poptheclock Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 Hi everyone, I’m trying to set up my Stadium XL for live use and could really use some advice on routing. My goal is: Send a stereo signal to FOH via the main XLR outputs (L/R) with full processing (amp + cab/IR) At the same time, send a mono signal to a guitar amp on stage for monitoring What I’m trying to figure out: What’s the best way to route a mono signal from one of the other outputs (1/4” or Send) to a guitar amp? Can I keep FOH stereo, but have the other output summed to mono independently? Is it possible for that mono output to exclude cab blocks (and possibly amp blocks), so it behaves more like a pedalboard or preamp into a real amp? Basically: FOH → stereo with amp + cab Stage amp → mono, no cab (and maybe no amp) What’s the cleanest way to achieve this? Split paths? Parallel routing? Separate outputs? If anyone has a similar setup or example preset, I’d really appreciate the help. Thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MojoAxe Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 If you're sending the full chain of blocks to both FOH and the guitar amplifier then this is very simple: - Left and right XLR to the FOH - Left/Mono 1/4" out to the amp (or an FRFR). Sending the full chain of blocks including Amp and Cab blocks to the FOH but subtracting the Amp and Cab blocks to the guitar amp is a different story, especially if you're running in 4-cable mode with some effects going into the amp's input and other effects going into the amp's effects loop. In that case I think it might be necessary to have two separate chains in the preset, a modeled path for the FOH and an effects-only path for the guitar amp. You would need to duplicate the blocks on each of the paths. This also means that if you change block parameters on one path then you need to duplicate the change on the other path. A major issue that I see with doing doing both a guitar amp chain and a modeled chain is that the tone you're hearing from your physical amp on stage is going to be different than the modeled tone going to the FOH. You may be thrilled with your on-stage guitar amp tone, but what the is audience hearing may be much different, and it may not be as good as what you're hearing on stage. Is there a reason that you want a guitar amp on stage rather than using a FRFR for monitoring your playing on stage? If you feel that the amplifier tone is better than the modeled amp's tone, then you might as well just plant a microphone in front of the amp and send that to the FOH. If you're happy with the modeled amp's tone, then forget about using a guitar amplifier and use an FRFR on stage instead . its important that your on-stage sound is basically the same thing that is being broadcast to the audience. Personally, I send a mono signal from the Stadium's 1/4" L/Mono jack to a Fender FR-12 behind me (which sounds great). I also feed a bit of guitar into the floor monitor in front of me, so I'm surrounded by my guitar on stage. I don't miss using a guitar amplifier at all. The Stadium's XLR out is routed to the FOH. For bigger shows I'll go stereo out, but usually its just a mono signal to FOH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poptheclock Posted March 30 Author Share Posted March 30 Hi MojoAxe, Thanks a lot for the detailed reply — really appreciate you taking the time to explain this! Just to clarify one thing: If I send my signal from the 1/4” L/Mono output, does the Helix automatically sum all stereo effects and stereo cab blocks to mono for that output? And would the same apply if I used a Send output instead? Does it also sum to mono in the same way? Regarding your question about using a guitar amp instead of FRFR: The main reason is practical. In most of the live situations I play, it’s much more common for venues or organizers to provide a guitar amp as backline, rather than FRFR speakers. Also, it’s not very easy for me to carry my own FRFR cab around. FRFR solutions aren’t that widespread yet where I’m based (at least at my level of gigs), so I’m trying to find a flexible solution for situations where I’m not using in-ear monitoring and have to rely on stage volume / monitoring. In this case, I’m not too concerned about the exact tone coming from the amp on stage — my priority is the FOH sound from the XLR outputs, which I’ll have dialed in at home. The amp would mainly be there just so I can hear myself on stage. Thanks again for your help! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverhead Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Re: Sum to Mono: If the Output jack is stamped "L/Mono" then using a single jack in that L/R pair will sum to mono. If the stamp says only "L" then summing will not occur. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MojoAxe Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 Okay, that makes sense. Since you're using backline amps provided by the venue, then I'll guess that you're probably going to keep things simple by running one cable from the Stadium to the amp's 1/4" input (rather than stringing extra cables cables for 4 cable method). In this case I think the thing to do is to have a preset with two parallel path chains. In the attached image, Path A is has the output routed to the XLR, so this would be the FOH chain. It includes Amp and Cab blocks with effects blocks both before and after them. Path B has the identical effects blocks but it doesn't have an Amp or Cab block. The output of this path is routed to the 1/4" output, so this chain is sent to the amplifier on stage. Building path B would simply be a matter of doing a copy 'n paste of the blocks from Path A. You'll just have to be aware that when you adjust parameters on one of the blocks that you'll need to duplicate the change on the other path (which is a simple copy 'n paste overwrite of the existing block). Be sure that the output of Path A is "XLR Direct" and Path B is "1/4" Direct". A stereo signal from Path A can be sent to the FOH by using two XLR cables. The same stereo effects blocks can be used on Path B because if you use one 1/4" cable out of the L/MONO jack, Stadium will sum both channels to a mono signal. One thing to keep in mind is that a mono effects block will sum a stereo signal to mono signal, so for whichever blocks are to be stereo, make sure that there aren't any mono blocks downstream from them. Amp and Cab blocks are mono, so stereo blocks must follow them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirhc Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 If that works for you, you can also try to put both amp and cab at the very end of your chain and add a Split Block before that. You can route the splitted signal without amp and cab to a different output than the other complete chain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poptheclock Posted April 1 Author Share Posted April 1 Hi everyone, Thanks a lot for all the helpful replies — really appreciate the time and detailed explanations! That clears things up, especially regarding the L/Mono output summing to mono and how the routing works with parallel paths. I think I’ll go ahead and try one of the suggested approaches: Creating two parallel paths, one for FOH (with amp + cab to XLR) And one effects-only path to the 1/4” output for the stage amp I’ll experiment a bit with both this method and the idea of placing the amp/cab at the end with a split before them, and see what works best in practice for my setup. Thanks again for the help — really useful insights! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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