Live loop out with all patches?

[mkaylor]

Is there a way to turn one of the loops send/receives on globally?  I have a Digitec Trio looped through and would like to use it anytime without editing each patch.

 

Maybe there is another way to hook it in?  Currently I go USB in and out to the computer for audio.  I use the 1/4 to the amp (possible) and I use a mixture of Variax / Aux (GP-10) and real guitar ports.

 

Thanks,

Mike

 

[hideout]

There isn't one that I know of. I did submit a global effects return idea in Line6 IdeaScale.

http://line6.ideascale.com/a/dtd/Global-Always-On-Effects-Return/809601-23508

[silverhead]

No - can't do that globally.

 

It's the same question that's asked here often about all kinds of favorite go-to amps and FX selections and settings in one's usual presets, whether it's a loop, a favourite distortion or reverb or chorus.... And the best way to manage it is the same. Create you own custom 'starting point' preset(s) for your most common setups and include all your go-to fx and preset elements with your specific 'default' settings. Then use these to copy anytime you start creating a new preset. The Templates setlist seems like the natural place for these.

 

Note that Helix supports copying at the block/FX level so you can apply this strategy to create all your favourite 'default' settings. You can create template presets that you would never use as constructed, but are simply a repository for your favourite settings. For instance, you could have one template preset called DIST/OD (or CHORUS, DELAY, REVERB, etc.) that contains nothing but a selection of your favourite models of that type, each with your preferred default settings. Then, while constructing your real presets, you just select and copy from among your favourites.

[hideout]

No - can't do that globally.

 

It's the same question that's asked here often about all kinds of favorite go-to amps and FX selections and settings in one's usual presets, whether it's a loop, a favourite distortion or reverb or chorus.... And the best way to manage it is the same. Create you own custom 'starting point' preset(s) for your most common setups and include all your go-to fx and preset elements with your specific 'default' settings. Then use these to copy anytime you start creating a new preset. The Templates setlist seems like the natural place for these.

 

Note that Helix supports copying at the block/FX level so you can apply this strategy to create all your favourite 'default' settings. You can create template presets that you would never use as constructed, but are simply a repository for your favourite settings. For instance, you could have one template preset called DIST/OD (or CHORUS, DELAY, REVERB, etc.) that contains nothing but a selection of your favourite models of that type, each with your preferred default settings. Then, while constructing your real presets, you just select and copy from among your favourites.

I don't think this has to do with the inconvenience of having to add amps and effects to each patch. It has to do with not having the currently playing loop interrupted when you switch patches. I believe that the Helix's internal looper is global and does not get interrupted when you switch patches. A globally assignable effects return would allow users to use their own loopers that they know and are comfortable using. While I'm sure I could get used the operation of the internal looper, I can't get used to its paltry recording time. I typically record a verse, chorus, verse chorus then a bridge for a loop. Not possible on the Helix.

[silverhead]

OK - thanks. I misunderstood.

[hideout]

I do wish the Helix's internal looper had more recording time and wonder if that's something that can be addressed in firmware. If they could make it so that we could choose to sacrifice the use of one effect to increase the recording time in the Global settings.  Realistically speaking I don't really use that many effects simultaneously I include some of them in my patches for tonal options... and because, well... they're there.  :P

[silverhead]

I think the looper recording time is more of a hardware than firmware issue. The Looper actually takes up very little in terms of CPU cycles (DSP); it requires memory. The more RAM is allocated, the longer the recording can be. Helix has allocated enough RAM for 2 minutes of mono recording at 'half speed' sample rate. The DSP demand is no more than writing to and reading from the allocated area of memory; little to no additional processing power is required.

 

So I don't think it's something you can trade off in terms of FX blocks. Reducing the DSP demand in a preset by removing an FX block can't be translated to increased memory for a longer loop length.

[hideout]

I think the looper recording time is more of a hardware than firmware issue. The Looper actually takes up very little in terms of CPU cycles (DSP); it requires memory. The more RAM is allocated, the longer the recording can be. Helix has allocated enough RAM for 2 minutes of mono recording at 'half speed' sample rate. The DSP demand is no more than writing to and reading from the allocated area of memory; little to no additional processing power is required.

 

So I don't think it's something you can trade off in terms of FX blocks. Reducing the DSP demand in a preset by removing an FX block can't be translated to increased memory for a longer loop length.

 

I understand all that. However, doesn't instantiating an effect block also take up RAM?  The other thing is, isn't memory allocation done in software, thus, firmware?

[hideout]

Is there a way to turn one of the loops send/receives on globally?  I have a Digitec Trio looped through and would like to use it anytime without editing each patch.

 

Maybe there is another way to hook it in?  Currently I go USB in and out to the computer for audio.  I use the 1/4 to the amp (possible) and I use a mixture of Variax / Aux (GP-10) and real guitar ports.

 

Thanks,

Mike

 

By the way, a global loop return is the crucial part needed for this - especially for the Trio.

[silverhead]

I understand all that. However, doesn't instantiating an effect block also take up RAM?  The other thing is, isn't memory allocation done in software, thus, firmware?

 

I'm sure your understanding of all this is as good as mine, but just for the fun of it........ let's speculate and theorize .....

 

I don't know the details of how presets are stored in Helix - whether they are all the same 'size' or not. It's possible that a 'small' preset may require less RAM than a 'big' preset. If so, then yes, instantiating an FX block would take up additional RAM, and at any point during preset construction there is some remaining non-looper RAM filled with meaningless ones and zeros that I suppose could theoretically be (temporarily) allocated to the looper.

 

As to the firmware, yes I expect RAM is allocated (or at least allocate-able?) by the OS at some point. But in the case of these devices I think it's it is a static allocation - not dynamic. Line 6 would have to rewrite the OS to permit 'empty' RAM in a given preset to be temporarily reassigned to the looper. And I'm no embedded systems firmware developer but that doesn't sound trivial to me, especially when you consider that the temporary allocation to the looper might have to be reclaimed at any moment when a more complex preset is recalled as the 'current' preset.

[hideout]

I'm sure your understanding of all this is as good as mine, but just for the fun of it........ let's speculate and theorize .....

 

I don't know the details of how presets are stored in Helix - whether they are all the same 'size' or not. It's possible that a 'small' preset may require less RAM than a 'big' preset. If so, then yes, instantiating an FX block would take up additional RAM, and at any point during preset construction there is some remaining non-looper RAM filled with meaningless ones and zeros that I suppose could theoretically be (temporarily) allocated to the looper.

 

As to the firmware, yes I expect RAM is allocated (or at least allocate-able?) by the OS at some point. But in the case of these devices I think it's it is a static allocation - not dynamic. Line 6 would have to rewrite the OS to permit 'empty' RAM in a given preset to be temporarily reassigned to the looper. And I'm no embedded systems firmware developer but that doesn't sound trivial to me, especially when you consider that the temporary allocation to the looper might have to be reclaimed at any moment when a more complex preset is recalled as the 'current' preset.

 

Agreed. Good points I hadn't considered.  Thanks.