Which Distortion Pedal Model to Achieve "Vox in a Box" Going into Front of Real Amp?

[boynigel]

Yes, Helix has actual models of Vox and Vox-styled amps, but this is for situation where i'm using it just for effects and to control my tube amp via 4cm.

 

Last night i tried to do this using actual amp models.  i got close, but not 100% satisfied like i'd be with a Wampler Ace 30 or other AIAB pedal (which i'd rather not have to add to my setup).  I tried placing the amp model both before and after my amp's effects loop in effort take my amp's preamp out of the equation as much as possible, which of course you never really can w/4cm as my guitar signal is always going to hit the amp's preamp.  anyway, i ran out of time and went to bed.

 

Now sitting here at work i'm thinking maybe i could try achieving this tone, specifically that chimey-edge of breakup, via one of the distortion/OD blocks?  Has anyone tried this?  If so, which models should i try first?  I'm thinking Timah and Tone Sovereign might be good starting points but figured i'd see if/how anyone else has been able to pull this specific tone off.  

[rd2rk]

On 9/30/2026 at 7:05 AM, boynigel said:

I tried placing the amp model both before and after my amp's effects loop in effort take my amp's preamp out of the equation as much as possible, which of course you never really can w/4cm as my guitar signal is always going to hit the amp's preamp

 

I don't get this statement.

If you can't remove your amp's preamp section from the signal chain, you're doing 4cm wrong.

Describe your wiring and attach an example preset that demonstrates this "fact".

 

[boynigel]

On 9/30/2026 at 10:01 AM, rd2rk said:

 

I don't get this statement.

If you can't remove your amp's preamp section from the signal chain, you're doing 4cm wrong.

Describe your wiring and attach an example preset that demonstrates this "fact".

 

so, w/4cm, as you know, you need to assign an effects loop block in helix in order to have some stomp blocks before, and some after the amp's effects loop.  what i was saying was that i tried the amp block both in front of, and after the actual amp's effects loop.  but of course at the end of the day the guitar's original signal is still seen by the amp's input, even if the amp model is after the amp's effects loop.  pretty sure i'm doing 4cm correctly ;)

 

 

[rd2rk]

What you're missing is that in order to remove the physical amp's preamp section from the signal chain you need to BYPASS the FX Loop Block.

For instance, to compare the HELIX AMP MODEL to the PHYSICAL amp you assign both the MODEL's Bypass and the FX LOOP BLOCK's Bypass to the same FS, then SAVE the preset with one ACTIVE and the other BYPASSED. When you press the FS it TOGGLES between the MODEL and the PHYSICAL AMP.

 

Three things to keep in mind:

 

The FULL amp model contains a simulation of the PHYSICAL amp's POWER AMP. That means that you're putting a SIMULATED power amp through the PHYSICAL power amp. An AIAB contains ONLY the preamp section or includes a modified version of the power amp for flavor.

 

The Helix PRE-AMP versions have significantly less OUTPUT LEVEL than the FULL versions.

 

The SPEAKER IMPEDANCE CURVE (the modeled interaction between the PHYSICAL POWER AMP and the PHYSICAL SPEAKER) is contained in the POWER AMP section of the FULL MODEL. This affects FEEL, and is, again, doubled into a physical amp's RETURN. It might be weird, or you might like it. Just something to consider.

 

IOW - to emulate how an AIAB pedal works with a physical amp, you would place a Helix PRE-AMP version BEFORE the FX Loop and Helix FULL amp.

You then use a FS to TOGGLE between the physical pre-amp and the full Helix amp model to compare how each sounds with the modeled pre-amp, which is functioning as an AIAB pedal would ITRW. NOTE that it doesn't matter in this scenario whether the Helix FULL AMP is before or after the FX Loop Block, as they will never both be active at the same time.

 

FWIW - I've tried this and didn't like it. The Helix pre-amps just don't do the AIAB thing well. IMO.

But then, the couple of RW AIAB pedals I've tried sucked too.

As always, YMMV. The sound that you're after only exists in one place, your head, so nobody can hear it but you!

[boynigel]

On 9/30/2026 at 12:29 PM, rd2rk said:

What you're missing is that in order to remove the physical amp's preamp section from the signal chain you need to BYPASS the FX Loop Block.

For instance, to compare the HELIX AMP MODEL to the PHYSICAL amp you assign both the MODEL's Bypass and the FX LOOP BLOCK's Bypass to the same FS, then SAVE the preset with one ACTIVE and the other BYPASSED. When you press the FS it TOGGLES between the MODEL and the PHYSICAL AMP.

 

Three things to keep in mind:

 

The FULL amp model contains a simulation of the PHYSICAL amp's POWER AMP. That means that you're putting a SIMULATED power amp through the PHYSICAL power amp. An AIAB contains ONLY the preamp section or includes a modified version of the power amp for flavor.

Here's a weird thing about that- when i use the helix going into an amp's effects loop return (power amp in), i've found that the amp model w/power amp sounds better than just the preamp model.  go figure- a modeled power amp into a physical power amp sounds better.  way better.  well, at least on my Bad Cat.  maybe different amps would yield a different result.

On 9/30/2026 at 12:29 PM, rd2rk said:

 

The Helix PRE-AMP versions have significantly less OUTPUT LEVEL than the FULL versions.

 

The SPEAKER IMPEDANCE CURVE (the modeled interaction between the PHYSICAL POWER AMP and the PHYSICAL SPEAKER) is contained in the POWER AMP section of the FULL MODEL. This affects FEEL, and is, again, doubled into a physical amp's RETURN. It might be weird, or you might like it. Just something to consider.

 

IOW - to emulate how an AIAB pedal works with a physical amp, you would place a Helix PRE-AMP version BEFORE the FX Loop and Helix FULL amp.

You then use a FS to TOGGLE between the physical pre-amp and the full Helix amp model to compare how each sounds with the modeled pre-amp, which is functioning as an AIAB pedal would ITRW. NOTE that it doesn't matter in this scenario whether the Helix FULL AMP is before or after the FX Loop Block, as they will never both be active at the same time.

 

FWIW - I've tried this and didn't like it. The Helix pre-amps just don't do the AIAB thing well. IMO.

But then, the couple of RW AIAB pedals I've tried sucked too.

As always, YMMV. The sound that you're after only exists in one place, your head, so nobody can hear it but you!

makes sense.  too bad they didn't do a couple AIAB models just for the sake of the people using the HX Effects unit, which could then be carried over to Helix.  won't hold my breath on that one though.  My benchmark had always been the Wampler Ace-Thirty/Thirty Something, which i sold, and then a few years later bought another which didn't sound as good as i'd remembered.  i don't know if that's because my ears changed or maybe the bad one got messed with by a previous owner.

[rd2rk]

On 9/30/2026 at 1:26 PM, boynigel said:

Here's a weird thing about that- when i use the helix going into an amp's effects loop return (power amp in), i've found that the amp model w/power amp sounds better than just the preamp model.  go figure- a modeled power amp into a physical power amp sounds better.  way better.  well, at least on my Bad Cat.  maybe different amps would yield a different result.

 

I've found the same. It's all good! If it SOUNDS good, it IS good!