DT50 Sound Cuts Out on Patch Changes from HD500

[Baoh]

Before I describe my problem, I want to point out that I have read about latency and popping on the DT50 when changing topologies.  I think my problem is more severe than normal, and I have done my best to describe the issue and how to reproduce it clearly below.

 

Products involved:

POD HD500 w/Firmware 2.1 connected to DT50 1x12 Combo w/Firmware 2.0 via L6 Link.  The POD and DT50 were both set to factory settings and presets.

 

I recently purchased a used DT50 and connected it to my HD500 that I purchased new years ago after I update the firmware on both.  When changing presets on my HD500, I hear significant, sometimes severe, pops on the DT50.  If anyone would like to attempt to reproduce my problem and give me feedback on their results, it would be a huge help.  Specifically, when I change from the factory preset of 6A - Mysterious Wei under the Songs / Style bank to 6B - Plugged In Baby under the Songs / Style bank, the amp makes one loud pop and a second smaller pop and the sound cuts out for a second or more.

 

This problem is extremely noticeable because of the loud pops combined with no guitar sound.  I know part of this is from a topology change and a class A to AB change, but this is far more severe than anything I would expect from reading the forums previously.

 

 

My questions for the forums regarding this issue:

 

Can anyone reproduce this problem with a DT50 known to be in good working order with good tubes and an HD500 connected using the same preset change I mentioned above?

 

Any suggestions to minimize this issue?  Is there a problem with my DT50?  Is this a sign of worn tubes that need replaced?  Is this considered normal operation for the DT50, or does it need looked at by a technician?

 

Finally, if anyone out there has a DT25, would you mind trying to reproduce this on your DT25 and reporting your experience?  I have read that the DT25 is much better with switching than the DT50.

 

 

I greatly appreciate assistance.  If needed, I will try to post a sound clip of the problem, but I will not be able to do that until Friday or Saturday.  This is my first tube amp I've ever owned after many years of playing guitar.  I enjoy the sound so much that I hope I can find a solution to minimize this issue.

 

Thanks,

Baoh

[spaceatl]

going from A to AB can pop...Class A has a very specific technical meaning in how the power amp behaves...Technically, the class A amplifier itself does NOT have a master volume...The notion does not exist because a class A amplifier is running at full capacity at all times...

 

That changes with Class AB...The operation output actually does change...The more your turn it up, the more Class A it becomes...

 

The pop can get a bit loud when running at very low volume...however, when running the amp at a healthy performance volume, it should be substantially less...more like a "tick"...

 

That is just some info for you....It could be that your amp has some issues switching topography...sticky relays perhaps...

 

I did notice that you are a little behind on your HD500 firmware....perhaps you could try updating?

[Baoh]

I am away from home right now, so I put in the HD500 firmware version from the last press release I could find. I do have the latest which my brain says is 2.2x but I couldn't find a reference regarding that.

 

I appreciate the rest of the info, but this is far more severe than the normal switch from A to AB. If I disconnect the HD500 and connect my guitar to the front and set one channel to Top 3 Class A and the other to Top 4 Class AB, I still get the pop but it's much less severe and I don't really notice the sound cut out.

 

Please understand that I have specific directions above to reproduce and that is this VERY severe in terms of how long the guitar is cut out and how loud the pop is. This problem is not reproducible without the HD500 connected via L6 Link.

[Baoh]

So after your suggestion that the relays may be sticky, I spoke to a Line 6 authorized repair center. They said that doesn't sound right. Since I'm well within my 30 days at Guitar Center, the amp is going back to them tomorrow. I will demonstrate the problem to them and try to get them to repair it. I'd they claim it is normal, I will just return it. Thanks for the help spaceatl.

[larryohl]

Would like to know if this was ever resolved. I have a dt25 which works great for small clubs but cannot handle larger or outdoor venues. So I bought a Dt50 thinking the extra wattage will fix my headroom issue with the dt25.

 

I use an HD500x and only get a click when changing topologies or classes with the dt25.

 

Regardless of the volume of dt50 the pops are EXTREME. Totally usable, pretty sad for a product pitched as every amp you would want to own.....not what the pitch is all about with an HD500. Maybe why they are ditching the product...

 

The dt25 works to spec, just no headroom unless playing softer than any other amp, now an unusable DT50..

 

Looks like time to return and get my money back.

 

What is strange is that no one on these forums seem to have this issue, a Lemmon maybe?

[Brazzy]

Would like to know if this was ever resolved. I have a dt25 which works great for small clubs but cannot handle larger or outdoor venues. So I bought a Dt50 thinking the extra wattage will fix my headroom issue with the dt25.

 

I use an HD500x and only get a click when changing topologies or classes with the dt25.

 

Regardless of the volume of dt50 the pops are EXTREME. Totally usable, pretty sad for a product pitched as every amp you would want to own.....not what the pitch is all about with an HD500. Maybe why they are ditching the product...

 

The dt25 works to spec, just no headroom unless playing softer than any other amp, now an unusable DT50..

 

Looks like time to return and get my money back.

 

What is strange is that no one on these forums seem to have this issue, a Lemmon maybe?

 

I know the pop you speak of although I don't gig. The only thing I can think of is the Amp should be put in standby or the master turned down before the topo/class change. It would've been nice if this was thought through for the gigging musician who need to make fast changes. Maybe a remote master control or standby switch would've helped, maybe it's easier than that though.

[mtreehugger]

Would like to know if this was ever resolved. I have a dt25 which works great for small clubs but cannot handle larger or outdoor venues. So I bought a Dt50 thinking the extra wattage will fix my headroom issue with the dt25.

 

I use an HD500x and only get a click when changing topologies or classes with the dt25.

 

Regardless of the volume of dt50 the pops are EXTREME. Totally usable, pretty sad for a product pitched as every amp you would want to own.....not what the pitch is all about with an HD500. Maybe why they are ditching the product...

 

The dt25 works to spec, just no headroom unless playing softer than any other amp, now an unusable DT50..

 

Looks like time to return and get my money back.

 

What is strange is that no one on these forums seem to have this issue, a Lemmon maybe?

 

I get some nasty pops too, depending on which amps.  As Brazzy pointed out, the worst-case solution is to go to standby before switching.  I wonder if this, from page 4-4 of the L6 LINK connectivity guide, explains your problem:

 

About Preset Loading and DT50 Amp Settings

 

Due to the higher voltage components utilized in DT50 amplifiers, you may find that not all amplifier changes can be instantaneous.* If you require the most seamless change between two POD HD Presets - for instance, during live performance - the simplest approach when switching Presets (or DT50 amp Channels) is to use the same amp Voicing switch settings for both. For those times when you want more significant reconfigurations between settings, here are some tips:

 

*Note: Since DT25 amplifiers utilize lower voltage components, their setting changes are typically less affected. However, the following practices can be followed with DT25 amps as well if Preset changes are not as seamless as desired.

 

• Keeping Class A consistent between consecutively-switched Presets will help avoid the greatest potential for disruption.
• The Super O, Tweed B-man, Class A-15 and Brit Plexi J-45 share an aspect (their analog B+ voltage) that differs from the other POD HD Amp Models, which can also be a source of disruption. To minimize this disruption, limit the cases where you switch between one of these Amp Models and one of the other POD Amp Models.
• Avoid making setting changes within 5 seconds of each other, especially if you’ve included the Class and B+ voltage changes mentioned above. The DT50 circuitry can take up to 5 seconds to fully stabilize after such a transition, and making another change before then can cause disruptions that you wouldn’t hear if you waited slightly longer.

[Brazzy]

<p>

 

I get some nasty pops too, depending on which amps. As Brazzy pointed out, the worst-case solution is to go to standby before switching. I wonder if this, from page 4-4 of the L6 LINK connectivity guide, explains your problem:

 

About Preset Loading and DT50 Amp Settings

 

Due to the higher voltage components utilized in DT50 amplifiers, you may find that not all amplifier changes can be instantaneous.* If you require the most seamless change between two POD HD Presets - for instance, during live performance - the simplest approach when switching Presets (or DT50 amp Channels) is to use the same amp Voicing switch settings for both. For those times when you want more significant reconfigurations between settings, here are some tips:

 

*Note: Since DT25 amplifiers utilize lower voltage components, their setting changes are typically less affected. However, the following practices can be followed with DT25 amps as well if Preset changes are not as seamless as desired.

 

• Keeping Class A consistent between consecutively-switched Presets will help avoid the greatest potential for disruption.
• The Super O, Tweed B-man, Class A-15 and Brit Plexi J-45 share an aspect (their analog B+ voltage) that differs from the other POD HD Amp Models, which can also be a source of disruption. To minimize this disruption, limit the cases where you switch between one of these Amp Models and one of the other POD Amp Models.
• Avoid making setting changes within 5 seconds of each other, especially if you’ve included the Class and B+ voltage changes mentioned above. The DT50 circuitry can take up to 5 seconds to fully stabilize after such a transition, and making another change before then can cause disruptions that you wouldn’t hear if you waited slightly longer.

 

Good post!! I know this has been covered here before. I find myself even years later still referring to the manuals.

[larryohl]

This is spot on for what is causing the problem:

 

"The tweed-man, ac15, plexi, supra, vari-plexi, and new tweed all have this."

 

"POD HD Amp Models, which can also be a source of disruption. To minimize this disruption, limit the cases where you switch between one of these Amp Models and one of the other POD Amp Models."

 

RTFM - Read The Freaking Manual

 

To bad it happens on the DT50, does not happen on the DT25 which is why I made an assumption, however assumption means make an a$$ out of......

 

Thanks for all the replies!!

 

I really like those amp models but cannot afford during gigs for a loud pop even if between songs just to be able to use a handful of amps. I have worked around them with others......

 

BTW part of what gives these amps their "character" is the cabinets they use, so assigning the Supro Cab to say a GibTone will produce similar but not exact results. Same with the new 8xTeed in the new vintage models pack, it can impart some of the sonic sound but does not total replicate the tweed amp model........

 

I know people say use the preamp with a DT50, my take is use what sounds good, sometimes the preamp does sometimes the fully modeled does...

[Baoh]

So I just checked this thread again today after dealing with the DT50. Tomorrow I'm picking up a used DT25 that I had to wait on because the dealer listed it online while it went to the local repair shop.

 

So the used DT50 I bought went back to Guitar Center. They were great at working with me to be fair.

 

I bought the DT50 used, got it home, and found the popping problem. I took it back to Guitar Center where I showed them the problem. They agreed that was bad. We tried the same thing on a new DT25 and found no issues. They did not have a new DT50 in stock that day. When I returned to pick up my DT50 post repair shop visit, I was told they found nothing wrong. As a bonus, Guitar Center had the DT50 head, 1x12, and 2x12 all in stock new and a DT25 combo. Tried all 5 amps (my used DT50, and the 3 new DT50s, and the new DT25). All DT50s exhibit the same problem. The sound cuts out momentarily and there are pops and crackles. The DT25 just clicks and is immediately on the new sound every single time.

 

Anyway. I returned the DT50. I found a killer deal on a used DT25. I will go pick up the DT25 tomorrow. I wanted the DT50 because I feel the DT25 will have trouble when clean getting over the drums, but I'm now working on the thought that I can always buy a second DT25. There is also a chance I will go to StageSource for a live monitor and only use the DT25 for recording.

 

I will report back his weekend on what I think. I'm very excited as while I was waiting on the amp, I bought 2 JTV-89 hardtail guitars which I absolutely love playing. Now if Line 6 will just get wireless VDI out, I'll be all set.

[lukeinfinger]

Similar issue. Playing through headphones the pedal was fine. Playing live the volume is cutting in and out terribly. Seems to be triggered by the expression pedal. I have tried XLR out L/R, Line out and headphone jack out. This is a disaster. I purchased new on Amazon a few days ago. Will Line6 fix on a warranty?