Powercab 212 Plus/Helix Setup Question - Using a cab block with a speaker model

[dbugnon]

I purchased a PC 212+ in June 2020.  Up until then I just used my Mackie HR824 studio monitors with my Helix in the studio.  I got everything sounding great in the studio.  I always have everything flat running in Studio One and adjust all EQ within Helix. When I added the PC 212+ to my rig, first I tried Flat FRFR, LF Raw....  It sounded really bad to me.  After messing around a while, I ended up using the Vintage Pair speaker model on the PC 212+.  That sounded really good to me.  The Green Pair sounds good too.  I played for hours, and you know it sounds good when you play for hours.  The cab block was disabled in the Helix, and I was only using the speaker models.  I thought great, now I've got a Swiss Army amp.  Then I attached two brand new Mogami mic cables from the XLR outs of the PC 212+ into my Studio 192.  Because there is no cab block I can't use the XLR outs on the Helix.  Once again I wasn't happy.  It sounded like crap, and this is what would be going to the FOH.  The PC 212+ sounded great, but the sound coming out of the XLR outputs did not.

 

After trying many different cabs, IR's and every speaker model, hoping to get FRFR to sound good,  I finally ended up re-activating the cab block (2x12 Interstate) in my signal chain, in combination with the Vintage Pair speaker model in the PC 212+ and it solved my problem.  I get a very similar tone coming out of the PC 212+ speakers and the XLR outs going to the FOH or Studio One, and it sounds great.  The tone is a bit different than the speaker model alone, but just as good to me.  I'm using a single Mogami 3080 AES/EBU Cable from the Helix to the PC 212+, running in stereo. The amp block I use most is the Interstate Zed.  I was wondering if anyone else is doing it this way, or has a better solution.  Is it even legal to use a cab block and a speaker model together? :-)

[OmniFace]

Using a Helix amp (no cab) and a Speaker model in the PC212+ should send the speaker model to the XLR out of the PC212+.  This has a mic simulation on it, that you can control in the PC.  You can choose different mics and distances sort of like you do when using a Cab model in the Helix.  If you don't like the sound of the PC212+ mic simulation outs, I suggest you play around with a different mic model and distance setting.

 

I have 2 PC212+ amps and a Helix.  I wanted to check out the mic sims on the PC vs the sound from the amp itself.  So I set up an Amp with no cab sim in the Helix and sent it into one PC212+ with speaker modeling enabled.  Then I took the XLR out of the first PC212+ and ran it into my other PC212+, so that the first amp had just the speaker sound, and the other amp had the sound the FOH would get from the first amp.  They were both very usable.

 

I'm quite happy using FRFR mode on the PC212+ and the cabinet/mic sims on the Helix the majority of the time.  I mostly don't use the PC speaker modeling at all.

 

Using a cabinet sim on both the Helix and PC isn't "wrong".  Just a little strange.  :)  You'll be applying two big EQ curves onto the signal. 

 

 

 

 

 

[dzruna]

I stumbled on a combination that seems odd to do but sounds great. I'm playing around with the Jason Sadites template (Duluxe with two cabs) to the Powercab with the Jarvis speaker emulation.  Sounds better than the Powercab in FRFR mode or with the Helix cabs disabled and using the Powercab speaker emulation. Not sure how this would work out with different Helix cabs or Powercab speaker combinations or on the XLR out but I think it is worth experimenting.