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2194 Views 12 Replies Latest reply: Feb 7, 2011 7:28 AM by Hummelong RSS
kman2949 Just Startin'
kman2949
9 posts since
Dec 25, 2010
Currently Being Moderated

Feb 5, 2011 7:37 PM

Amp model vs. Preamp

Ok this may be seen as a somewhat dumb question but what exactly is the difference between these two choices? My setup right now is a Schecter c-1+ to HD500 to Line 6 IV Spider 75W(with modeling turned off). Also, what would be the best choice, amp vs preamp, while using my current setup? If anybody has any economical ideas for getting a better amp or any other options similar that would make my setup sound better they would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

Tags: spider, hd500
  • gtrman100 Iknowathingortwo
    gtrman100
    479 posts since
    Jan 24, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 5, 2011 8:06 PM (in response to kman2949)
    Re: Amp model vs. Preamp

    It's really up to your ears, but if you plug the HD into the power amp in section of a decent tube amp, use the "pre" models(unless the "full" model sounds better,lol). There are many good choices, but you can get a used Fender Hotrod Deluxe from $300-400 used and they are good, loud amps. I'm sure others will chime in with other suggestions. You're not getting enough out of the HD500 going into a Spider amp. I've got a Spider IV 120, it's decent, but a tube power amp section will sound MUCH better.

  • Crusty_Old_Rocker Expert Line 6 User
    Crusty_Old_Rocker
    3,096 posts since
    Jan 24, 2007
    Currently Being Moderated
    Feb 5, 2011 10:36 PM (in response to kman2949)
    Re: Amp model vs. Preamp

    In reality, the PRE models are  designed specifically to work with the DT50.  While some have stated  that they are sending the PRE models to the power amp in or FX return on  any old guitar amp there is a fairly significant problem with that  concept.  The problem is a standard guitar amp only has a single  poweramp configuration.

     

    The  DT50 power amp stage can match the configuration to the PRE amp  models.  For example, a Fender Twin power amp section has a negative  feedback loop and operates in class A/B while a Vox AC30 has no negative  feedback loop and operates in cathode biased class A mode.  These  impart very different characteristics to the amp tone.  The PRE models  in the POD HD are designed to "hit" these different power amp  configurations in the same way they would in the real amps being  modelled.  This results in a highly accurate degree of amp modelling  that basically transforms the DT50 into the amp being modelled.

     

    If  you send these PRE amp models into a mismatched poweramp then it's not  really going to sound or behave like the modelled amp.  It would be like  ripping the preamp stage out of a Vox AC30 and putting it into a  Fender, Peavey, Mesa or whatever poweramp stage.  This will not sound or  responde like a real Vox AC30.

     

    So, the PRE models are there for use with the DT50 amps, the modelled amps will not sound authentic if the PRE models are used with any other amp.

     

    How  the end user chooses to use those models is entirely up to them, but  the true and correct use of the PRE models is to feed the matched  configurations in the DT50 amps.

     

    Cheers,

     

    Crusty

    • gtrman100 Iknowathingortwo
      gtrman100
      479 posts since
      Jan 24, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Feb 5, 2011 11:12 PM (in response to Crusty_Old_Rocker)
      Re: Amp model vs. Preamp

      According to the Advanced Guide:

       

      "Amp and Preamp Models: We’ve included a complete set of “Preamp” versions of each Amp as well. Choose one of these to obtain the tone of just the preamp stage of the amp - recommended when feeding your POD HD500 output into an external amplifier, or when using the L6 LINK™ connection.* "

       

      Obviously the Pre models were meant for DT50, but not exclusively.

    • kman2949 Just Startin'
      kman2949
      9 posts since
      Dec 25, 2010
      Currently Being Moderated
      Feb 6, 2011 12:07 PM (in response to Crusty_Old_Rocker)
      Re: Amp model vs. Preamp

      Thanks! That definitely cleared a lot up. Only problem is now I want a DT50...

    • Texxxxx Just Startin'
      Texxxxx
      368 posts since
      Aug 13, 2006
      Currently Being Moderated
      Feb 7, 2011 7:16 AM (in response to Crusty_Old_Rocker)
      Re: Amp model vs. Preamp

      Crusty_Old_Rocker wrote:

       

      In reality, the PRE models are  designed specifically to work with the DT50.  While some have stated  that they are sending the PRE models to the power amp in or FX return on  any old guitar amp there is a fairly significant problem with that  concept.  The problem is a standard guitar amp only has a single  poweramp configuration.

       

      ...while with the DT50 you can 'pause' and 'pop' your way through many poweramp configurations!

       

      Sorry, as an ex DT50 Head owner, couldn't help myself.   Just a slight, good humored jab....

       

      Loving the HD500 'PRE models' through my stereo Mesa 50/50 that runs into a DT50 4x12 modded to stereo.  The dual amp patches sound great with each amp coming through two different speakers.

      • Hummelong Just Startin'
        Hummelong
        24 posts since
        Feb 7, 2011
        Currently Being Moderated
        Feb 7, 2011 7:28 AM (in response to Texxxxx)
        Re: Amp model vs. Preamp

        It's great to have the choices for sure.  I'm running my HD400 into the power amp of a Mesa DC-3.  I've noticed a BIG difference between a few of the PRE and FULL models -- particularly the Hiwatt model.  In FULL mode I am able to get much more crunch.  I've never owned a Hiwatt but I guess that means that a lot of the crunchy goodness comes from its power amp section.

         

        I don't really use the PRE models much at all.

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