Latency issues when using Jam Origin MIDI Guitar

[ogandou]

Hello,

 

I'm fiddling around with the demo version of MIDI Guitar. It's pretty good but I can't seem to be able to get low latency with the Line6 ASIO driver. Basically anything below 256 samples (included) sounds like crap... my computer is a quad core cpu, I have 12 gigs of RAM. I didn't think I'd have latency issues. :( Is it the Line6 driver? My computer? What is my problem here? Thanks for any help you can provide.

[silverhead]

You've posted this question in the Line 6 X3 forum. Do you have an X3 involved in the connection? How is your guitar connected to your computer?

 

I'm not sure what your knowledge and experience is with MIDI - but it's not audio. The audio is being produced by the software application on your computer, and it seems to me that you need something in your setup that's translating your guitar audio to MIDI (digital information). The X3 has nothing to do with that. Is that what Jam Origin does?  I'm not familiar with the Jam Origin product, but I don't think the problem is with any Line 6 equipment or driver.

[ogandou]

Sorry, my bad: yes, I do use a Pod X3. That software translates pitch into midi. So it basically listens to what you play and recognizes the pitch, then outputs notes via MIDI. Problem is that I get quite high latency (> 10 ms) with the Pod X3 ASIO driver...

[silverhead]

But the X3 ASIO driver is only responsible for delivering the audio signal to your PC, and playing back the audio signal it receives from your computer. It does that very well, with no latency. The latency is occurring inside your computer, within the Jam Origin software, during the translation from pitch to MIDI and the subsequent processing of the MIDI data back into audio using your VST or whatever processors. The same thing would be happening if you were to substitute any other audio interface for the X3.

[ogandou]

Well I've been exchanging with another user on another forum who uses a M-Audio interface to connect his guitar to his PC (can't remember which, I think something like C-400?) and he has much lower latency. :huh:

[silverhead]

In the Line 6 Audio-MIDI Devices control panel item you are able to set the buffer size. Experiment with that setting.

 

Otherwise I think the latency differences are to be found in your respective computers' settings and performance characteristics rather than the audio interface. Ask the other user what his computer settings are for the Jam Origin application.

[ogandou]

Yes, I've tried that, but unfortunately haven't had much luck. Under ASIO settings I have ASIO client: (none), default buffer size 256 and default bit depth 16 bit. I'm not sure what's the function of the USB audio streaming section. I've tried all the different settings in combination with the above, from extra small buffers to extra large, and nothing helps.

 

Also, under driver format I have 48 kHz / 24 bit. Driver version is 4.2.7.1.

[silverhead]

Again - I don't think the X3 driver or its settings are the cause of the latency.

You don't mention that you are recording, so I assume you are describing a lag/latency when just playing. I assume you are measuring latency from the instant you pluck your guitar note to the instant you hear the synthesized sound in the X3 headphones/outputs. I also assume the X3 preset/patch is doing no processing since you presumably want to send the dry signal to Jam Origin. Between those two instants, here's what's going on:

- the audio signal of your guitar note is sent virtually instantly, with no internal processing and hence no latency, from the X3 to your PC's USB port
- the Jam Origin software picks it up from there and must then process the incoming audio as follows:
---- convert the pitch to a note
---- generate the corresponding MIDI note on/off data (and perhaps other MIDI controller data depending on its sophistication as a MIDI processor)
---- send the MIDI data to a software-based MIDI sound synthesizer
---- which converts the MIDI to audio by applying the processing of the selected synthesizer
---- send the final audio signal back through the USB port to the X3
- the X3 then immediately, via hardware routing with no additional latency, routes the sound to its outputs.

You can see that all the processing is being done outside the X3, inside your computer, by the Jam Origin software and its (or other) MIDI synthesizers. That's what's taking the time, and that's why you are hearing the lag/latency.

 

EDIT: By the way, the Jam Origin website acknowledges its latency issues at the bottom of this page:

http://jamorigin.com/docs/midi-guitar-for-ios/

 

... and note that the discussion there refers only to the latency involved in its pitch conversion; the inevitable latency from the MIDI synthesizer is additional.

[ogandou]

So I guess it's my CPU that's not fast enough?

[silverhead]

That's one explanation. But I think the real explanation is that Jam Origin is not fast enough for any current CPU.

[ogandou]

Well I've been exchanging with another user on another forum and he doesn't seem to be having these issues. Not sure what computer hardware he has though...

[silverhead]

Well, it's not a Line 6 product issue and I have nothing more to offer to help you. Good luck.

[ogandou]

Thanks!