I’m A Helix and FrFr Noob! Help with setup please

[Pubcrawl30]

Hey guys, total noob here. You guys were super helpful with my last query so I thought I’d try my luck again.

 

Ive got a helix and a Variax Shuriken, and I’m about to get a Yamaha DXR12.

 

What I would like to know is, what is the best way to set that up in a live situation?

 

Ive read plenty of threads on this, but they just confused my noob brain.

 

I just plug straight into the Yamaha with a 1/4” jack, don’t I? Does anyone know what setting to put the speaker on if I’m going to be putting it behind me like a normal amp, or would it be best in front of me?

 

Also, what’s the best way to plug into foh? I don’t have any xlr cables, but I’ve heard you can just plug into the mixer with a 1/4”? Would that work just as well, or should I get some xlr cables? Plus, do I need to get really long ones for gigs, or do venues tend to have them available?

 

Ive also heard a lot about DI’s... should I get one? If so what’s the setup? Like from the Helix 1/4 out to the DI and then another lead out of the DI into the mixer, or something? I’m very bloody confused.

 

Now, I’ve just heard about the L6 Link!! What the heck is that!!!! Do I need that too???

 

Please could someone tell me, in layman’s terms what to do, both with cables and settings on the helix?

 

many thanks

[DunedinDragon]

Well there are a TON of variations about different preferences on how to do this, so I can only tell you how I've approached this and why so you can decide for yourself what best fits.  I have a very similar setup to yours in that I also use a DXR12 as my stage speaker.

 

I go out of my L/Mono output on the Helix into the channel 2 line input of the DXR12 with the Level knob on the DXR12 set to 12 o'clock or 0 on the dial.  This represents the point of unity on the amp in the speaker in which the amp is running at it's normal full state with the incoming signal neither boosted or attenuated.  You could also run XLR L/Mono out to the channel 1, but there's really no advantage to it since it's going to be a very short run to the speaker from the Helix.  I also have a set of DXR12's I use for stage monitors and in that case I use the XLR inputs as those can often be fairly long runs of cable.

 

The main thing to consider is how you want to use the DSP contouring options and that depends on how the speaker is positioned on stage.  In my case I have my speaker positioned behind me on a half height pole.  This gives me the widest projection of sound so the rest of the band can hear me and is the best way to project into the audience if we're not running our instruments through a PA.  In my case I have the D-contour setting to OFF and the High Pass Filter (HPF) set to 100 Hz.  The HPF is just another way of saying Low Cut and helps get rid of frequencies not typical used by guitar.  If you decide to place it behind you in a floor monitor configuration you may want to select the Monitor configuration on the D-Contour as that will mitigate what's known as bass biasing when monitors are placed on the floor.  That's an artifact in which lower frequencies tend to build up with speakers in contact with the floor and the Monitor selection will correct for that.

 

When it comes to running to the mixing board I'd STRONGLY recommend you send that signal via an XLR L/Mono out.  The reason for this is that XLR signals aren't as likely to deteriorate or get noisy over long runs like 1/4" can.  More importantly, not all mixing boards (at least reasonably modern ones) can accommodate a 1/4" input, but they can ALL work with an XLR input.  One of the things that you have to be careful about with XLR outputs in this situation is what's called phantom power.  That's a feature on mixing boards that provides power to certain types of microphones such as condenser mic's.  If phantom power is sent on your line to the Helix, the Helix won't like it and will get noisy and sound weird.  In my case I bought a phantom power blocker from Amazon for just a few bucks which I plug into my XLR out, and then plug the XLR cable into that to run to the mixing board.  There are other ways to protect from phantom power.  One being to run into a DI box and then to the board.  But that's generally going to require using the 1/4" output which I already have in use for my on stage speaker, so I choose to go the route I go for other reasons as well which I'll also explain.

 

I know you may not want to get too technical, but this is rather an important decision about how to use your Helix in a situation where you're going to a mixing board.  In the global ins/outs of your Helix you can configure the signal levels to be sent out of both the 1/4" outs and the XLR outs.  In my case I leave my 1/4" out set to LINE level output as that's what powered monitors normally work with when attached to a mixing board.  You'll notice the XLR input of the Channel 1 on your DXR12 can be configured to use either Line or Mic level.  The Mic level is what's normally expected if you plug a standard dynamic microphone into that XLR input on the DXR12.  Otherwise it's set to Line level when used as a monitor from the mixing board.  You'll notice in the Helix configuration you can also set the 1/4" output to Instrument level which would be appropriate if you were going into a standard guitar amp, which is not the case you're using.

 

The important aspect of all of this is in the configuration of the XLR out when used with a mixing board.  I set the global option on the Helix to send that signal as a Mic level signal to the mixing board as that's what most of the inputs on a mixing board are configured for.  Additionally there is another option in the global Ins/Outs of the Helix called 'Volume Knob Controls' which defaults to "1/4 + XLR".  This means the level you set on your Helix master volume knob controls the signal level on both the XLR and the 1/4" outputs.  I change that setting to be "1/4" so that my volume knob only controls the signal level going to my on stage DXR12.  In this configuration (along with the configuration of the XLR as a Mic level output) the Helix will send a full non-attenuated signal to the mixing board at Mic level.  This allows me to adjust my stage volume via the Helix master volume knob without affecting the signal going to the mixing board and allows the sound man to gain stage the signal on his end independently from my on stage volume.  This is important because once the mixing board is gain staged at the beginning of sound checks you don't want that signal level to fluctuate as it could cause clipping at the board.

As far as getting XLR cables, I carry a reasonably long cable with me.  What the venue provides can vary, but at least I have something in case they don't.  Most often they will provide you with an XLR cable that's connected to one of the channels on the mixing board, but you can't always depend on that.  As far as the L6 Link, that would come into play were you to be using a Line 6 monitor speaker as it's proprietary to Line 6 and isn't an industry standard such as an XLR or 1/4" out.

 

I realize that's a lot of information to digest, but it should get you started.  But that kind of complexity is part and parcel of having a system that's flexible enough to be used in a lot of different ways.  And that's why there's no single best solution for how to set things up.  I mostly have mine setup the way I do because aside from being a guitar player I've also had several decades of being a live sound engineer so I've tried to take both regimens into consideration in the way I configure my setup.

[Pubcrawl30]

That really is a huge help. Thank you very much. It’s a lot to wrap my head around but I’ll 100% give it my best shot

[Pubcrawl30]

2 hours ago, DunedinDragon said:

Well there are a TON of variations about different preferences on how to do this, so I can only tell you how I've approached this and why so you can decide for yourself what best fits.  I have a very similar setup to yours in that I also use a DXR12 as my stage speaker.

 

I go out of my L/Mono output on the Helix into the channel 2 line input of the DXR12 with the Level knob on the DXR12 set to 12 o'clock or 0 on the dial.  This represents the point of unity on the amp in the speaker in which the amp is running at it's normal full state with the incoming signal neither boosted or attenuated.  You could also run XLR L/Mono out to the channel 1, but there's really no advantage to it since it's going to be a very short run to the speaker from the Helix.  I also have a set of DXR12's I use for stage monitors and in that case I use the XLR inputs as those can often be fairly long runs of cable.

 

The main thing to consider is how you want to use the DSP contouring options and that depends on how the speaker is positioned on stage.  In my case I have my speaker positioned behind me on a half height pole.  This gives me the widest projection of sound so the rest of the band can hear me and is the best way to project into the audience if we're not running our instruments through a PA.  In my case I have the D-contour setting to OFF and the High Pass Filter (HPF) set to 100 Hz.  The HPF is just another way of saying Low Cut and helps get rid of frequencies not typical used by guitar.  If you decide to place it behind you in a floor monitor configuration you may want to select the Monitor configuration on the D-Contour as that will mitigate what's known as bass biasing when monitors are placed on the floor.  That's an artifact in which lower frequencies tend to build up with speakers in contact with the floor and the Monitor selection will correct for that.

 

When it comes to running to the mixing board I'd STRONGLY recommend you send that signal via an XLR L/Mono out.  The reason for this is that XLR signals aren't as likely to deteriorate or get noisy over long runs like 1/4" can.  More importantly, not all mixing boards (at least reasonably modern ones) can accommodate a 1/4" input, but they can ALL work with an XLR input.  One of the things that you have to be careful about with XLR outputs in this situation is what's called phantom power.  That's a feature on mixing boards that provides power to certain types of microphones such as condenser mic's.  If phantom power is sent on your line to the Helix, the Helix won't like it and will get noisy and sound weird.  In my case I bought a phantom power blocker from Amazon for just a few bucks which I plug into my XLR out, and then plug the XLR cable into that to run to the mixing board.  There are other ways to protect from phantom power.  One being to run into a DI box and then to the board.  But that's generally going to require using the 1/4" output which I already have in use for my on stage speaker, so I choose to go the route I go for other reasons as well which I'll also explain.

 

I know you may not want to get too technical, but this is rather an important decision about how to use your Helix in a situation where you're going to a mixing board.  In the global ins/outs of your Helix you can configure the signal levels to be sent out of both the 1/4" outs and the XLR outs.  In my case I leave my 1/4" out set to LINE level output as that's what powered monitors normally work with when attached to a mixing board.  You'll notice the XLR input of the Channel 1 on your DXR12 can be configured to use either Line or Mic level.  The Mic level is what's normally expected if you plug a standard dynamic microphone into that XLR input on the DXR12.  Otherwise it's set to Line level when used as a monitor from the mixing board.  You'll notice in the Helix configuration you can also set the 1/4" output to Instrument level which would be appropriate if you were going into a standard guitar amp, which is not the case you're using.

 

The important aspect of all of this is in the configuration of the XLR out when used with a mixing board.  I set the global option on the Helix to send that signal as a Mic level signal to the mixing board as that's what most of the inputs on a mixing board are configured for.  Additionally there is another option in the global Ins/Outs of the Helix called 'Volume Knob Controls' which defaults to "1/4 + XLR".  This means the level you set on your Helix master volume knob controls the signal level on both the XLR and the 1/4" outputs.  I change that setting to be "1/4" so that my volume knob only controls the signal level going to my on stage DXR12.  In this configuration (along with the configuration of the XLR as a Mic level output) the Helix will send a full non-attenuated signal to the mixing board at Mic level.  This allows me to adjust my stage volume via the Helix master volume knob without affecting the signal going to the mixing board and allows the sound man to gain stage the signal on his end independently from my on stage volume.  This is important because once the mixing board is gain staged at the beginning of sound checks you don't want that signal level to fluctuate as it could cause clipping at the board.

As far as getting XLR cables, I carry a reasonably long cable with me.  What the venue provides can vary, but at least I have something in case they don't.  Most often they will provide you with an XLR cable that's connected to one of the channels on the mixing board, but you can't always depend on that.  As far as the L6 Link, that would come into play were you to be using a Line 6 monitor speaker as it's proprietary to Line 6 and isn't an industry standard such as an XLR or 1/4" out.

 

I realize that's a lot of information to digest, but it should get you started.  But that kind of complexity is part and parcel of having a system that's flexible enough to be used in a lot of different ways.  And that's why there's no single best solution for how to set things up.  I mostly have mine setup the way I do because aside from being a guitar player I've also had several decades of being a live sound engineer so I've tried to take both regimens into consideration in the way I configure my setup.

So have I got this right? Am I missing anything?

 

On the helix:

In global settings -

set 1/4” output to line 

set xlr to mic

set volume knob controls to 1/4”

 

on the dxr12:

Helix L/Mono out to dxr channel 2 line input

level knob 12 o’clock

d-contour on floor monitor (for amp style use)

hpf set to 100 hz

mic level on channel 1 if using xlr

 

Also, quick question, if I were to use a DI box, couldn’t I use the L/Mono out of the helix into the DI and use the DI’s 1/4” output to plug into the DXR12? Then have the DI’s xlr out going to the mixer?

 

Or instead of that, could I just use an xlr from the helix to the dxr channel input and then use the L/Mono out of the helix into the DI and xlr out of the DI to the mixer?

 

If so, would I need to make any of the helix global settings different to above?

 

phamtom power blocker don’t seem to be very common in Australia and are expensive from overseas 

[DunedinDragon]

In the first case of using a DI to connect to both the DXR and the mixer, that would work fine and many people do it that way.  In that case you wouldn't make any changes to the global ins/outs but you would lose the ability to isolate your Helix output to the mixer from changes you make to the Helix master volume.  In the second case, if I understand you correctly, you would be using both Helix XLR outputs, one to service the DXR and one to service the mixing board.  However unless specifically included blocks in every preset to ensure the output was in mono, you would be sending a stereo signal with the left side of the stereo going to the mixer and right side going to your monitor.

 

[MusicLaw]

On 8/7/2018 at 7:16 AM, Pubcrawl30 said:

<Snip>

Or instead of that, could I just use an xlr from the helix to the dxr channel input and then use the L/Mono out of the helix into the DI and xlr out of the DI to the mixer?

 

If so, would I need to make any of the helix global settings different to above?

<Snip> 

In this case you would likely want to configure Helix's Global Settings I/O for the Main Volume knob to control only the XLR Out. This would allow you to control your stage monitor's XLR feed via Helix's Main Volume Knob. Helix's 1/4" L/Mono Out could then be used to feed a DI (depending on the features of the DI you use) with the DI's XLR Out then feeding the mixer. Helix's Main Volume Knob would have no control over Helix's 1/4" Out. Nonetheless, Helix's Global I/Os configuration would allow you to select either Line or Instrument level for Helix Main 1/4" Output. 

[Pubcrawl30]

7 hours ago, MusicLaw said:

In this case you would likely want to configure Helix's Global Settings I/O for the Main Volume knob to control only the XLR Out. This would allow you to control your stage monitor's XLR feed via Helix's Main Volume Knob. Helix's 1/4" L/Mono Out could then be used to feed a DI (depending on the features of the DI you use) with the DI's XLR Out then feeding the mixer. Helix's Main Volume Knob would have no control over Helix's 1/4" Out. Nonetheless, Helix's Global I/Os configuration would allow you to select either Line or Instrument level for Helix Main 1/4" Output. 

Awesome, that sounds like the go for me. Thanks heaps