Verne-Bunsen Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 Hello all, I've been struggling to find the sparkling cleans that I know are within the Shiva, but I just can't get there. Do any of you folks know why the clean channel was left out when the amp was modeled? The omission is a bit of a head scratcher to me, given how thoroughly the different channels of other amps were covered. VB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 Don't know why they didn't model the clean channel other than the fact that the Shiva is known more a high gain amp rather than for its clean channel. I realize its clean channel generally gets good reviews as well. It could be something they could add, but I guess my question would be how different is the clean channel on that amp compared to the other clean options available right now? I guess it's always a matter of priorities. There's a ton of great amps out there to model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MakeItShredNo1 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I've been wondering the same thing. I have found that the Shiva is still loud with the drive on 0, unlike most of the other models, so I was using that for my cleans for a while, but I was having trouble dialing the flubbiness out, so I just moved on to other amps for me cleans (currently the mark iv channel 1) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted August 18, 2016 Author Share Posted August 18, 2016 Don't know why they didn't model the clean channel other than the fact that the Shiva is known more a high gain amp rather than for its clean channel. I realize its clean channel generally gets good reviews as well. It could be something they could add, but I guess my question would be how different is the clean channel on that amp compared to the other clean options available right now? That's a fair point, it just seems like an odd omission given that other multichannel amps are so thoroughly covered. I've been wondering the same thing. I have found that the Shiva is still loud with the drive on 0, unlike most of the other models, so I was using that for my cleans for a while, but I was having trouble dialing the flubbiness out, so I just moved on to other amps for me cleans (currently the mark iv channel 1) That's been my experience with it. You can keep it voiced nicely, but then it's still too hot for good cleans. Or you can turn everything down and put a gain drop in front of it to get it all cleaned up, but then it loses its character. Not ideal. As you say, an alternative is probably in order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 I guess I'm going to eat my words. I picked up Fremen's collection of presets last week and buried in there was a really nice Shiva clean. I borrowed some parameters from him and I'm quite happy with what I've got going. To date, everything I've had difficulty getting helix to do has been less a "What Helix can do" issue and more a "What I've figured out how to GET Helix to do" issue. It's all in there, just got to find it... And thanks, Fremen! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WickedFinger Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 I actually loved the Shiva model for just a little warm fuzziness on the notes, so many other options for cleans which I like a lot. The Shiva seemed to clean up pretty nicely cutting down the gain, bias and X bias also matter. but it is not a clean model really. Do ripple and hum serve a higher purpose other than making the amp sound realistically noisy? l use more clean amps than high gains as it easy to hit a pedal for gain. Have not found my fav amps yet in the Helix, still shopping around and adjusting. I loved the clean tube models in my GSP1101 which were not really mimics of certain amps but optimized clean tube amps, they are amazing, still looking for some similar things in the Helix. It's harder for me to really dial in a high gain amp I like than a clean one. Dig that Engl Fireball a lot. I try to ignore the name of the mimic and just dial through the tones until something rings with me and then tweak on it. Wondering why there is not a "no mic" direct option in the Helix? Mics color and change everything why can't we just get the pure IR? Or am I missing some trick? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 It's certainly true that there are lots of great clean amps already in there. I'm kind of working through a process though. After getting my Helix, I immediately got caught up in making wildly complex presets with multiple amps and all that, and now I'm trying to bring it back to basics somewhat, swing the pendulum back as it were. As I'm going through the different amps, I'm trying to treat them like I was plugged into the real thing. I've never owned multiple tube amps at the same time, two simultaneously tops, so the option of just plugging into a different amp hasn't existed. Which meant that I spent a lot of time tweaking knobs finding the tones I wanted with what I had. And I was generally successful. That's what I'm trying to do here, make myself put in the time to really find whats in each model before just going to the next. I'm not after the impossible, I don't expect to find Fendery cleans in the Line 6 Elektrik or any such thing, but I knew that the Shiva had great cleans in it and I wanted to find them. And I I'm happy with what I've got! As for the "mic-less" IRs, I've heard that concept compared to "taking a photograph without a camera". I don't know the nuts and bolts of IR capture, but it seems the mic is not added for color or character but is rather an integral part of the process. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WickedFinger Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Yes, on a 3rd party IR it is an integral part of the process and the way it is done, but I am speaking of the mic add on with the Helix which further effects the IR. Also bugs me about the mic position as other modeler units I have used allow you to move the mic across the speaker from cone to edge and you can hear that; also being 1ft distance as a min, who really does that when mic'ing an amp?? Most of the time the mic is at grill distance not 1ft. Other than placing a mic back off feet at a time for distance reverbish effect that seems to be a an exotic flavor than a need. I often have used speaker line DI taps to record with no mics at all and that can work very well if you have the engineering skills in the studio. It is dramatic to me how much a mic can alter the sound and being a pure amp sound player not a studio headphone mic'ing an amp user it can sometimes ruin a great tone that is already there. I work to tweak in an amazing amp tone and then I have choose which mic filtering as to mess the tone up the least. They seem to range from the 57 being the most true sound to gradually more darker, which is not always a bad thing but why not a "direct" bypass on the mic like a DI thing, its like a captive mic coloring on the tone which might be useful at times but also nice to have another option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 Well, I can't speak much to the rest of it, but I do believe that the minimum mic distance with the factory cabs is 1 inch (1") not 1 foot (1'). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WickedFinger Posted August 21, 2016 Share Posted August 21, 2016 I was cranking on this model today and man it is one of my favs. It is pretty clean and takes to OD and whanot really well. Bloody great amp, if the model is this good, I would love to have the real deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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