Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 6:24 AM (in response to TheRealZap)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
They are always trolling the discussions, Zap. Every now & again, Line6Hugo or one of the others pops up, and besides, I want the rest of us to comment - as you have - so they can know that there is an issue. I find it incredible that the the Variax, supposedly the focal point of the dream rig, together with WB, are treated like orphans by Line6. I have to go to a third party site to find JTV models!
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 6:26 AM (in response to LarryLion)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
I remember seeing Variax models available in a couple of other places - not Customtone. The sites that I remember were called instituteofnoise and vettaville. Perhaps a quick Google search there will show some?
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 6:51 AM (in response to silverhead)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Yup, I know those sites, but my point is, why do we have to resort to 3rd party sites? Consider
- the HD500, all the other Pods, and the DT series amps (and probably more) are well supported in Customtone, but not the Variax's (including the new JTV flagship)
- The variax WB manual issue, well documented here, was produced by users, not Line6
- The Variax, especially the JTV, is supposedly the central point of the Dream Rig system concept.
- User feedback for models and comments seem to be ignored by Line6. I'm new here, but I do not see a website-accessible summary of user feedback, so that everyone can read it. Feedback seems to be a one-way street.
So this amazing product, which is selling well, presumably, is badly documented and badly supported by the OEM. I have several Fenders and Gibsons, and even those dinosaurs provide better documentation - not that it is really even needed - when asked.
I'm frankly puzzled by Line6, as a company.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 6:28 AM (in response to LarryLion)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
they usually only view random discussions when one of us experts bring it to their attention. anything in the regular forum marked as a question gets queued up and they have to read it, so they rarely go off looking for other discussions... not that it never happens... .just rare...
but i'm all for discussion...
i know that when the original variax came out, some users took on an ambitious workbench manual, and they were asked to stop.... don't know the details etc... but i think at the time line6 had bigger plans for the variax... likely their own tweaked models etc...
whatever the case, would be a good idea to revisit that discussion internally.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 6:59 AM (in response to TheRealZap)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Funny meeting you here! I found a reference to a thread on the JTV forum ~ 6 weeks ago from maybe 2011. One guy really got into programming for the Variax and left ALL his presets here for the JTV. He did a pretty good job and some of them are quite useful. He had about the same thing to say about the 335 model as you. I am sure someone from here has seen that and can remember the thread to leave us a reference. (Please). He was really experimenting with different bodies/ PU combinations but spent a lot of time on the pots to make his models more realistic- even did research on that!
I looked at that poster from Line 6 that I pulled off the forum last month. In the LesPaul #4 slot they have a picture of a white SG with 3 humbuckers on it. I understand what you are saying about the light body etc., so that must be an error. I do see all the famous musicians who play an SG. So It is more surprising that we get a les Paul Special model instead (Bob Marley?).
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 8:09 AM (in response to DrFunk)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Hey there, Funky. I guess as the newbie on this stuff, I get to poke around and ask questions, and kick the dirt up a bit. There is a lot of inconsistency with respect to the JTV, in particular. Arguably, the core of the Dream Rig, yet largely undocumented by Line6, its creator. There are also no OEM-supported patches, that I can find. As for the models in the guitar, when you really get down to it, I figure they must have invested heavily back in the 2003/2004 timeframe for the original Variax simulations, and everything since then has been warmed over, as they try to recoup/maximize their initial investment. The JTV is a big improvement on the original Variax's, but the improvement comes from luthier James Tyler (the body, feel and look), the improved battery life, and the processor horsepower. The models, correct me if I'm wrong, are still their original investment.
That probably makes good business sense for Line6, but I see no improvement in models, and no new ones over the old Variax's. I checked these threads - people have been asking for or commenting on the lack of the Gibson SG for a while now (maybe years?). The ES-335 models, as anyone who actually owns a 335 will tell you, bear little or no resemblance to an actual -335. The Tele models, I suppose, are representative of an early Tele, but bear no resemblance to any Telecaster built in the last 30 years (which is what most people associate with a Tele sound). The Strat and LP models ("Spank" and 'Lester") - for the most part - are pretty good, and the Gretsch models are passable. The Ric 360-12 is very good, but the other Ric models are awful.I own all of these guitars - Tele, Strat, LP, 335 and until recently, a Ric 360-12, so I know what they are supposed to sound like. The ES-335 ("Semi") Iare way off the mark. I cannot comment too much on the JazzBox's, but I have played an L-5CES, which should sound a bit like a Gibson 400, and that model does not impress me either. We've discussed the acoustics at length, no need to rehash here, but there are some gross inaacuracies there too. The "Reso" section is fine - except for the Danelectro - since they are really "novelty" instruments, nobody should care if they are accurate models or not.
So the WorkBench and modeling issue becomes all that more important (to the user), and yet, it is badly supported. I cannot figure Line6 out.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trashing the JTV. It is a VERY useful tool, and I am getting great use out of it. It enables me to carry one guitar instead of 4 to a gig, for which I'm very happy, but damn, let's strive for perfection, not adequacy, especially when the JTV has so much potential!
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 8:16 AM (in response to DrFunk)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
You are probably referring to me. When I first got the JTV I went deeply into it, found as much information as I could and made 7 sets of presets and over 200 tunings. Here are the threads (which include references to my sources and links to different pdfs):
Variax models - a comprehensive group of presets
Workbench Alternative Tunings - Over 200 Presets
Indeed, there are not many resources and scarce documentation for Variax and I don't know why The above 2 threads were my contribution and attempt to energize more user involvement. If any of you find this interesting and worth pursuing, please pick up where I left off and explore the possibilities further. They are truly endless!
PS - I did explain how I achieved what I feel is a slightly better 335 model, as well as, how to get a more authentic P-90 sound. These models are STILL not even close to being accurate, or capable of replacing the guitars they emulate. I approach the intrument from a different standpoint; to creatively explore the possibilities for new sonic territory
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 8:34 AM (in response to guitar4u)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
You did an amazing job with those, and I use some of them daily, especially the Gretsch SilverJet. But there is still no way to get close to a '61 Gibson SG, a CURRENT Telecaster, or a -335.
As I said, I'm a newbie, so I figure I can ask dumb questions here. Interestingly, this issue has resurfaced time and time again, but has still not been addressed by the OEM. Maybe your philosophy - new sonic territory - is the intended approach and explains the modeling issue, and I should stop hankering for perfection, but it does not answer the question as to why the JTV/Variax is poorly supported by Line6. That is inexcusable, in my opinion.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 8:53 AM (in response to LarryLion)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
I couldn't agree more! I haven't spent much time with a 335 and have never owned one, so I'll have to take your word for that. I know that BB King, Larry Carlton and Eric Johnson sure do make them sound beautiful
I actually prefer the vintage tele sound over the brighter teles that came after but I do concede your point there. The SG is sorely missed in this lineup and it's baffling to me how they overlooked it It's one of my favorite sounding and feeling Gibsons even though I never got on with how it looks
Line 6 can and imo, SHOULD do better here. At least offer new models ala carte or as "model packs" we can purchase. I've always been disappointed that we never saw that. As for new "sonic terrirory"; in the same way that the piezos limit bridge-muting technique, they also provide a much cleaner and articulate tone where each string can be heard that cuts through quite nicely in a medium gain setting. That is one advantage the Variax has over its analog counterparts
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 10:12 AM (in response to guitar4u)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
I'm greatful you noticed this thread and were able to provide the references to your threads so people could pick up the models that you made. I'd like to take this opportunity to thank you personally for the time and good taste you put into making those models!
It is rather astonishing that with the JTV Variax a completely new group of designs for the Variax platform (albeit from James Tyler),
that Line 6 really did not bother to remodel the same models or offer different or alternative ones like we have been mentioning here. (Except for the Acoustic bank which has been widely discussed).
I am hoping that Rich Renken might be looking at this thread too. He was basically Line 6's project manager for the JTV. He no longer works for Line 6, but he is still very helpful, and may be willing to shed a little light on why there has been no update or alternative models available for JTV. I am sure the bottom line, is just that, a business decision.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 11:20 AM (in response to DrFunk)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Oh man, that really sucks to hear about Rich Where did you see/find that news? He was special ordering me a replacement JTV neck and bridge but I guess now, I'm up a creek
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 12:34 PM (in response to guitar4u)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Yeah, sad in a way, but good for him! He is a genuinely good guy.
I notice he does read these threads and got involved in the Headstock thread about 3 weeks ago.
If anyone can contact him, that E-mail address does not work on Safari, please let him know we would really like his input on this thread.
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 11:30 AM (in response to guitar4u)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Rich, by the way, I never could get your tunings loaded. I think you produced a 'dat' file, as I recall. Where does it live in the WB system, and how do you load it?
Currently Being ModeratedJul 3, 2012 11:34 AM (in response to LarryLion)Re: No Tyler Variax Custom Models in CUSTOMTONE?
Re:Rich Renken - I wish him all the best in his new gig
- Today I am "packing up my locker" to end a season in my life. I will be walking out of Line 6 on Monday after 7 amazing years to start my new career as a Mix Engineer. I am so excited for this new chapter but it is hard to let go of something that my blood flows through. I have many great friends at the 6 still and won't lose track of them, but it is still tough.
My company is Rev4 Audio. Keep me in mind if you know of anyone looking for a Mix Engineer who as mixed many diverse projects from Maroon 5, Evanescence, Wide Spread Panic, David Ruis, Jeremy Riddle, We are the World Haiti documentary, indie films, and much more. My website will be up soon and you can email me at firstname.lastname@example.org."