Currently Being ModeratedMar 5, 2010 6:47 PM (in response to Porkchop61YD)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
So, questions are:
1) can they be daisy chained and reliably function,
2) if so, what type of power supply is recommended, and
2) how many can be daisy chained?
1. A few folks have had success daisy-chaining ToneCores (think 1Spot), but many complain about them being noisy. I would say "no" to reliably function, unless . . .
2. Line 6 recommends VooDoo Lab Pedal Power 2+. I have used this power supply with my ToneCores and it works great.
3. PP2+ will power up to 8 pedals.
Currently Being ModeratedMar 5, 2010 7:05 PM (in response to BigChas52)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
Thanks for the info. I found this article that also provided some interesting results of the pedals tested with several different power supplies. http://www.muzique.com/line6.htm
Currently Being ModeratedMar 7, 2010 9:29 PM (in response to Porkchop61YD)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
I ordered the Dunlop DC Brick which provides 7 isolated 9V outputs and 3 isolated 18V outputs. Not as nice as the Voodoo PP2 or Modtone Power Plant as you don't have SAG control for any of the outputs, but a lot cheaper. It's also a lot smaller, so it will fit in the small storage tray in the Behringer PB1000 pedal box. Once I test it, I'll post the results.
Currently Being ModeratedMar 8, 2010 5:16 PM (in response to Porkchop61YD)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
I was under the impression that the DC brick did not use transformer isolation of each of its outputs, but just filtering, which would explain its lower price. Please let all of us know how this works for you.
Currently Being ModeratedMar 10, 2010 12:09 AM (in response to mwickett)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
Correct (and I called Dunlop to verify), but I have an electronics design engineer who is designing me an adjustable voltage regulator that will prevent feedback and also allow me to SAG (buck) the voltage down. A small little IC/Op-Amp bump that can be put in line with each output and built for hopefully just four or five dollars. Also designing a similar bump that will divide the 18V outputs to two 9V outputs. Not exactly the same as being truly isolated, but should limit noise generation between the pedals and give me the benefit of having up to ten 9V outputs that can all be SAG'ed if need be. May end up eventually costing me just as much as the Voodoo PP2+ or ModTone Power Plant, but I need something smaller that will fit in the limited space available in my pedal case which is only about 3"D x 5.5"W x 1.5"H.
BTW, I just tested the Echo Park, Otto, and Constrictor with up to five other Hardwire Pedals (DL-8 Reverb, RV-7 Delay/Looper, TL-2 Metal Distortion, CM-2 Tube Overdrive, and HT-2 Chromatic Tuner) all daisy chained on the Behringer PB1000 1700mA power supply. Played with them for a couple hours in various configurations and everything seemed to work fine; however, I did notice some noise at certain settings/gains/levels, but not sure if this would be normal as I don't have an isolated supply to compare with yet. I'll try the Liqua Flange and Space Chorus next.
Currently Being ModeratedMar 10, 2010 8:53 PM (in response to Porkchop61YD)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
OK, my bad on the previous. I did NOT do enough testing in different configurations to really check out the Constrictor. This time I tested the following:
- Setup: Fender American Delux Tele playing directly through the pedals into a Fender 65DSP (no effects loop and with amp effects both on and off). Spectraflex Fatso 10' cord from guitar to Behringer PB1000 pedal box and 14' cord from pedal box to amp. Pedals generally arranged in order of tuner, distortion effects, then modulation effects with the Constrictor either at end of chain or directly after tuner. Pedals connected with Hosa pedal couplers.
- Power: Power adapters either plugged directly into wall AC outlet or run through a Tripp-Lite UPS with power conditoning & noise filtering.
- Effects plugged either into the Dunlop DC-Brick with individual power cords or the Behringer wall wart, distrubution block, and daisy chain power cord.
All the Hardwire pedals and the Line 6 Echo Park and Otto behaived very well with supprising little noise reguardless of setup (no more than going straight from the guitar to the amp and usually less, especially if I kick the Hardwire Reverb on -plesant side effect is that it distinctly reduces high freq hiss). The DC-Brick did produce a lttle less high frequency hiss (only a few percent) on some settings, but not worth the $110 bucks. The UPS did supprise me though dropping the hiss about 10%, but I would dread dragging a heavy UPS around. Could probably get the same effect from something like the little Tripp-Lite ULTRABLOK that provides 40-80 dB of noise filtering, will fit in your hand, and only costs a little over $30.
The Constrictor; however, is a whole different story.
- Located at end of effects chain, Behringer wall wart plugged into UPS: If you set the Level (and in some instances, the Sustain) to more than about 70% and reduce the gate to less than about 30%, the hiss and feedback are ungodly. This is especially true if I try and use any of the distortion effects like Metal Distortion or Tube Overdrive.
- Located at end of effects chain, DC-Brick plugged into UPS: With the DC-Brick, again there's somewhat less hiss, but still totally unacceptable and lots of feedback, severly limiting the usefulness of the Constrictor in this location.
In both cases, it also severly dampened/fuzzed the sound of the Metal Distortion pedal where it was almost useless.
- Locted after tuner and before other effects: Much better here with ability to gererally take Level/Sustain all the way up without severe feedback at fairly high guitar volume knob levels without distortion pedal effects on and at moderate guitar volume levels with them on (pretty bad at higher levels). Still can't drop the Gate below about 30% or get intolerable high frequency hiss. Also has a bad habit of generating a strong sharp pulse whenever you turn it on that is very audible. Same result if Constrictor is only pedal hooked up to DC-Brick and all others are powered by Behringer wall wart.
All-in-all, not impressed in any of the configurations I messed with, but it could be result of not having a true isolated power source. If I build the isolation circuits, I'll see if it improves. Right now, I think I would have liked the Boss CS-3 Compressor/Sustainer or something else better.
Currently Being ModeratedMar 14, 2010 9:21 PM (in response to Porkchop61YD)Re: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
Update on the Constrictor. I didn't have time before, but I tried it with my Rocktron Guitar Silencer, and that pretty much seemed to solve the problem. Tried it in three different modes: Constrictor at beginning of chain right after tuner but before Guitar Silencer, in Send/Return loop of the Guitar Silencer with Hardwire Metal and Tube Overdrive (more noisy distortion pedals), after Guitar Silencer with Metal and Tube Overdrive pedals still in Guitar Silencer Send/Return loop. For the first two, the Guitar Silencer resolves the noise & feedback issues very well; however, it's somewhat difficult to get the Gate and Hush levels set so that they don't cut off the tails of notes rendering the Constrictor somewhat ineffective. Suprisingly, it works fairly well in the last setup as the Guitar Silencer takes out the line noise generated by my Tele and the noiser distortion effects pedals providing a much cleaner signal to the Constrictor. Much happier with the Constrictor now.
Also put in the Liqua Flange hooked up to the DC-Brick and it works flawlessly (was in the chain after the Guitar Silencer).
So, as far as daisy chaining and using non-isolated power sources goes, I've tested the Echo Park, Liqua Flange, Otto Filter, and Constrictor, and they all seem to work fairly well. They tend to work better if you have some power conditioning/noise filtering. So, I would say you can use a single cheaper power source such as the DC-Brick or even a decent wall wart daisy chain (as opposed to more expensive isolated power sources from Voodoo Labs, Modtone, etc.) to power all your effects at once. The Echo Park, Liqua Flange, and Otto Filter acutally seem to work pretty well without the noise filtering. Power conditioning and noise filtering can be done fairly cheaply using a decent surge suppressor with noise suppression like like the Tripp-lite Ultrablok that can be found for about $30. Using a power source like the DC-Brick with built in noise filtering also helps a little, and any remaining issues could probably be resolved with a noise gate/suppression pedal.
Currently Being ModeratedMar 15, 2010 3:41 PM (in response to Porkchop61YD)RE: Power Supply & Daisy Chaining ToneCore Effects Pedals and Docks
It sounds like you are doing OK with running the power stringers and/or the DC brick. Unfortunately Line 6 cannot support either of these power sources for the Tonecore pedals, as you have seen the results can vary. Please see the following links for more information on powering and chaining your pedals:
Power Supply and Amp Power F.A.Q.
Line 6 Four Button/Stompbox Pedal FAQs