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BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by spakuloid on 2009-11-29 17:13:01.6690

Which one out of the above 2 Boss exp pedals is the one you buy AND do you use a stereo cable or mono to connect to the M13? I don't know why this isn't in the manual.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by mojoesque on 2009-11-29 18:01:56.0020

spakuloid wrote:

I don't know why this isn't in the manual.

i'm sorry i don't have an answer to your question spakuloid, but as someone who just bought an M13 i'd like to second your question about why there isn't more official info from Line 6 about expression pedals. i completely understand that it's in their best interest to sell us the Line 6 brand pedal, but alot of us either already own 1 or more other expression pedals or would like some different options. I see a lot of confusion on this subject in this forum, and probably a lot of time and money wasted by folks buying the wrong gear.

DEAR LINE 6: would someone from Line 6 please post a sticky with more specific infomation about which expression pedals will and will not work with the M13/M9? you can include a large glossy photo of the EX-1 if it makes you feel better   it would be very helpful to new customers like myself who are having a hard time finding this information in all the noise. thank you!

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by phil_m on 2009-11-29 18:02:49.2980

I actually don't think either of those pedals will work with the M13.  The only officially supported expression pedal is the Line 6 EX-1.  It uses a mono 1/4" cable.  There are a few other pedals that will work.  Specifically, people have said the Ernie Ball Active Volume pedal will work.  Also, this company makes pedals specifically for Line 6 products.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by GMArts on 2009-11-29 18:04:33.8940

The Pilot's manual says:  Compatible with standard expression pedals, including the Line6 EX-1. Control FX parameters in real time by assigning them to either of these expression pedal inputs. The Line6 expression pedal is a passive 10K ohm mono linear taper pot, using a standard 1/4 inch mono instrument cable.

So the 500L is the one to use, which offeres a single 10K linear pot via a stereo socket connection as well as dual 20K log audio pots via 2 mono input and 2 mono output sockets.  A couple of things to watch with the 500L:

(1) You'll need either an adapter cable or to modify the internal connections to the stereo connection for the 10K pot (and off the top of my head, I'm pretty sure a stereo to mono cable WON'T work - I think you'll need ring from the 500L to tip on the M9, with tip on the 500L not connected).

(2) This pedal has a large dead zone under the heel and small dead zone at the toe end with the 10K pot (not sure if it's the same with the 20K audio pots).  I'm thinking about putting some wooden chocks under mine so I can feel where there true range is better.

(3) I shorted out the minimum level for the 10K pot so it doesn't matter when this accidentally gets knocked.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by phil_m on 2009-11-29 18:10:09.4800

I actually don't know what other information Line 6 needs to give us.  They've said the pedal needs a 10K ohm linear taper pot, and it's no secret the EX-1 uses a mono lead.  I wouldn't really expect a company to keep track of what other companies products work with their product.  For one thing, another company can modify its product whenever it wants to, and then Line 6 could actually be giving out wrong information.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by mojoesque on 2009-11-29 19:53:07.6440

i was, perhaps, over-reaching   i know they provide that technical information, i was just frustrated looking for specific information about which brands/models would and wouldn't work, and in the process of that search, i found a lot of the same confusion among the posts from others, and was voicing that. i know that Line 6 reads these forums, and i was wishful-thinking that someone would see all of these questions and post something all-encompassing straight from the horse's mouth.

you make good points, phil_m - i'm probably expecting too much. i've become spoiled by the internet's ability to quickly find answers to common questions

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by spakuloid on 2009-11-29 20:13:06.7950

Thanks for all the info.

I ended up buying the MISSION pedal for the  M13 since I really like the feel of a wah pedal and I know this guy builds solid stuff. I was one of the first to purchase his pedal for the AXE FX a year or so ago before I threw that thing into the wall. I am going to try and get away with only one expression pedal.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by cgtrox on 2009-11-29 21:26:41.9850

WOW! What what was it you didn't like about the AxeFX?? Those Mission pedals look VERY nice! There is also a rumor going around about a new Line 6 expression pedal that does more than the EX-1.


Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by spakuloid on 2009-11-29 23:38:17.6490

The AXE FX - where do I start? The endless tweaking? The lack of a Fractal foot controller - even now over a year after I sold the thing - no dedicated controller (which means you have to use a workaround unit and program it manually - and you still can't tune with it!!). The endless cost of learning to get the delay to sound decent. Getting the phaser to sound like something I would actually use. After owning it for 7 months and playing out with it a few times un-sucessfully into a PA system - and tweaking it alone in a rehearsal room with MY pa - right fucking next to the amp I was trying to simulate and failing - I just decided that life is too short. I like to write songs and play guitar - not sit in a room and tweak an effect processor. And now they are selling Atomic ahem... tube amps to go with the state of the art AXE tube amp modeler that is supposed to change the way you play a guitar. Right. I escaped the cult of Cliff and never looked back (although my constant bitching probably got him to add the pedal style compressor in version 6 - it still sucked balls and I used to say that my crappy old Line 6 amp from 1997 could nail a guitar compressor - why can't this $2k over engineered dork box do it...). People love it. I've heard great recordings of the Axe. More power to them. I like the simplicity of the M13 into my amp and FWIW - I am up and running in like an hour. No tweaking. I have still yet to hear anyone ever make MUSIC using an AXE FX that I would actually listen to.

If you buy an AXE FX - you better plan on spending another grand or MORE on the accoutrements that you will need to supplement the unit. Liquid Foot controller $600+ Expression pedals, IEM's or FRFR system.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by GMArts on 2009-11-30 00:37:54.8450

AxeFX is not for everyone.  Same as a Mesa or Line 6 or anything else isn't for everyone.

fwiw, I have an AxeFX and an M9 and they suit different purposes, and guess what, they both let me make good music

I also use my Vetta occasionally and it still sounds as good as the day I bought it.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by phil_m on 2009-11-30 08:26:03.4520

Your post kind of summarizes why I don't care to look into an Axe-FX.  I have too much else to do than sit and tweak amp settings all day.  I'm not saying the Axe is in any way inferior, but I simply have no desire to do that much tweaking.  Honestly, that's why I moved away from using PODs live as well.  I just prefer an amp and effects that are easy to setup.

Regarding the whole "cult of Cliff" thing, I do find it funny that there's a sticky on the forums entitled "Fractal Audio Welcomes More Converts".  It really does sound like a religious experience!

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by spakuloid on 2009-11-30 11:06:06.0360

I should mention there are some positives regarding the Axe Fx - a very dedicated user base --  if you have any warrantee or technical problems you can talk to Cliff personally and more than likely he will help you out at minimal to no cost. I never had any problems with the unit but I watched several others get personalized service that I would call "above and beyond". And there are frequent updates to the firmware that constantly upgrade the units performance - add amps and effect tweaks - for free. Even though I would not go through all that again - I think it is something you need to find out for yourself. But you WILL have to put the time and cash into changing your rig over to an Axe Fx rig to play live. And it may not work out for you in the end. So it is a big if.

I call it the cult of Cliff because if you are too critical of the unit and how it works - or if you post anything negative regarding the Axe on the user forums or Gear page - Scott Henderson and his ilk will be on your butt like flies on a giant poop stick. If you suggest a different way of thinking about the unit you will get crushed with the onslaught of users since version whatever that absolutely love the Axe for being such a tweakers paradise and blah blah blah... The Axe devotees are highly vested and invested in their unit - and defend it like they are battling aids in Africa. At the end of the day It's just another unit in the long line of well hyped guitar rack effects. Are the amp sims that good? Will it replace you entire rig and all your boo-teek effects? Will you write a hit song with it? Buy it and try it for yourself.  I am over it.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by phil_m on 2009-11-30 11:56:20.3350

I wasn't trying to belittle the Axe at all.  It does seem amazing.  I've looked at the manual, and there are just so many different things you can tweak, that I just imagine it would cause me to go nuts.  It reminds me of a concept I've heard about called the Paradox of Choice.  The issue is when people are given a large multitude of options to choose from, it often doesn't make them happier, as you would expect, but it causes them to have more negative psychological reactions down the road.  A basic gist of it is that If you know you have all these options to choose from, you will always be saying "no" to more and more things by choosing one.  So, by knowing you're saying "no" to all these things, you constantly live with the fear that something you've said no to is better than what you've chosen.

I guess that's why I'm just happier having an amp I love with versatile.  I love the M9 and the M13, but honestly, even they offer more than I'll ever use.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by spakuloid on 2009-11-30 12:03:35.7180

Paradox of Choice. you nailed it.

Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by cgtrox on 2009-11-30 14:01:06.6410

Yeah, I see what you mean. It gives you enough rope to hang yourself type of deal. For me, even the POD X3 dual amp thing was a bit too much tweaking, but hey, that's just me. I've heard plenty of GREAT sounding recordings using the POD 2.0 and/or PODxt series. Which is why I've never ventured much after using those. Plus, with my Spider Valve w/SVPre I can get great sounds live, so I haven't jumped on the MKII wagon either. I just got my M9 and I love it! So far, I only hit one bug, nuthin major as I don't really use the distortions on it with my SV rig.


Re: BOSS FV-500H or 500L Expression Pedal for M13???
by fottolini on 2010-09-18 19:34:05.0230

Very, very true. Any comment you make in the Axe-Fx forum CAN and WILL be used against you. As long as you understand you cannot, under any circumstances, say anything bad about the Axe-Fx, the FAS forum is a great place to get help.

But the thing about the Axe-Fx as a religion is something I just cannot understand. You see people saying they are willing to pay more and more and more... Like cultists. To give an example, there was a backlog list for the MFC-101. Instead of selling the first units to those on the waiting list, FAS decided to put some units on sale directly. The reason? People on the list are supposed to get $100.00 off. And still, if you complain about this absolutely terrible business practice, the cultists try to make you look like a fool. It is just ridiculous!

There is a lot of hype about the Axe-Fx, but there is no USB on the unit, and the interface to edit presets is just awful. So, you have to use MIDI cables (???) to connect your unit to you computer to edit the presets. But yes, if you do that you cannot use the foot controller. A real pain!

Another thing that caught my attention is how noisy the digital output is. Lots of clips and things like that. Tried to adjust the sample rate and stuff like that, but it just does not work. So, I have to record it the same way I record my M13. So, why pay at least $1K more?

Overpriced and overrated.

The information above may not be current, and you should direct questions to the current forum or review the manual.