Saxer666

Thank you for your answer phil_m. I did open up a support ticket this morning. I know it's a long text and I'm a bit sorry for that, but I just wanted to give every Information I have on the behaviour of my helix - and a little commentary, so that it is not too boring. To be honest, I'm really glad, that I'm not the only one with this problem. I struggle with it for about two or three weeks, searched the Internet and just yesterday I found this thread. Yeah, the problem is the strange behaviour as soon as there is more than 1 Instant. I could post a patch, but my little protocol post was done on a blank preset, so I don't think it would be of any use. Also it seems to be a pretty rare problem. I mean you could try to recreate it on your helix. Maybe I just got a "monday-model" as we say in germany. I also reseted my unit a few times, that didn't help. Today I rolled back the firmware step by step and with 2.30 everything worked perfectly. What really puzzles me is the fact, that in the beginning everything was alright and on the second rehearsal the problem occured and could be fixed via restarting the unit. Well, time will tell. Thanks for the support! :-) P.S. I like how the forum changes f*** to lollipop

I experience the exact same problem. I use Helix in Snapshot mode and via the Instants I switch my H&K Switchblade and a Whammy DT. Both with Program Change messages. Therefore I need 3 Instants: Instant 1: MIDI CH 1 - Amp switching Instant 2: MIDI CH 3 - Whammy Section switching Instant 3: MIDI CH 3 - DropTune Section switching So far, so good. I got my Helix in March, updated it to 2.53, looked for an amp and cab that sounds close to mine in the rehearsal room and set up my presets. Sounds: check. Then I copied my Presets, exchanged the ampsim for a loop, got rid of the cabsim, programmed the Instants and were good to go. First rehearsal: Everything's up and running, no issues - I love when a plan comes together. Second rehearsal: Suddenly the amp stutters, when it's switched Troubleshooting: Change MIDI Cable - still stutters Connect MIDI Cable directly with Helix - still stutters Changing from Clean (Ampsim) to OD (H&K) [in the same Preset] - stutter Changing from OD (H&K) to Clean (Ampsim) [in the same Preset] - no stutter Changing from Cln/Crnch (H&K) to OD (H&K) [in the same Preset] - stutter Changing from Cln/Crnch (H&K) to OD (H&K) [in another Preset] - no stutter Visiting my Testcenter (Preset with no Instants, The Footswitches send Program Change messages to switch my Amp) Everything works fine. No stutter at all. "Have you tried to turn it on and off again?" - "Umm, no. Okay, let's restart the thing." Everything worked as it should... Third rehearsal: The amp stutters, when it's switched. Multiple restarts don't help "Guess I'll have to live with it today" At home: Installed MIDI OX to monitor what "lil' Helix - the PCM Gangsta" tells my gear via MIDI. "Aha. So you're sending your messages up to three times. You really want to be heard, don't you?" Deleted all Instants. Setting up the first: CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 (Snapshots 1-8) -> 1 PCM send when switching, looks good. save. Setting up the second: CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 -> 2 PCM send when switching. That's bad. It should be 2-1-2-2-2-2-2-2, checking first Instant. CH1, Program: 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 -> okay, let's re-edit. -> Changing Snapshot 2 from 0 to off -> now let's check the other values CH1, Program: off - off - off - off - off - off - off - off Checking the sent Messages: everything doubled. okay. let's re-edit Instant 1 anyway. CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 Checking the sent Messages: Pressing Snap 1: 4 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 2: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|21) - ??? - let's hit it again Pressing Snap 2: 2 messages (CH3|21, CH3|21) - seems more legit Pressing Snap 3: 3 messages (CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|21) - okay, hit it again Pressing Snap 3: 4 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|21) - at least some consistency Pressing Snap 4: 4 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|21) - as I expected Pressing Snap 5: 4 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH1|1, CH3|21) - not as I expected Pressing Snap 6: 4 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21, CH1|1, CH3|21) - as I expected Pressing Snap 7: 4 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|21) - eventually, I now was expecting this Pressing Snap 8: 4 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|21) Okay. Pressing Snap 1, Hit save 2 times, change preset and go right back again Pressing Pres up: 2 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21) + 4 messages (Helix Preset changing) Let's set up the third: Turning the Command knob of Instant 3 resets Instant 1 to CH1, Program: 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0, Instant 2 doesn't seem to be effected CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 Okay, re-edit -> Changing Snapshot 2 from 0 to off -> now let's check the other values CH1, Program: off - off - off - off - off - off - off - off, continuing re-edit CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 Checking the sent Messages: Pressing Snap 1: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 2: 4 messages (CH3|21, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH3|67) - Hey, the unexpected CH1 message disappeared Pressing Snap 3: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 4: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 5: 6 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|1, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 6: 6 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|1, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 7: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 8: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Okay. Pressing Snap 1, Hit save 2 times, change preset and go right back again Pressing Pres up: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) + 4 messages (Helix Preset changing) Now let's delete Instant 3 Checking the sent Messages: Pressing Snap 1: 2 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 2: 1 messages (CH3|21) Pressing Snap 3: 2 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 4: 2 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 5: 2 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 6: 2 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 7: 2 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 8: 2 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21) Okay, might be a workaround. Reloading the Preset and adding a fourth Instant command Turning the Command knob of Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - hey, nice... deleting Instant 4 Checking the sent Messages: Pressing Snap 1: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 2: 2 messages (CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 3: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 4: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 5: 3 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 6: 3 messages (CH1|1, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 7: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Pressing Snap 8: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|21, CH3|67) Okay, let's make it interesting Change Instant 3 on Snap 8 to 46 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 CH3, Program 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 46 - ??? re-editing Instant 3 Snap 1 - Snap 7 to 67 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 46 Turning the Command knob of Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - whispering the beginning of Slipknot's 'Duality' Re-edit Instant 3 on Snap 8 to 46 CH3, Program 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 66 - 46 re-editing Instant 3 Snap 1 - Snap 7 to 67 deleting Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 CH3, Program 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - I'm getting to Limp Bizkit's 'Break Stuff', the chainsaw part... Obviously, it doesn't want me to make changes on the last Instant, so let's swap Instant 2 and 3 CH1, Program: 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 - lollipop you Helix. Really, lollipop you, you lollipopin' lollipop re-editing CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 46 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 Turning the Command knob of Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 - okay... re-editing deleting Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 Okay. Turning the Command knob of Instant 4. re-editing changing all the 21s to 22s and back again deleting Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 46 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 - nice... Checking the sent Messages: Pressing Snap 1: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 2: 4 messages (CH3|67, CH3|21, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 3: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 4: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 5: 6 messages (CH1|1, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|1, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 6: 6 messages (CH1|1, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|1, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 7: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21) Pressing Snap 8: 6 messages (CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21, CH1|0, CH3|46, CH3|21) Okay. Pressing Snap 1, Hit save 2 times, change preset and go right back again Pressing Pres up: 3 messages (CH1|0, CH3|67, CH3|21) + 4 messages (Helix Preset changing) Turning the Command knob of Instant 4, re-editing, turning the Command knob of Instant 5, re-editing Deleting Instant 5 Checking the sent Messages: as above Deleting Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 - 46 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 Turning the Command knob of Instant 4, re-editing, turning the Command knob of Instant 5, re-editing Deleting Instant 5 Checking the sent Messages: as above changing every value by 1 and back again - checking on send messages, everything gets send 3 times (could I get 4x?) Deleting Instant 4 CH1, Program: 0 - off - 0 - 0 - 1 - 1 - 0 - 0 CH3, Program 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 - 67 CH3, Program: 21 - 21 - 21 - 21 -21 -21 - 21 - 21 Yeah, that's it, tried to get Swanny's CC setup to work properly, It seems you can't get it working with two or more values that change, no matter if you use PC or CC or mixed things.