Aug 19, 2010 8:26 PM
The Variax wishlist - getting some perspective
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I have read many that have quite increadible and fanciful wishlists of features. While it might be truly wonderful to have all that in the guitar of our wishes and have it handed to us by our Fairy God Roadie, I really believe it's worth putting the Variax into some perspective.
I own Variaxes and pretty much use them exclusively, so I would like to frame things around actual real usage of the instrument.
The Variax comes with 25 types of guitars including a banjo, 2 resonators, 2 12 string acoustics and 3 6 string acoustics. Now if you think of how many guitars any leading artist would have on stage with him, it wouldn't total 25. Sometimes the artist will have several of the same guitar just with alternate tunings. So, when you think that you have 25 guitars on stage with you, what makes your needs greater than the top guitarists who get on stage with less guitars than the 25? Moving on to the JTV which has 12 alternate tunings separate from the stored models. The JTV has the ability to be the equivalent of 300 guitars on stage with you. Seriously, who needs 300 guitars on stage with them?
So, let's step off the stage and into the studio. I know quite a few session/studio guitarists and they usually have a few guitars at their disposal for the various recording assignments that they get. I am not aware of a session guitarist who takes more than 25 guitars with him to the studio. So, really, when you think that the Variax can have up to 60 different guitar setups ready to go with the use of Workbench, is there really any need for more guitars?
There has been mention of not being able to access the factory defaults if the User memory has been used for customised guitars unless you have a Line 6 device that gives access to the factory banks. Under these circumstances, there are 2 simple options. Get one of those Line 6 devices or do what most guitarists do when one guitar isn't enough, buy another guitar.
As for Sustainiacs and compensating nuts, etc., etc., etc. The demand for such things is fairly nichey, that's why they are available as optional add ons rather than standard equipment on every guitar. So, if we put all those optional extras into perspective, it really makes sense to leave it up to the individual user to add them to the Variax just as they would add them to any other guitar.
When we truly focus on the shortcomings of the original Variax, it really was just about the quality of the guitar build and to a lesser extent the quality of the modelling. These two key issues have been well and truly addressed with the upcoming JTV. Having the global alternate tuning is really the icing on the cake.
So, the way I see it. The JTV is exactly where the advancement of the Variax needs to be as the JTVs will deliver the most needed improvements that are most important to most guitarists.
Well that's my 2 cents worth.
Cheers,
Crusty
Ditto!!
I wholeheartedly concur with you sir about perspective lol.... I'm dying to get my variax. Trying to pick which one to buy first is tough too. I want 3 of each LOL!!!
I had been seriously contemplating a variax this last year or so but then I saw and heard this JTV (youtube) and now I'm ready to jump in big time.
Just gotta save the pennies now. My band uses almost 10 different tunings so this is just perfect. Especially since I got a VettaII HD half stack a
few years back. I actually bought back an AX2 which I sorely missed. I have that on top of the 4X12 and the HD on top of that and I am covered for
soooo many sounds it's frickin' ridiculous lol.....but in a great way!! Everything is at eye level for me I love it for tweaking/adjusting/experimenting...
Now I won't have to switch guitars for different songs. Just click click BOOM!!
Here's a link to my bands music http://www.myspace.com/wolfyalexander (note: not all guitar sounds are line6...just a convenience thing for now)
Oh, and a HUGE shout out and thank you to everyone for posting all your cool ideas/solutions/ work-arounds. Probably saves many of us tons of
time and money...much appreciated!!
Keep rockin' everyone,
Joaquin
Crusty_Old_Rocker wrote:
Seriously, who needs 300 guitars on stage with them?
So, let's step off the stage and into the studio. I know quite a few session/studio guitarists and they usually have a few guitars at their disposal for the various recording assignments that they get. I am not aware of a session guitarist who takes more than 25 guitars with him to the studio. So, really, when you think that the Variax can have up to 60 different guitar setups ready to go with the use of Workbench, is there really any need for more guitars?
Not a great argument. Most guitar palyers play into one amp with a few pedals. Why do you use a POD?
Stevie wonder used to get by with piano and rhodes why would anyone buy a Phantom or Motif?
George martin used to get by with 4 tracks. . . .why would anyone ever need more than 8?
My first hard drive was 40 megs. . . . .why would anyone ever need more than 500 megs?
Why would anyone want a GUI to work on patches and an easy way to store and recall them when they can just put their X3L on a music stand;-)
Most variax users never opened workbench so forget it.
Why would anyone think it is better to have to stack 2 humbuckers on top of each other in workbench and lower output by 6db or whatever than just selecting a hotter pickup? Or better yet having a guitar modeled with hotter pickups?
Why would anyone delete the jazzbox models so they can have a hotter strat? Why not have both?
toasterdude wrote:
Not a great argument. Most guitar palyers play into one amp with a few pedals. Why do you use a POD?
Stevie wonder used to get by with piano and rhodes why would anyone buy a Phantom or Motif?
George martin used to get by with 4 tracks. . . .why would anyone ever need more than 8?
My first hard drive was 40 megs. . . . .why would anyone ever need more than 500 megs?
Why would anyone want a GUI to work on patches and an easy way to store and recall them when they can just put their X3L on a music stand;-)
Most variax users never opened workbench so forget it.
Why would anyone think it is better to have to stack 2 humbuckers on top of each other in workbench and lower output by 6db or whatever than just selecting a hotter pickup? Or better yet having a guitar modeled with hotter pickups?
Why would anyone delete the jazzbox models so they can have a hotter strat? Why not have both?
Yeah, but needing more than 300 guitars on stage for a gig? It must be a long show. I'd love to see the set lists.
I use a POD because it saves me having to lug even just one amp and a buch of effects that then all need to be set up.
Oh, the POD also gives me foot control over the Variax.
Oh, the POD opens up the Factory models on the Variax.
Oh, the POD powers the Variax to save on more messing around with the setup.
Oh, I use a POD so I can consistently have the same tones because they are saved as patches.
Need I continue? It's not all about having 78 amp models and 100+ effects.
As for the Variax users that never touched Workbench, who do they have to blame but themselves?
I'll say it again +6db on each pickup then another +6db on the guitar model, how much hotter does the signal need to be? I have successfully built models that sound like other guitars. The pictures in Workbench look nothing like the guitars that I have modelled, but they sure sound like them. Perhaps people just expect to see a picture of an Ibanez body and DiMarzio or EMG pickups in Workbench, rather than set up the sound they are looking for. Have you seen Ron Huisen's modern Strat models in Workbench? They are built using non Strat bodies and pickups. If I remember correctly the Strat models are using Les Paul Jr bodies. This skill is in focussing on the sound you want, rather than the pictures on the screen, you'll be surprised with what you can achieve with Workbench.
There was never any need to delete the Jazzbox models to have a hotter Strat, that's what Custom 1 and Custom 2 are for (or better still, use a POD to access the Factory banks and then you have 60 memory locations for other guitar models). 25 factory guitars plus up to 60 custom guitars, I have not seen a guitarist needing 85 guitars for a gig, but that's just me.
Cheers,
Crusty
Crusty_Old_Rocker wrote:
Oh, the POD opens up the Factory models on the Variax.
There was never any need to delete the Jazzbox models to have a hotter Strat, that's what Custom 1 and Custom 2 are for (or better still, use a POD to access the Factory banks and then you have 60 memory locations for other guitar models). 25 factory guitars plus up to 60 custom guitars, I have not seen a guitarist needing 85 guitars for a gig, but that's just me.
Cheers,
Crusty
The defense rests . . . . .no further questions your honor. You use the POD so you can access the factory patches? But I thought nobody would ever need more than 25? Wouldn't it be nice if non POD users could alos access the factory patches? That was the point one poster was making.
It has zero to do with needing 85 guitars for one gig. I may only use less than 10. I would still want as many choices as possible. I know guys that have more than 10 strats. Fat strat, strat with Fralins, Strat with lipstick, Maple neck, rosewood neck, Alder strat, swamp ash strat. If that guy could have ONE guitar that gets all his strat sounds PLUS still get all the factory patches to do some other stuff. . . . .how is that not better?
Look at the LP models. The vax only has one volume control. Many, Many LP players will use middle position and dial in a bunch of different tones depending on the blends. I have seen LP guys endlessly adjusting pots to get just the right tone. I don't. . . .my volume and tone are nearly always on 10. If a LP guy could save a patch that was a different config of LP with different pickups and different volume and tone for each song or sound he needed. . . .why would that be bad?
Quick comments
1. You can save your variax settings in Work Bench so if you experiment and build new models but decide to go back to stock settings, you have them saved, ready for access.
2. I haven't spent much time adjusting models with workbench other than for creating some different tunings like drop D and DADGAD. One setting I've enjoyed was to take a 12 string setting and make the octave string a 5th above the root note. Very cool for Alan Holdsworth type chords or a fusion lead sound.
3. I'm looking forward to the new variax models for the ability to access alt tunings for any model and for the greater processing power, and hopefully, the tremolo arm assembly is better quality, more responsive.
Crusty_Old_Rocker wrote:
As for the Variax users that never touched Workbench, who do they have to blame but themselves?
I'll say it again +6db on each pickup then another +6db on the guitar model, how much hotter does the signal need to be? I have successfully built models that sound like other guitars. The pictures in Workbench look nothing like the guitars that I have modelled, but they sure sound like them. Perhaps people just expect to see a picture of an Ibanez body and DiMarzio or EMG pickups in Workbench, rather than set up the sound they are looking for. Have you seen Ron Huisen's modern Strat models in Workbench? They are built using non Strat bodies and pickups. If I remember correctly the Strat models are using Les Paul Jr bodies. This skill is in focussing on the sound you want, rather than the pictures on the screen, you'll be surprised with what you can achieve with Workbench.
There was never any need to delete the Jazzbox models to have a hotter Strat, that's what Custom 1 and Custom 2 are for (or better still, use a POD to access the Factory banks and then you have 60 memory locations for other guitar models). 25 factory guitars plus up to 60 custom guitars, I have not seen a guitarist needing 85 guitars for a gig, but that's just me.
Cheers,
Crusty
You can't be serious? I don't want a Jem model, and hate EMGs but I bet any potential JTV89 customers would want both.
So you are saying the Guitar Center sales rep who knows very little is better off telling the kid that he can connect to workbench and lay one pickup on top of another then add 6 DB of gain and the crank up the overall gain 6db, and don't worry the picture will look weird but it will sound great?
I am thinking a section on the knob for JEM and another for ESP/EMG etc would be a wee bit more intuitive and help sell way more variaxes.
I am sure a skilled mechanic can install an aftermarket turbo charger easily, but car manufacturers still have that as an option for people that want to drive and not work on the cars. Many people on this forum are tweakers of the highest order. I thought the point of JTV was to "dominate" the guitar world. . . . .never happen if you need to enter workbench just to have a JEM guitar or PRS etc.
Are you saying that you never use gearbox now and still have your x3l on a music stand?
toasterdude wrote:
You can't be serious? I don't want a Jem model, and hate EMGs but I bet any potential JTV89 customers would want both.
So you are saying the Guitar Center sales rep who knows very little is better off telling the kid that he can connect to workbench and lay one pickup on top of another then add 6 DB of gain and the crank up the overall gain 6db, and don't worry the picture will look weird but it will sound great?
I am thinking a section on the knob for JEM and another for ESP/EMG etc would be a wee bit more intuitive and help sell way more variaxes.
I am sure a skilled mechanic can install an aftermarket turbo charger easily, but car manufacturers still have that as an option for people that want to drive and not work on the cars. Many people on this forum are tweakers of the highest order. I thought the point of JTV was to "dominate" the guitar world. . . . .never happen if you need to enter workbench just to have a JEM guitar or PRS etc.
Are you saying that you never use gearbox now and still have your x3l on a music stand?
What I was drawing attention to is that the line needs to be drawn somewhere. Using a logic of what every conceivable potential JTV customer might want included, then the Variax would probably need a hard drive built in along with some UI that would enable quick access to hundreds of thousands of guitars. How long do we want to wait for Line 6 to model every guitar ever invented before releasing the JTV series?
The fact remains that every user can have access to hundreds of thousand of models by saving their creations using Workbench. There are pre-built guitar (and bass) models available on the Internet (Andy Z's Institute of Noise is a good starting point). So, users don't need to be a guitar technician to access custom models if they don't have the skills to build them.
On to the Guitar Centre scenario. I know you'll attack me on this point to, but as far as I'm concerned if the Guitar Centre gibbon or shred kiddie can't get their head around what is possible with Workbench and the Variax, then I would strongly suggest that they stick with the $75 guitar and 10 Watt tranny amp package deals. One day, when they grow up, they might actually learn enough about the instrument to understand how to use a Variax and Workbench. I guess I have become too much of a gutiar snob. ![]()
You know what? I still prefer to tweak the X3 Live and Pro directly rather than use Gearbox. I never was a fan of Gearbox, Edit on the other hand is cool and I still use Edit for the Vetta II.
I see what you mean about the JTV89 because it certainly appears to be directed to a different market. I actually would have liked the ability to make my own model selector knob wrap around so that the selector shows what I actually have on my user presets. With the JTV it would be cool to be able to do that with the model selector and the tuning selector.
Mate, I am so split in two worlds because I dig using the Line 6 gear (as you know) but I also build point to point hand wired tube amps that have no solid state components at all. So, I do recognise that I may not be representative of the average Line 6 gear user, especially the shred kiddies.
Cheers,
Crusty
Crusty I could not agree more I know that you posted this long ago but since aquireing the JTV-69 in OCT 2011 I have had time to really work with it..
I think that using workbench is a necessity to really get the use out of the Variax if you are not using it you are missing alot..
I just suggested on a new thread that LIne6 add into cutometone Variax Patches I have aournd 30 right now and they are all good
so you would be amazed how the Nashville tuning sounds on the variax on with either the jumbo or parlor acoutic its amazing
I have even tuned the variax as a banjo which I did not realize how hard the banjo is to play but i am learning it because I want that
autentic open string sound of a banjo I am working on a project and this is a necesssity...
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100% + in agreement....however and there always is one
I do have too many guitars, some are old friends that I wouldn't sell, some are old dogs kept out of cussedness
I won't gig them nowdays, but I can use them as reference for the variax models, I've gigged with a couple of Variax's for nearly
six years now, prior to that a roland ready strat. which was way too complicated for live work, and the VG8 kit appeared to concentrate
on amp modelling. Line 6 seem to have got their priorities in order with modelling the guitar(s) sound inside the guitar
and amp/pedal modelling kept separate with other units,it would appear that their bulk market caters for the home studio enthusiast
who can't play unless plugged into a pc somewhere( just my opinion).Anyway the variax and it's new incarnation are certainly
a step in the right direction, looking forward to getting and gigging the jtv69, sometime around autumn this year...![]()
You made one good point in that this new line should have been all about the guitar, and yes there are three very different models, but all three, they way I read it, are based on one guys personal preferences. There are two main components to any guitar, the body and the neck. And of course the wood used for each is all important. Each species has its own characterists, feel and sound, trees are as individual and unique as people are..
But the over all feel is or should be the most important thing to any player. If it doesn't feel right you will never get the music you want out of it, no matter how many electronic parts you use..
And that kinda makes the neck all important because that's where you create the music. Same with the scale length used, not everyone has extra long multi-jointed fingers, and not every hand fits a big fat neck, or a thin skinny one either.
JTV would have done a better job if they offered at least a choice in the necks.
Not even in their US Custom shop do you get a choice except for the color, that's not very custom if you ask me.
Any thoughts about building a graphite variax? It feels crazy asking for more from a guitar that does so much already. I just thought the resistance to the elements and sleek black design could be nice.
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