Community: Message List - I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Wed, 16 Jan 2013 03:30:04 GMT

I think mine goes back to Thomann. Its a pretty nice amp, but i also have Axe Fx II and i like it better.

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Mon, 14 Jan 2013 15:21:05 GMT

No Problem just wanted to put my 2 pence worth in as how I see the amp. I can see where your coming from with Line 6 not getting there stuff together just hope that you did not send the amp back because you were mad at Line 6 but what the amp could do or not do for you. At the moment I have mine set up with the twin on the A channel with the mid turned way up and the treble turned down a bit for the closest I can get to a dumble sound and the Plexi on the B channel with a Joyo ultimate drive (OCD clone) and Joyo vintage overdrive(Tube Screamer clone) plus a vox wah in the front end this gets me pretty close to what I want at a gig.

I do hope L6 comes out with a Dumble style amp model soon though as I can see me going for a Fuchs Blackjack 21 MkII head. I do have the Pod HD 500 and can use that via the link but as yet prefer the amp and pedals by themselves as I can not seem to get quite the same with the pod with or without the pedals and anyway I spend endless hours chasing my tail trying to get the tone in my head by programming the Pod with the DT kind of what I used to do when I was into hifi years ago i.e put all the expensive cartridges amp and record deck together only to get annoyed at the static and scratches on the record instead of listening to the music. Good luck with whatever Amp you choose

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Sun, 13 Jan 2013 18:03:08 GMT

I actually got DT Edit running, after all manner of hoop jumps. I'm still underwhelmed by the functionality of the amp, and the lack of documentation. The volume shifts, while I understand them, make the amp hard to use they way I want to use it - which is not just two channels live, but 8 in experimentation and creative work. The lack of docs means I have to scribble onto a piece of paper what some of the knobs do with some of the models - and I still don't entirely know how the "Drive" knob actually behaves with every model. I essentially got "it depends."

Honestly, Line 6 has thoroughly killed my buzz, and it is no knock against these forums that it can't be rekindled.

But thanks.

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Mon, 14 Jan 2013 13:36:56 GMT

Nobody. But the way it works just isn't for me. It's already headed back. No hard feelings toward Line 6. I just wish they'd made it less of a hassle on a variety of fronts. But sure, it's a completly unique product. Nothing else really like it.

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Mon, 14 Jan 2013 10:12:52 GMT

What you got when you purchased the amp was a 2 channel amp where you could put different amps on each channel or the same amp with one more gained up on one channel than the other and all this out of a choice of 4 amp models. Now what you have is the same 2 channel amp with the choice of 22 amp models to choose from and with the addition of a od or distortion pedal in the front of the amp I can think of nothing more versatile for the price. In other words what other manufacturer is making a valve output amp with a choice of amp model out of a selection of most of the classic amps ever made (wish they would add a Dumble) that you can choose 2 of, one for each channel?

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Sun, 13 Jan 2013 17:50:39 GMT

Try this before you return the unit. I know it adds complexity you don't want but it's pretty cool!

http://line6.com/support/thread/90718?tstart=0

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Sun, 13 Jan 2013 13:16:28 GMT

I suspect cost. They did this in the past. I had one of the Flextone III XL's. The only issue I had with this was when they upgraded to the POD X3 Live it was not useable with the Flextone (ground loops, idiosyncrocies, and such) and I had to invest in a new amp. I actually stuck it out with the Flextone and skipped a POD generation due to that. The current L6 Link system really does allow for future swapping of the L6 brain without needing to upgrade the amp. Even my Flextone required a floorboard to go from 4 presets to 36. This modular approach allows for more options in the end. The HD300 costs just as much as the dumb floorboard for my Flextone did. I'm sure they will change tactical direction if sales slump. The limitations are clear, you know what to buy to get the desired result. At least I had no issue discerning this from the limited knowlege of sales staff at my local Guitar Center and the limited online manuals at the time. At least there is an entry level to buy. If they loaded it up and charged more, the entry level dissappears. Even in its complete system it is more bang for the buck than its competitors.

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Sun, 13 Jan 2013 12:49:46 GMT

I agree that from standalone amp users view it seems limited and a bit unfair. Its like they put the most delicious soup on the table and only give us the fork.

About what you see is what you get approuch ... If you use dt25 with pod you dont have this approach, and this allows you to tweak all models to be useable. Why not make the same for standalone amp?

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Sun, 13 Jan 2013 04:26:30 GMT

1) I understand Line 6 does not support the MIDI interface. That's obvious. But your observation is kind of a tangent that dismisses the issue. Line 6 knows which devices work. Line 6 could provide information that would prevent hassles for its customers. Line 6 chooses not to do so. I called, waited on hold, got the information from Line 6 on what would work, and bought another device that worked. Problem solved. But a PITA that was preventable. One web page. 5 minutes. I mean, seriously.

2) There are other amps. And I figure if they don't document, I'm not sure what else they won't do. I have no doubts that many folks here have had great experiences with Line 6, and I am glad to see it. I've not had a great experience. So I'm not keeping the amp. Like I said, there are other amps, ones that sound really, really good - and for me at least, are much more fun to use, beause I'm not dealing with all this nonsense.

3) Likewise.

4) "In my opinion v2 does not signifigantly change the amp other than to allow you to swap the existing models for ones you might like more." Right. but to me at least, that was everything. The four original voicings never would have gotten me into the amp. Only the idea of going to 8, and being able to choose the 8, made the DT25 the least bit interesting to me. "Invest in the whole system"? I bought the amp, with the intention of using the features advertised as being part of the amp (whch is what V2 is now - not a gift, a promised feature set - to new buyers). If those features had been well documented and easy to set up and use, I'd be fine. They weren't, so it's going back.

5) Modeling is utilitarian to me. I can be happy with one or two great clean tones and a few pedals. But being able to pick amps is a nice bonus. I don't use models live, but it is nice to have 8 available for getting creative.

That said, I don't care for any floor processors. I know the HD500 is a very very good one - I have friends who love them. I just don't go for the floor board form factor, LCD interface, all-in-one thing. Nothing wrong with it, and I don't fault Line 6 for it. By most accounts, it's a leading product. Maybe you're right. maybe they should have just sold the DT25 as a fancy power amp for the HD500. That would have made more sense.

Bottom line: Line 6 lost a customer who could have been an enthusiastic advocate, by not documenting and not distributing complete and accurate information and simple tools that could help customers out - at a relatively low cost of time and effort to them.

By the way, they did tell me they knew they needed to work on a doc. However, they couldn't tell me when it would be ready. I have a return window to worry about, so I can't wait on an indefinite timeline. So it goes.

Re: I think I'm gonna have to send it back...

support@line6.com — Sun, 13 Jan 2013 02:57:50 GMT

Responses to points:

1) Not defending so much as making an observation. In normal operation the DT device speaks MIDI. If the MIDI interface you are trying to install is not working the issue that is between you and the MIDI interface vendor and the PC vendor. If line 6 is the PC or MAC MIDI interface vendor then they are on the hook(not sure in your case if they are, I'm only taking the DT25 into consideration). I'm just trying to direct you to the correct party to provide a solution. The only exception here is if the DT25 is malfunctioning and not speaking MIDI, then seek repair or exchange.

2) Just the way it is unfortunatly, not enough of a deterent for me. I guess the option is to stop using the device in protest, but I think I would miss out on the fun I do have despite the documentation holes.

3) See #2 response

4) Its not as versital without the POD HD, with or without v2. In my opinion v2 does not signifigantly change the amp other than to allow you to swap the existing models for ones you might like more. I bought a HD 500 to expand the device as I well understood the limitations when I purchased it. Their choice to embrace Apple as a preferred interface is limiting, but at least they didn't block a third party from making an interface. Even with the interface it really is not adding any real live capability as the dial positions are not saved. Target market is to old school clean and dirt channel users and they nailed it. If your arguement is I should have more features because I did not invest in the whole system then your logic is lost on me.

5) If you bought the stand alone amp you bought in to those limitations. Deintegrating the preset brain from the amp allows for more versitility in the end as I can use my HD 500 independantly for silent recording or integrating into a PA easily. After all they have to compete with Digitech and Roland FX boards that are not tightly integrated. Combing that into the amp closes off the other market of users. What if I have another amp entirely or hate the DT25(one of my friends hates it and uses a Tech 21 with his HD 500)? The modular brain allows me to have the modeling and fx indepenedant of the amp choice. They could have combined it all together with a pedal board but it would have been priced at $1500 instead of $1000. It's all a matter of perspective. On the sales front I have never dealt directly with Line 6. I just have dealt with Guitar Center employees and some know what the equiptment is and some do not. Line 6 could choose to use dealers that use higher paid employees that study and certify on the equiptment but that cost would inevitably be pushed down to us. I personally have had a lot of fun with this equiptment despite Line 6's descrepancies and modicum of challenges. I can't think of a more versital system for the price. Egnator Tweaker or Mesa Tran Atlantc? They are just two channel amps and for the price of the Mesa you can buy the DT25 with at least an HD 400. I will note that the Mesa sounds devine and almost got me to forsake all of this modeling.