Line 6 totally dropped the ball by focusing on tubing up their lower end models (Spider Valve REALLY?) instead of taking the tech that got them here, the modelling, up a notch.  I still use Line 6, because of the value on the used market.  HD147 and Vetta's for around and under 500 is a great deal.  A fancy Spider with a tube section for 800 or whatever new is stupid and totally took them out of the game.  My next amp will be a Axe-FX, unless L6 decides to get off their rear ends and finally release a HD500 rock or a Vetta HD.

First post. Hi all.

I just picked up an HD 300 to get my feet wet with modeling. I see how it compares to my tube amps and stomp boxes. Before I spent the $$$, I spent a lot of time analyzing which unit to get. Sure the Fractal stuff is cool, but I just wasn't prepared to drop $2200 for an AxeFX II (if you get the discount), then another $800 for the MIDI controller, $50 for an expression pedal, and the anywhere from $300 for a Mackie Th12 FRFR up to over $1600 for a tube power amp and speaker cabs. Don't forget the rack case. So you are in for anything from $4K to $5500 and up.That's serious bread in today's economy. And I'm convinced that either Line 6 or Digitech (updated GSP1101?) will come up with a powerful improved product within 2 years that will will meet Fractal head-on and be marketed at a reasonable price point. Then you'll be stuck with a $4k AxeFx worth $500. In the mean time, I'll learn on my HD 300 and when I sell it for something better, I may be out $150 tops.

At least that's my theory and I'm stickin to it.

Peace

Ray

You're still not counting anything in that cost to actually amplify the Axe-FX. If you're OK with going direct, you're costs might be accurate, but if not, you're looking at something in the way of a power amp and cab.

I don't care what anyone wants to play through. There's enough diversity in the marketplace that anyone can find something that is at least passable in their price range, and honestly even the least expensive options available today offer a lot more than many of the most expensive options like ten years ago. A lot of companies are making a lot of good products at the moment. It really comes down to finding something you're comfortable using. If people are comfortable with the Axe-FX and like what it gives them for the price, that's great. I, for one, am not, and I don't really ever see myself going down the road of using rack-mounted gear like that. I also think that the whole issue of having to get a programmable MIDI board that needs to be setup for the Axe is something that can potentially scare a lot of guitarists away. Not everyone who plays guitar is a technophile. I know many guitarists for who even the complexity of an HD300 is about at their threshold.

Well, I think the DT-50 combined with an HD500 offers a pretty flexible rig, but, yeah it's not quite the complexity of the Vetta, and it's nowhere near the complexity of the Axe FX. I'm just not convinced that the added complexity equates to a better overall tone, or maybe more importantly, a better overall playing experience - at least for me personally. If people are willing to invest the time and effort in programming an Axe-FX based rig, that's great.

I just think that the if you were to plot a graph with demand on the x-axis and complexity on the y-axis, you'd probably end up with something that looks very close to the typical normal or bell curve curve. At the one end, you have the simplest of rigs - a guitar and an amp. There are probably a relatively small amount of players who just want that. At the other end you have the complex rigs like the Axe-FX with MIDI controllers or whatnot. There's probably a relatively small amount of people who want that. In the biggest part of the curve are people looking for something that's flexible, moderately complex, but doesn't necessarily have all the bells and whistles. So I think that's why companies like Line 6 develop the biggest part of their product lines for things that fall short of what people who are tweakaholics want. The modeling game is different now than it was when the Vetta was released. It's much more mainstream now, so Line 6 is primarily competing against much larger companies - not companies like Fractal.

They're definitely in there with Fender, Vox, Boss, EHX, etc. Plenty of pros and gigging musicians use Line 6 stuff. They aren't relegated simply to bedroom players. I actually think the DT-50/HD500 is a pretty uniquw move on Line 6's part. They're not really anyone else doing the modular thing at the moment. I just think that era of playing wanting a true all-in-one super amp like the Vetta has passed. There's not really anyone making that sort of thing at the moment.

Well, the Axe-FX is just a modeling preamp. You would still need a power amp and cab. It's not a true all-in-one solution as in it will in and of itself replace a tradional guitar/amp/pedalboard rig.

If you didn't like the AxeFX's complexity then you probably hated the Vetta as well.  A AxeFX with a power section gives you all the same capabilities that a Vetta head would.  Just better sounding, and much easier to dial in a good tone.  I was able to dial in a killer crunch during sound check when I got to use one.  Rarely could I get something sounding that well in a Vetta that quick.  And that's with 6 years of ownership experience.  It's also much more expensive though, that's why I don't own one.  Currently running a HD147, can't beat it for 450, loving the way it sounds and it's so easy to dial it in and make it growl.  I do want to eventually get back to something that has Vetta like capabilities (AxeFX or maybe a Pod HD Pro if they rack'em) but in the meanwhile no complaints with the HD147.  

The DT50 controlled by the Pod HD footswitch sounds interesting.  But for the money I'd much rather get something else.  Also have a habit of destroying gear, footswitches, guitars, I'd rather have the brains of my rig far behind me than on stage with me.  Thanks god the Shortboards are built like tanks!