but other than that, same approach.

The main problem at the moment is that although I did get the snapshots i wanted along the bottom row, they don't behave properly. As I mentioned, some come on when you push the switch, some require a double tap - plus whenever i open command centre i notice my instructions of what each switch should do on the release - has changed! If command centre actually saved each switch the way I set it up, I would have cracked this okay but as Rd2rk has said, there must be some conflict on the switches.

 

I'm not sure yet what's causing that but in a couple of hours I'm going to have a 1 on 1 with my helix and try and talk some sense into it - with a hammer if required.

On a more serious note, I'll try Rd2rk's preset and see how that is working - then if i still have issues, I'll post my preset. If you get time, post your template preset and I'll take a look. It will be interesting to see how people who know what they are doing are setting this up lol

For sure, i'm curious if your Helix issues with the FS's follow into his preset.  That would indicate more of a hardware issue than programming I'd think.  Let us know how it goes.  

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On 12/15/2022 at 4:48 PM, rd2rk said:

Here's a mod on my previous Paulzx2 preset. New concepts, more how I'd use it for performance.

 

3 amps - Clean, Crunch, Lead.

Basic FX - Wah, Chorus, Flanger, Delay. Reverb always on. You can use FS5 to toggle it if you like.

Lead snapshot adds Delay and Noise Gate (Input Block).

Solo Boost adds a CLEAN (at the Output Block) 4db boost.

 

If you want the snapshots on the bottom row (I prefer the way it is) you'll have to learn the logic. Cut and Paste won't work.

Paulzx3.hlx 22.8 kB · 0 downloads

Cool, going to try this shortly and report back

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On 12/15/2022 at 4:10 PM, rd2rk said:

 

Unlike @themetallikid, I haven't been in a professional performing band in decades.

Back then I played bass and life was simple - guitar, cable, amp, rock'n'roll.

These days I also play guitar and keys, jam with friends, put together the occasional pick-up band for a party.

 

My Helix is a toy, an amusement more than a tool, but 50+ years of performance makes it impossible not to approach it with performance in mind.

That said, my presets are pretty much randomly created with my needs-of-the-moment in mind.

 

Is it worth the effort to learn how to do these things?

The old saying "Knowledge is power" is true.

Modelers are the future of performance on guitar. 

Learn, or take up knitting. Your choice!

Similar here, I'm not playing live for now at least so just at home but still doing my presets so I can perform or jam with tracks so the setup is still

aimed at live performance.

 

I haven't played real amps for years so it's modelers all the way. I tried knitting but didn't have the patience.

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On 12/15/2022 at 4:48 PM, rd2rk said:

Here's a mod on my previous Paulzx2 preset. New concepts, more how I'd use it for performance.

 

3 amps - Clean, Crunch, Lead.

Basic FX - Wah, Chorus, Flanger, Delay. Reverb always on. You can use FS5 to toggle it if you like.

Lead snapshot adds Delay and Noise Gate (Input Block).

Solo Boost adds a CLEAN (at the Output Block) 4db boost.

 

If you want the snapshots on the bottom row (I prefer the way it is) you'll have to learn the logic. Cut and Paste won't work.

Paulzx3.hlx 22.8 kB · 1 download

Right, loaded the preset.. didn't have the same switch issue with yours, it all worked like it should as far as I could see. I use 8 stomp mode but switched to 10 for your preset.

 

Then I got distracted looking at the actual preset because your chain layout is quite a bit different from what I use.. and I liked the soldano lead patch so much that I just jammed with that for the rest of the night lol.

 

Mine still acts funny with the foot switching so I've attached it. It's an unfinished preset but that doesn't really matter. When you look at it in 8 stomp mode

you'll see very basic layout, nothing yet assigned to the top row switches, four snapshots assigned to the bottom row. Now try pressing those switches.

The fourth switch jumps back to switch 1 on mine, even though it has no instruction to do that.

 

I did have an IR in mine actually but i suppose you could put a cab in there, probably won't make any difference for what we're looking at though

PAULZX TEST.hlx

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On 12/15/2022 at 3:23 PM, Paulzx said:

Mine still acts funny with the foot switching so I've attached it. It's an unfinished preset but that doesn't really matter. When you look at it in 8 stomp mode

you'll see very basic layout, nothing yet assigned to the top row switches, four snapshots assigned to the bottom row. Now try pressing those switches.

The fourth switch jumps back to switch 1 on mine, even though it has no instruction to do that.

 

It's hard for me to figure out what's wrong when you've never really stated what would be right!

 

SS1 

FS1 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

FS2 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

etc

 

SS2 

FS1 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

FS2 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

etc

 

etc

 

IOW - Look at the description I gave of what my footswitches do in each SS. What EXACTLY is it that you want each FS to do in each snapshot?

 

As it stands, yeah, the footswitches don't do much of anything, but I can't make them do what you want if I don't know what you want them to do!

 

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Here is a typical layout for what you had originally mentioned with a 'momentary' lead fill.  This is for Slither by Velvet Revolver.   Warning, apparently I create my presets loud, lol....

 

However, you will see my template I typically use for this as I described above. 

 

Preset details:

SS1 - Intro

SS2 - Rhythm

SS3 - Lead Fill

 

The actual lead is all wah, so I have everything "Solo" wise attached to the bypass of the wah pedal at 98%.  Toe down is off, under 98% is on what I have assigned to EXP 1.  Exp 2 is if I feel like adding a Wah to the intro at all.  Its a 2nd expression pedal I have here.  However, I noticed in tonights prep for saturdays gig, the ugly toe down auto engage bug reared its head on most of my wah presets, so I would just delete the wah as they are not relevant really to your initial inquiry.  

 

If you go in command center, FS 7 is where you will see how I have a momentary set up when using SS's.  

 

Also FYI, this is a 3.50/3.51 preset if that matters at all.  Using stock cabs.  

Slither.hlx

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On 12/16/2022 at 2:44 AM, themetallikid said:

Here is a typical layout for what you had originally mentioned with a 'momentary' lead fill.  This is for Slither by Velvet Revolver.   Warning, apparently I create my presets loud, lol....

 

However, you will see my template I typically use for this as I described above. 

 

Preset details:

SS1 - Intro

SS2 - Rhythm

SS3 - Lead Fill

 

The actual lead is all wah, so I have everything "Solo" wise attached to the bypass of the wah pedal at 98%.  Toe down is off, under 98% is on what I have assigned to EXP 1.  Exp 2 is if I feel like adding a Wah to the intro at all.  Its a 2nd expression pedal I have here.  However, I noticed in tonights prep for saturdays gig, the ugly toe down auto engage bug reared its head on most of my wah presets, so I would just delete the wah as they are not relevant really to your initial inquiry.  

 

If you go in command center, FS 7 is where you will see how I have a momentary set up when using SS's.  

 

Also FYI, this is a 3.50/3.51 preset if that matters at all.  Using stock cabs.  

Slither.hlx 23.23 kB · 0 downloads

Looking forward to trying that. On a side note - are you using the new stock cabs instead of IR's now for all your stuff?

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On 12/16/2022 at 12:50 AM, rd2rk said:

 

It's hard for me to figure out what's wrong when you've never really stated what would be right!

 

SS1 

FS1 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

FS2 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

etc

 

SS2 

FS1 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

FS2 ON PRESS (does what); ON RELEASE (does what)

etc

 

etc

 

IOW - Look at the description I gave of what my footswitches do in each SS. What EXACTLY is it that you want each FS to do in each snapshot?

 

As it stands, yeah, the footswitches don't do much of anything, but I can't make them do what you want if I don't know what you want them to do!

 

Okay but for a moment, forget what I want them to do eventually and just look at what they are currently doing. Can you get the switches to just turn on the

snap shots when you press each switch, and do nothing else - like would happen in regular snapshot mode. So literally toggle across each switch and turn on

the relevant snapshot without any unusual behaviour, because when I do it, a couple of the switches when pressed - jump to another snapshot and when i toggle across the four lower switches, some of them need a double tap to even come on - so I want to know why that is happening given that there are no assignments in command centre on those switches to do anything like that. They are all set on press/release. Every press command is set on the snapshot i want on that switch, every release command is set to none. That is actually how it was done on the youtube demo i looked at to start with.

 

Are you getting that same switch behaviour when you toggle across the switches? Once i can understand what is causing that, I can probably program the switches to do exactly what I would like (or you can lol).

 

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On 12/16/2022 at 5:07 AM, Paulzx said:

Looking forward to trying that. On a side note - are you using the new stock cabs instead of IR's now for all your stuff?

Yes I was happy with the stock cabs previously, but I liked York Audio IR's, they seemed to have a bit more punch to them.  I'm sure it was just the files I was choosing vs the stock cabs I was using, but I bounced between those two often.  The new cabs are great and so far, have been happy with them.

 

I will try and take a look at your preset tonight and look at what you have created and see if I can help pinpoint where an error is happening if rd2rk doesnt beat me to it while I'm at work.  

 

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On 12/16/2022 at 4:18 AM, Paulzx said:

Okay but for a moment, forget what I want them to do eventually and just look at what they are currently doing. Can you get the switches to just turn on the

snap shots when you press each switch, and do nothing else - like would happen in regular snapshot mode. So literally toggle across each switch and turn on

the relevant snapshot without any unusual behaviour, because when I do it, a couple of the switches when pressed - jump to another snapshot and when i toggle across the four lower switches, some of them need a double tap to even come on - so I want to know why that is happening given that there are no assignments in command centre on those switches to do anything like that. They are all set on press/release. Every press command is set on the snapshot i want on that switch, every release command is set to none. That is actually how it was done on the youtube demo i looked at to start with.

 

Here ya go. Some were set to PRESS/HOLD, some had RELEASE or HOLD actions assigned to them. Since you didn't think that was the case, I suspect you need to examine the way you approach your creation/troubleshooting method. Start with SS1. When it's all set the way you want it SAVE and move to SS2. When you've set up all snapshots, write down which ones aren't behaving as expected and re-examine them. Keep in mind that if you use a switch to temporarily move to another snapshot and want to return to the original snapshot (or do ANYTHING) ON RELEASE, the ON RELEASE action needs to be assigned in the TEMPORARY snapshot because that's where you'll be when you release the switch.

PZX TEST Fix1.hlx

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On 12/16/2022 at 10:57 AM, rd2rk said:

 

Here ya go. Some were set to PRESS/HOLD, some had RELEASE or HOLD actions assigned to them. Since you didn't think that was the case, I suspect you need to examine the way you approach your creation/troubleshooting method. Start with SS1. When it's all set the way you want it SAVE and move to SS2. When you've set up all snapshots, write down which ones aren't behaving as expected and re-examine them. Keep in mind that if you use a switch to temporarily move to another snapshot and want to return to the original snapshot (or do ANYTHING) ON RELEASE, the ON RELEASE action needs to be assigned in the TEMPORARY snapshot because that's where you'll be when you release the switch.

PZX TEST Fix1.hlx 35 kB · 0 downloads

"Keep in mind that if you use a switch to temporarily move to another snapshot and want to return to the original snapshot (or do ANYTHING) ON RELEASE, the ON RELEASE action needs to be assigned in the TEMPORARY snapshot because that's where you'll be when you release the switch."

 

That part right there is a big causal part.  I know for me, I dont' logically think about this step, but thats because I use the same 'layout' across all my snapshots.  So FS 7 on the preset I provided, has the same press/release settings on SS1 as it does on SS8.  So whichever SS I tell it to go to for my lead fill, the release action will be programmed.  

 

If you are changing your layouts for each snapshot 'layer' in the preset, then you MUST do as rd2rk says and make sure that you go to the Press SS layer and make sure that you set the release there or it wont matter.  

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On 12/16/2022 at 2:44 AM, themetallikid said:

Here is a typical layout for what you had originally mentioned with a 'momentary' lead fill.  This is for Slither by Velvet Revolver.   Warning, apparently I create my presets loud, lol....

 

However, you will see my template I typically use for this as I described above. 

 

Preset details:

SS1 - Intro

SS2 - Rhythm

SS3 - Lead Fill

 

The actual lead is all wah, so I have everything "Solo" wise attached to the bypass of the wah pedal at 98%.  Toe down is off, under 98% is on what I have assigned to EXP 1.  Exp 2 is if I feel like adding a Wah to the intro at all.  Its a 2nd expression pedal I have here.  However, I noticed in tonights prep for saturdays gig, the ugly toe down auto engage bug reared its head on most of my wah presets, so I would just delete the wah as they are not relevant really to your initial inquiry.  

 

If you go in command center, FS 7 is where you will see how I have a momentary set up when using SS's.  

 

Also FYI, this is a 3.50/3.51 preset if that matters at all.  Using stock cabs.  

Slither.hlx 23.23 kB · 0 downloads

Just tried your preset in 10 stomp mode. It seems to work like it should because i can hit the rythm or intro switch and they turn on as they should.

The fill switch works when you hold it down, then on release it goes back to the rythm snapshot.

 

However, when i look at the command centre assignments it's not clear to me how you've programmed that because the full is set to press/release but release is none.

on your helix the fill switch must be set to jump back to the rythm snap surely?

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On 12/16/2022 at 4:57 PM, rd2rk said:

 

Here ya go. Some were set to PRESS/HOLD, some had RELEASE or HOLD actions assigned to them. Since you didn't think that was the case, I suspect you need to examine the way you approach your creation/troubleshooting method. Start with SS1. When it's all set the way you want it SAVE and move to SS2. When you've set up all snapshots, write down which ones aren't behaving as expected and re-examine them. Keep in mind that if you use a switch to temporarily move to another snapshot and want to return to the original snapshot (or do ANYTHING) ON RELEASE, the ON RELEASE action needs to be assigned in the TEMPORARY snapshot because that's where you'll be when you release the switch.

PZX TEST Fix1.hlx 35 kB · 0 downloads

Yep mine are still all set to press/release so we're seeing two different things in command centre.

On your fix preset my command centre is press/release/none on all snaps - but the first two snaps still don't engage without a double tap on the switches (just those two)

 

Is it me or is my Helix doing something very unusual here? Don't forget, all switches work fine in regular snap mode and stomp mode. I'm only getting this when i'm using command centre

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On 12/16/2022 at 1:15 PM, Paulzx said:

However, when i look at the command centre assignments it's not clear to me how you've programmed that because the full is set to press/release but release is none.

 

I've explained this at least twice, @themetallikid has confirmed it. I'll try again. ON RELEASE needs to be set in the Snapshot that you are ACTUALLY IN.

If you PRESS the switch in SS1 and that takes you to SS3, the ON RELEASE action needs to be set in SS3 because that's where you'll be when you RELEASE the switch!

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On 12/16/2022 at 2:15 PM, Paulzx said:

Just tried your preset in 10 stomp mode. It seems to work like it should because i can hit the rythm or intro switch and they turn on as they should.

The fill switch works when you hold it down, then on release it goes back to the rythm snapshot.

 

However, when i look at the command centre assignments it's not clear to me how you've programmed that because the full is set to press/release but release is none.

on your helix the fill switch must be set to jump back to the rythm snap surely?

I'll confirm this when I get home to what mine shows.  But from the top of my head (can you post a screen shot of what your seeing to compare?) it should read as this

FS7

Type - Snapshot

Press - Snapshot 3 (Lead Fill)

Release - Snapshot 2 (Rhythm)

 

If its saying otherwise, then there may be something weird with how Command center is reading the preset info.  I haven't heard of anyone else stating that they have noticed that.  I'll check mine at home tonight when I fix my auto-engage issues and post a screenshot if we can confirm that mine is showing that it is programmed/behaving/displaying correctly and yours looks different.  You may have something else going on (which has been suspected the whole time).  

 

On a side note, have you done any sort of preset rebuilding restart using the FS buttons up on power up?  There could be something wonky in there if it hasnt rebuilt the presets to the current firmware.  And both Helix and HX Edit are updated to 3.50/3.51?  I'm sure this was stated, but just confirming.  

 

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On 12/16/2022 at 8:21 PM, rd2rk said:

 

I've explained this at least twice, @themetallikid has confirmed it. I'll try again. ON RELEASE needs to be set in the Snapshot that you are ACTUALLY IN.

If you PRESS the switch in SS1 and that takes you to SS3, the ON RELEASE action needs to be set in SS3 because that's where you'll be when you RELEASE the switch!

Going to check this. Aside from that, why would my switches still need a double tap to engage - on your FIX preset when it's not doing it your end?

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On 12/16/2022 at 1:21 PM, Paulzx said:

Yep mine are still all set to press/release so we're seeing two different things in command centre.

On your fix preset my command centre is press/release/none on all snaps - but the first two snaps still don't engage without a double tap on the switches (just those two)

 

Is it me or is my Helix doing something very unusual here? Don't forget, all switches work fine in regular snap mode and stomp mode. I'm only getting this when i'm using command centre

 

Try this.

 

 

 

 

PAULZX Fix2.hlx

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