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269 Views 13 Replies Latest reply: Mar 23, 2012 4:08 PM by Line6david RSS
tuffrabit Just Startin'
tuffrabit
18 posts since
Jul 14, 2008
Currently Being Moderated

Feb 9, 2012 1:27 PM

HD300 Effects Groups

Maybe this has already been discussed in depth.  A quick forum search didn't reveal an already existing topic.

 

Anybody find a way to get around the grouped effects on the HD300?

 

Most of the time I find that I want to use two or three of the effects in group one simultaneously.  For instance: an overdrive and compression or an overdrive and a fuzz.  I'm guessing that Line6 grouped the effects on the HD300 so that they could have a feature point (selling point) for the 400/500.  If that is not the case I would like to petition for a firmware drop that would un-group the effects for the HD300.  Let me use whatever combination of effects that I want.

Tags: effect, 300, effects, group, groups
  • tuffrabit Just Startin'
    tuffrabit
    18 posts since
    Jul 14, 2008
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 12, 2012 1:14 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
    Re: HD300 Effects Groups

    Just sold my HD300 due to this limitation.  If Line6 can't/won't fix this issue they should at least print on the box that while you have OMG SO MANY EFFECTS you can't use them how you want.

    • silverhead Expert Line 6 User
      silverhead
      9,592 posts since
      Apr 1, 2009
      Currently Being Moderated
      Mar 12, 2012 1:27 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
      Re: HD300 Effects Groups

      The reason the effects are gouped in the HD300/400 is to avoid a potential DSP overload. They are not grouped in the HD500/Bean/Pro and you can use them with all the flexibility that you would like, constrained only by hte DSP capacity of the device. This leads to situations where the device firmware prevents you from using certain combinations of effects. It issues a message telling you that you can't add a given effect in a given situation because there is insufficient processing capacity remaining based on existing AMP/FX selections in the preset.

       

      Some users prefer the simpler, bullet-proof design. Other users like the full flexibility (and responsibility) of managing the inevitably limited DSP resource of the device. Your choice.

       

      This is part of the design of the HD product line - it won't be changed.

      • tuffrabit Just Startin'
        tuffrabit
        18 posts since
        Jul 14, 2008
        Currently Being Moderated
        Mar 12, 2012 1:26 PM (in response to silverhead)
        Re: HD300 Effects Groups

        I can understand that.  I would've been happy with the device telling me it couldn't handle a given effect combination.  If Line6 didn't want to implement that for the 300 then the other option would be to include the limitation on the packaging.  Whoever it was in marketing decided it would be a good idea to include the fact that the 300 has 80+ effects on board on the box, but failed to include certain important details like "oh, and yeah... you can't mix and match them".  Just a little bit deceitful.

        • phil_m Expert Line 6 User
          phil_m
          4,243 posts since
          Jan 25, 2007
          Currently Being Moderated
          Mar 12, 2012 1:34 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
          Re: HD300 Effects Groups

          I'm not trying to pile on, and the point is already kind of moot in your case, but doesn't the fact that there are three effects knobs with the different effects labeled on them kind of make the limitation of not having like multiple distortions or delays or whatever at the same time self-evident?

          • tuffrabit Just Startin'
            tuffrabit
            18 posts since
            Jul 14, 2008
            Currently Being Moderated
            Mar 12, 2012 1:38 PM (in response to phil_m)
            Re: HD300 Effects Groups

            No, it doesn't.  Those knobs are marketed as quick/easy/on-the-fly adjustment knobs.  Even the official youtube videos sport the use of those knobs in that manner.  The limitation only becomes obvious when you start scrolling through the avaliable effects models for each slot.

             

            You're right though, it's moot at this point.  To be clear, I'm not mad or venting.  Just expressing disappointment.  I feel as though this should be clearly labeled on the device's packaging.

            • johnpicton Gear Head
              johnpicton
              920 posts since
              May 14, 2007
              Currently Being Moderated
              Mar 12, 2012 1:53 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
              Re: HD300 Effects Groups

              To be honest (and I haven't seen the packaging for the 300) you are probably right. You sound like you were fully prepared to give it a go and a try yet you still didn't realize from the packaging that there were limitations. So chances are that you are right. I really don't think it was a cynical marketing ploy by Line6, but you are right that you should be able to tell just by looking at the box that there are limitations and what they are.

            • silverhead Expert Line 6 User
              silverhead
              9,592 posts since
              Apr 1, 2009
              Currently Being Moderated
              Mar 12, 2012 1:54 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
              Re: HD300 Effects Groups

              Perhaps the clearest documented info is on the product comparison page of the Pod HD models:

              http://line6.com/podhd/multi-effects/compare.html

               

              The difference is pretty clear there in the Simultaneous Effects row of the table.

              • johnpicton Gear Head
                johnpicton
                920 posts since
                May 14, 2007
                Currently Being Moderated
                Mar 12, 2012 1:57 PM (in response to silverhead)
                Re: HD300 Effects Groups

                I agree the info is there (and I also said in my earlier post that it is about research) but a fact of life is that not everybody uses the Internet for research. If it isn't clear on the packaging - perhaps it should be. I think I am beginning to change my mind about this in favour of the OP's opinion.

              • tuffrabit Just Startin'
                tuffrabit
                18 posts since
                Jul 14, 2008
                Currently Being Moderated
                Mar 12, 2012 2:07 PM (in response to silverhead)
                Re: HD300 Effects Groups

                That's the only place I've seen something like that.  Even then it's not very clear.  Like I said earlier, the limitation is only obvious when using the unit and scrolling through the avaliable effects models.

                 

                Think about my situation:

                 

                1. "Oh cool, Line6 has a new spiffy POD thingy."
                2. Go to local music store.
                3. "Oh neato they have an HD 500 setup for peoples to mess around with."
                4. See's price tag!!! "I can't afford that."
                5. "Oh wait... I don't need dual amp tones, signal routing, and more buttons.  The 300 should do just fine."
                6. Asks sales associate "Can I play one of the 300's before I buy it???"
                7. NO
                8. Buys 300 anyways and takes home.
                9. Gets home and sets it up.
                10. "Wait a minute.  I can't use an overdrive and a compressor at the same time???!!!"

                 

                Promise you I'm not the only one who did that.

                • silverhead Expert Line 6 User
                  silverhead
                  9,592 posts since
                  Apr 1, 2009
                  Currently Being Moderated
                  Mar 12, 2012 6:56 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
                  Re: HD300 Effects Groups

                  I sympathize with your situation, and I'm sure you're not the only one. It would be better to have the limitations of the FX1, FX2, and FX3 more clearly visible at least on the website if not on the box (which would also be good).

                   

                  You certainly did the right thing, for you, to sell the HD300.

                   

                  But I think things could have been simpler and easier:

                  11. Returns the HD300 to the store and gives the salesman who refused to let me test it a piece of my mind.

                   

                  ... or better...

                  8. Doesn't buy it without testing it.

                  9. Decides to do some more research, and quickly discovers the FX groupings. Doesn't buy it at all.

                   

                  I'm not trying to paint it all on you; as I said I think the info could be more visible. Still, you bought a product without understanding it. All the details were here, including the manual, before you bought it.

    • johnpicton Gear Head
      johnpicton
      920 posts since
      May 14, 2007
      Currently Being Moderated
      Mar 12, 2012 1:25 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
      Re: HD300 Effects Groups

      At risk of sounding a bit blunt - its all about research. It is a fairly well documented fact that there are limitations in the 300 that the 400/500 don't have and likewise in the 400 that the 500 doesn't have. None of this information is hidden.

       

      But I do sympathize. It is frustrating when you buy something that doesn't do what you want it to do, you have done the right thing by off loading it if it doesn't do what you want it to.

       

      I hope you find something that suits.

       

      Regards

       

      John

      • tuffrabit Just Startin'
        tuffrabit
        18 posts since
        Jul 14, 2008
        Currently Being Moderated
        Mar 12, 2012 2:31 PM (in response to johnpicton)
        Re: HD300 Effects Groups

        I know it's not hidden, but it's super apparent either.  There is a 300/400/500 comparison chart on the box.  How hard would it have been to include a disclaimer?  The whole point of me buying the thing was to replace my heavy, and hard to transport, live setup.  It was really disappointing when I discovered that I would have to transport the 300 and a bunch of my other effects pedals to get the sounds I wanted.

         

        Something that suits = homebuilt speaker isolation cabinent.  I'm just done with digital modeling for the time being.

  • Line6david Line 6 Support
    Line6david
    5,196 posts since
    Jan 27, 2010
    Currently Being Moderated
    Mar 23, 2012 4:08 PM (in response to tuffrabit)
    Re: HD300 Effects Groups

    Hi,

     

    Sorry you were unhappy with the HD300. The 300/400 do have a set "signal flow" unlike the HD500. They were designed to be a more "simplistic" POD HD floorboard design and are not as versitle as the HD500.

     

    Thanks,

    David

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