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  • Karl_Houseknecht Expert Line 6 User 3,732 posts since
    Jan 25, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    60. Jan 29, 2010 10:18 AM (in response to captainbob)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    linux.jpg

     

    This was on my calendar today and it reminded me of this thread.  No offense meant.  I just thought it was funny and topical.

  • nuser101 Just Startin' 178 posts since
    Jan 24, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    61. Jan 29, 2010 11:06 AM (in response to Karl_Houseknecht)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    Coming soon, to a galaxy near you, the Mesa Mark V-Lx.

    Features the Mark V head with an embedded micro-sharc running linux, with an SD card to store all of your presets and footswitch assignments. The provided 1GB SD card holds thousands of presets, but can be expanded with OTC cards available at Sam's and Best Buy.

     

    • 10/45/90 Watts
    • 4x6L6 (or 4xEL34), 7x12AX7, 1x5U4, Moana Pipeline
    • Bias Select Switch (6L6/EL34,Liberal/Conservative)
    • Fixed Bias for Consistent, Maintenance Free Performance (Variable Bias available at 2 or 4 year intervals)
    • Full Power/Variac Power Switch (Optional Power Down Switch for Quaalude synthesis at end of gig)
    • 3 Fully Independent Channels with 9 Modes and independent "hard" switch for Tequila IV administration with optional tube).
    • Sharc Processor (400 MHz/2400MFLOPS, with auto replace feature that flies upgrade in upon user request)
    • Midi-Assignable Footswitch
    • Midi-input for independent floorboard controller
    • Footswitchable, Channel Assignable or True Bypassable All-Tube FX Loop with Send Level Control (over all channels when activated)
    • Output Level Control (over all channels when activated, mind control available at extra cost)
    • Footswitchable Solo Level Control (Optional "11" stomp button for searing leads)
    • True "Hard" Bypass Switch removes FX Loops, Output Level & Solo Level Controls from signal path (optional hands free controller removes fingers from path)
    • Tuner Output w/Footswitchable Mute (Available 60s mode variable frequency output enables atonal tuning mode for authentic garage band sound)
    • Slave Out w/Level Control (Mesa "Roadie King" Slave available at additional cost of room, board and hallucinogens - alcoholic model available Novembe 2010)
    • Fan Cooled with On/Off Switch (WhisperJet fan with turbo-cool optional)
    • External Switching Jacks for Channels 2, 3 (channel 1 is default), EQ & Solo
    • Aluminum Chassis (GOLDACHROME availability November, 2010)
    • 4x4 — 8 Button Footswitch (CTRL ALT DEL cancel button available at extra cost)
    • Casters (ABEC-9 EZ-ROLL bearings available at extra cost)
    • Slip Cover (Gold Leaf available at extra cost)
  • spaceatl Expert Line 6 User 4,456 posts since
    Jan 24, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    64. Jan 29, 2010 2:05 PM (in response to Karl_Houseknecht)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    So CaptainBob is a Space Alien?

     

  • Karl_Houseknecht Expert Line 6 User 3,732 posts since
    Jan 25, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    65. Jan 29, 2010 2:15 PM (in response to captainbob)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    captainbob wrote:


    I like the fact that I can slow this whole system down to adjust for latency.  How would you do that with XP?  In the bios?  Shut down, reboot?  I like this system because it has a specialized kernel that allows for this. Very easy to adjust on the fly.  Its important if you suddenly decide to add something to your effects rack.

     

    I guess you can't do that with XP....but I wouldn't see why you'd want to slow your system down, or how that would somehow compensate for latency?  It doesn't matter for me, because I use a TonePort which essentially has that whole ToneDirect, zero latency monitoring thing.  If there is any latency, it's lower than 5ms, because I can't hear or feel it.  And with my prior soundcards, I could detect anything above 5ms.  Great product, that TonePort.  And it works flawlessly on XP.

     

    Why would I need a specialized kernal in my operating system if I want to add something to my effects rack?  I'm afraid I'm not understanding here.

     

    I don't know what your impression of Linux is, but I think if you had any clue what so ever, you would find yourself a little more open minded.

     

    My impression is that Linux is a very good operating system for server based business applications.  It has a ways to go yet for home recording, but it'll get there eventually.  My other impression is that it has a significantly smaller adoption rate, by almost a factor of 10, than the Mac OS, which is small to begin with, though still in mainstream use and support.  I actually did install linux on my mother's computer once.  Ubuntu.  She kinda liked it, except for that it didn't quite support all her hardware such as printer, scanner, sound card, or video card.  Ended up having to move her back to XP.  Some day, linux will be an option for her.  It's light years ahead of where it was in the mid 90's when I first tried it out.

     

    Hey, I'm open minded.  But you seem to have this air of superiority going on here, and you also seem prone to spouting techno-nonsense, and since it's my job to dispel techno-nonsense, I respond.  While I might have an open mind about the OS, it would seem like the big guys like Cakewalk and Digi don't.  Probably because they aren't interested in supporting a hundred different flavors of an OS that comprises less than 10% (and I'm being generous) of the desktop market.

  • Karl_Houseknecht Expert Line 6 User 3,732 posts since
    Jan 25, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    67. Jan 29, 2010 5:35 PM (in response to captainbob)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    captainbob wrote:

     

    Because karl the more crap you add to your rack the longer it takes for your guitar strum/signal to filter through the electronics and get recorded on the drums you just heard in your headset. With this OS, when you adjust the latency the system slows. You hear the music in real time but the process drags to catch the delayed signal.

     

    My guitars get recorded on my drums?  I am so confused now.  You mean if I have a decent sized effects rack before the A/D conversion into my DAW, that I'm introducing so much latency into my signal that I have to somehow slow down my operating system so that I can hear it synched up with the playback?

     

    Anyone else confused?  Or is it just me?  It could be just me.  I guess.  I don't know Linux that well.  I didn't know you could slow down the entire operating system so that audio playback will match your latent input.  Because your effects rack is bigger than Petrucci's and is horribly latent.  I am going to have to tell our sound guy next time we play to put in some kind of latency compensation device into his system, because his outboard rack contains way too much latency.  Maybe it should be a Linux box?  They can apparently travel through time.

     

    The process itself slows down on the computer, but I hear the music in real time...  There must be some violation of the laws of physics there, for me to hear a delayed signal in real time before it gets played.

     

    You're right.  I actually AM nuts.  But I just enjoy playing with you.  Because nuts is as nuts does.

  • Karl_Houseknecht Expert Line 6 User 3,732 posts since
    Jan 25, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    69. Jan 30, 2010 9:04 AM (in response to captainbob)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    captainbob wrote:

     

    Yes you are having fun playing with terminology.

     

    Yes, I am.  Because it's patently obvious that you don't have a clue how latency compensation works.  And that's okay, but you come across pretending like Linux has some incredibly special advantage over other OS in this area.  It doesn't.  It's got nothing to do with the OS kernel.  The TonePort's "ToneDirect" monitoring, is just monitoring the input signal directly before it hits the DAW.  This is unique in that you are usually monitoring the recorded signal after you hit your DAW, which will be latent by some number of milliseconds, but the TonePort eliminates that latency by eliminating the need to monitor the signal, post DAW.  The audio interface driver, in my case, the ASIO driver, reports its current latency values to the DAW software, which in turn automatically compensates by shifting the freshly recorded material back a few milliseconds on disk in comparison to the pre-recorded tracks.  Your OS kernel isn't somehow magically speeding it up for you so what you play and what you hear are coming out at the same time.  And I'm not sure what you're getting at about latency before your interface, in your effects rack.  Because that's so low it's just not a factor.

     

    Linux is fine for what you're doing.  Never said it wasn't.  Just don't ascribe it magical properties that it doesn't have, which is what you've been doing since the start of this thread.  I'd love to see Line6 and others start supporting this OS, because I'm all about free software for home use.  My wife's computer ran Ubuntu reasonably well, aside from the sound card not being supported.  And yes, it isn't supported.  Did a lot of online research on that and found one person who had recompiled their kernel in an effort to get the same card working, with mixed results.  I even considered building her a system that would be completely Ubuntu compatible, just so she'd be free of all this virus worry nonsense.  But as it turns out, she has a considerable investment in Windows based software.  And there's the problem right there, going right back to your original point.  Not enough development or support for this platform by the companies whose software she needs or hardware she uses.

     

    As far as my IT credentials go, since you brought them into question, yes, I've made a career out of developing for the Microsoft platform at the enterprise level.  But not Linux.  The reason?  Out of the dozens of State or Federal government agencies, dot-coms, or financial institutions that I've worked for over the span of my career since Linux was released, none have adopted that platform on the desktop or server side.  Not saying they're not out there.  Just saying this: extremely low adoption rate.  There isn't a financial institution out there that will touch Linux with a ten foot pole.  Again, not saying that's right, just saying how it is.  So yes, I'm not as versed in that OS as maybe you are.  So forgive me if I didn't want to play the game of trying to make it work with the hardware I have.  I just wanted something that worked right out of the box.

  • Closer Just Startin' 8 posts since
    Jan 12, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    70. Jan 30, 2010 9:58 AM (in response to captainbob)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    I think , today linux distributions such as Debian, Ubuntu, or SuSE should be treated as usual fully functional OS`es just like Win or Mac OS (not to mention about 64studio or Ubuntu Studio, which are made to be professional music or video producing systems) the only difference is that these are free, and as for Line6 approach, I don`t really believe it`s a case of lack of profit on linux support, because main profit is on HARDWARE, things as usb drivers, Monkey and GearBox are FREE, so I don`t see any reason not to devevlop soft for linux, if there would be linux support for Line6 hardware, more people would buy it. That is so simple... BUT! Today`s world of capitalysm and finance is not so simple, if there`s a free solution, that works (which would be PODs, Ports or plugins working native under linux), who would buy the commercial one? Ringing a bell?

  • linz Just Startin' 27 posts since
    Feb 12, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    73. Jan 30, 2010 12:29 PM (in response to captainbob)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    There are many high end, paid-for graphics applications available for Linux which are strictly closed source.  It's simply not true to say that you can't provide non open source apps on Linux.

  • Karl_Houseknecht Expert Line 6 User 3,732 posts since
    Jan 25, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    74. Jan 30, 2010 5:13 PM (in response to linz)
    Re: Lack of support for Linux

    linz wrote:

     

    There are many high end, paid-for graphics applications available for Linux which are strictly closed source.  It's simply not true to say that you can't provide non open source apps on Linux.

     

    That's what I tried to tell him earlier.  See, what captainbob does is present a poor argument, you give him the right answer, then he pretends that this is what he was saying all along.  Then he changes the subject.

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