STOMP vs SNAPSHOT Pages

[Aurasphere_au]

I have my helix setup for 10 stomps and the alternate page ie presets shows the snapshot

Does anyone know a backdoor to have the snapshot mode, momentarily jump to a particular snapshot and then return back after the switch release?

I need to do freezes on delay and splashes etc (think Rolling Stones/Undercover)...and there are a number of parameters switching so snapshots seem the right solution...but is there no other way as I dont want to use any of the stomp switches. If it had gesture handling as in midi...the press could select the alternate SS and the release could select the original

[rd2rk]

If you've run out of Stomp switches and your Snapshots are sacrosanct (based on your other thread), you WILL eventually have to get a proper MIDI controller.

You seem to be trying to run a three-legged sack race solo. MIDI is your friend and third leg.

[Aurasphere_au]

On 9/8/2023 at 12:55 PM, rd2rk said:

If you've run out of Stomp switches and your Snapshots are sacrosanct (based on your other thread), you WILL eventually have to get a proper MIDI controller.

You seem to be trying to run a three-legged sack race solo. MIDI is your friend and third leg.

 

Baha...

The stomp is for driving ableton and a couple of midi functions...the snapshots are for...well just helix stuff

If only they had gestures...oh if only...20 years after they became cool :-)

 

I do oem work...I literally have about 12 controllers for testing and researching...very wide ranging...

If only I could buy the brain of the mc8 and put it into the helix...

Also have the modulation setup, clarity and function of Guitar Rig...still top of the heap all this time on...but limited in other ways

 

It simply needs to be put together like a eurorack of plugins eg Freestyle and then load back into a hardware pedal...bit like irig had a go at...that was very cool

 

 

[DunedinDragon]

On 9/8/2023 at 5:37 AM, markwesse said:

 

Baha...

The stomp is for driving ableton and a couple of midi functions...the snapshots are for...well just helix stuff

 

That's certainly not a limitation for me.  My MC8 simultaneously runs Ableton and all my Helix Snapshots/footswitches and preset selection..as well as lighting control and lyric tablet selection and paging.  It's all the extra brain any Helix would ever need.

[Aurasphere_au]

On 9/8/2023 at 9:57 PM, DunedinDragon said:

That's certainly not a limitation for me.  My MC8 simultaneously runs Ableton and all my Helix Snapshots/footswitches and preset selection..as well as lighting control and lyric tablet selection and paging.  It's all the extra brain any Helix would ever need.

Its definitely high up on the list of solutions...I have been using my own gesturing via scripts/midiox/python for about 20 years (using old behry 1010 but seeing this unit come up with all the solutions coming from a hardware box is the bomb

We made our own midi lighting controllers and ran them off cubase live back in the day...doing that much toe tapping was so distracting. The percussionists drives ableton (and all our tabs are linked for page turn which he also does from the ableton clip for page turn or manual override) but often in improvisation, I need to do looping in sections so the helix is using foot switch gestures I coded into the remote midi script...which had been pretty solid

BUT

It would be nice to have it work for stomps (ie mc8) etc which I have to address macros in ableton if am to use Helix native. Also have midiguitar in Ableton so I dont have many choices ie Need ableton to host.

 

IF helix had gestures, it would all be sweet...I def dont want another footswitch/gear beside me...the helix already looks like the death star techwise.

 

Original Rig

Using airturn hacked with exp pedal and usb c BT

 

Using Keylab as extra controller on mic st

 

 

 

[DunedinDragon]

Yeah...that's a lot of stuff.  Mine is much simpler but I have the advantage of having designed it with a new generation of tools that made things much simpler.

 

There's actually very little toe tapping in my case.  Ableton does the lion's share of automatic activation via a simple MIDI out track that plays along with the song, so a single embedded MIDI command from Ableton in the MIDI out track to the MC8 can trigger multiple MIDI sequences going to multiple devices from the MC8.  My only interaction which is all done via the MC8 is to select the song, and start it (two distinct toe taps).  Everything else is done in sync with the running of the tracks.  I don't currently use any loops but if I were to do something like that I'd probably consider incorporating Maschine into the setup rather than add any additional foot pedal actions since I've gotten very spoiled not having to worry about foot pedal interactions during the course of playing a song.  My current pedal board contains only the Helix Floor and the MC8 so it's all very simple to setup.  In terms of audio I just have the Helix with a single XLR to the mixer for guitar and a separate audio interface sending a stereo channel to the mixer from the Ableton tracks.  My laptop has one audio out USB to the audio interface and one MIDI control USB connected to the MC8.

[Aurasphere_au]

On 9/9/2023 at 5:21 PM, DunedinDragon said:

Yeah...that's a lot of stuff.  Mine is much simpler but I have the advantage of having designed it with a new generation of tools that made things much simpler.

 

There's actually very little toe tapping in my case.  Ableton does the lion's share of automatic activation via a simple MIDI out track that plays along with the song, so a single embedded MIDI command from Ableton in the MIDI out track to the MC8 can trigger multiple MIDI sequences going to multiple devices from the MC8.  My only interaction which is all done via the MC8 is to select the song, and start it (two distinct toe taps).  Everything else is done in sync with the running of the tracks.  I don't currently use any loops but if I were to do something like that I'd probably consider incorporating Maschine into the setup rather than add any additional foot pedal actions since I've gotten very spoiled not having to worry about foot pedal interactions during the course of playing a song.  My current pedal board contains only the Helix Floor and the MC8 so it's all very simple to setup.  In terms of audio I just have the Helix with a single XLR to the mixer for guitar and a separate audio interface sending a stereo channel to the mixer from the Ableton tracks.  My laptop has one audio out USB to the audio interface and one MIDI control USB connected to the MC8.

Sorry I didnt elaborate...I only use the helix atm...

 

They are long since retired...were just milestones along the way...I just use the hellix now although I still use the arturia as additional keys

I play with different peeps/groups...sometimes Im doing percussion/drums etc, but mainly guitar/vox as a 3 piece with guests. I think the diff is that we rarely play the same song the same way twice and the main thing we are aiming for is getting to the spontaneous improvised space. While we might use a framework in live...its far from a backing track as we all are playing and would be pretty crowded quickly.

 

Sometimes we play as 2 elect guitars + bass and perc etc...so what Im saying is sometimes we completely build the song as loops as we go...so having mc8 and helix would be a bit pointless in my situation...I just want a single interface that isnt going to get in the way...and sounds like mc8 will replace all the stuff I have built in the past so I would likely just use mc8 and helix native in the mini pc that is sitting under the arturia (and use eg ur44 or some multi input/output io)

 

We also have the mix guy on foh who is part of the band really...feeling the mix in relation to the audience so as the improvisation develops, he will read the room and maybe highlight keys, or whatever is best to focus...bu this means Im using a lot of outs on the helix eg its all stereo so at times I will pan my elect guitar to one side of the stacks and the other guitar goes opposite (which is done per preset for songs and setups). Has synth on 1 stereo out, loop/perc stuff on 1 stereo and 1 mono click out to iem feed for the whole band

 

Sounds like you have your needs met...perfect backing track setup...Im guessing you are basically playing by yourself or minimal but if the helix was a more competent midi controller...Im not sure you would need the mc8? Which is my point of OP

 

If I play cajon...which I made a custom mount for the mic...you can get a serious kit sound out of decent foh...that would be 1 place I would like to try using the helix on as even a simple bit of looping goes a long way...I did test it with waves/submarine for the kick frequencies and it was insane (the 80hz fundamental became a 40hz sub shaker)

 

My only real gripe is...both the mc8 (from what I have read) and the helix suffer from the same clunky switches which is why I showed the airturn 4 pedal...they are the best quietest and nicest feel around..imvho

 

The brain of the mc8, the pedals of the airturn and helix native with daw fx/send would be perfect..one day maybe :-) Ah to dream

 

Cheers and happy gigging

[DunedinDragon]

On 9/9/2023 at 7:22 AM, markwesse said:

 

 

Sounds like you have your needs met...perfect backing track setup...Im guessing you are basically playing by yourself or minimal but if the helix was a more competent midi controller...Im not sure you would need the mc8? Which is my point of OP

 

I actually use this in a live band situation with three live instruments and multipart vocals.  But I did start off on this journey with just the Helix, but quickly found out the limitations of the Helix as a MIDI controller were such that it would never work correctly.  But that's okay.  I realize that Line 6 has a very well defined corporate market segment as a guitar modeling company and a big part of their success is sticking to that expertise and not venturing too much into other areas.  Because when they have they've shown they're not really experienced or committed enough to become a significant player as was evidenced by their short lived experience in making a PA system.  So I'm quite happy with them being what they are and being very diligent about it.

[Aurasphere_au]

On 9/9/2023 at 10:42 PM, DunedinDragon said:

I actually use this in a live band situation with three live instruments and multipart vocals.  But I did start off on this journey with just the Helix, but quickly found out the limitations of the Helix as a MIDI controller were such that it would never work correctly.  But that's okay.  I realize that Line 6 has a very well defined corporate market segment as a guitar modeling company and a big part of their success is sticking to that expertise and not venturing too much into other areas.  Because when they have they've shown they're not really experienced or committed enough to become a significant player as was evidenced by their short lived experience in making a PA system.  So I'm quite happy with them being what they are and being very diligent about it.

Sorry to presume anything...

I guess may main point was you are essentially using backing tracks...we mainly use live looping/improvised response which is a diff case for pedals and use.

 

On 9/9/2023 at 10:42 PM, DunedinDragon said:

in making a PA system.  So I'm quite happy with them being what they are and being very diligent about it.

Yeah I agree...although midi pedals are  core part of the excellent tools they make...they are just missing the sauce...gesturing is on the 1 switch looper already.

I didnt actually buy/use the mixer...all their AD is really quite good. I came close to using the mixer because of that but it was physically too big compared to the tiny eg XR18 and it had no sidechaining (I do lots of FOH mixing and that is ESSENTIAL)...the interface was a bold move too but I wasnt too bothered about that

 

tiny

 

 

BUT

 

You have really helped me with sorting a solution...which will be a little bit of work but will give me the best compromise

• Essentially make a small enclosure housing a Raspberry pi zero and load it with the mid gesture code I have done previously  (pretty much the same as MC8 + some extras for Live)
• Mount it on the back or even inside the helix and midi out/in to it
• Using the midi loop feed it back into the helix using different controller channels and assignments to get what I need
• Use the 6 switch looper page and translate that all into gestures and better implementations to feed ableton 
• Use the small touchscreen (which is already on my mic stand) with an M4L feedback util to augment pedal action feedback if needed

 

Ideally, as per the ideascale suggestion, if they allowed another stomp screen would be perfect but looper page will work for now...just wish it allowed use the blank switches

 

Voila...some work but problem totally solved and all done using just the helix footboard

 

Cheers @DunedinDragon