themetallikid

Oh this for sure is not how I would normally have this preset set. This was where I last saved the preset in an attempt to get the 2nd vocal to match level wise with my known good vocal Line 1b that I use for solo gigs. Oh heavens no, lol.....that would be an audio nightmare there. Normally I use the end comp to really only catch things as more of a limiter in a way, just the highest of peaks and the initial comp is set pretty lightly as well. Just like what it does, however the level is maybe only +3.5db when I have it set where I like it. lol. The gain blocks and excessive comp block were just one versions attempt to match the levels...and to prove how extreme the issue I was trying to fix. Its more than likely what was mentioned above with the global setting

That could be the issue, I'll have to check tonight when I get home. I know i've used this mic/cable combination before with success, which is what is throwing me off. I'm well versed enough in preset configuration to know if I routed something stupidly. But I rarely check global settings as I just dont need to change much, other than what my volume knob affects. So if your thought is the case, it probably reset with the 3.5 update and I just havent needed to use it since then.

Well it is a sennheiser 835, same mic as I am using into the mic input, so that makes it easy to compare levels between them at the same time. I agree, and knew, the issue was the mic going into the return. I knew it would need to be boosted, but didnt think it would be so tough to get it to an acceptable level. I have tried all variations that I can think of to boost the signal. I've tried the 3 gain blocks (+12db) mentioned, I've tried 2 gain blocks + boosting the compressor level, i've tried rearranging those orders of blocks. I've tried adding 2 gain blocks and the mic preamp block (issue here is to get a matching level, I need to goose the gain and level and the gain block then adds some overdrive to the vocals and its not good. I even tried adding the JC120 amp, knowing how clean it is. I tried just preamp version and didnt get anything different, then tried the full amp version and it was better, but again still needed the gain blocks to get there. I swear I've done this type of preset before, I just cant imagine I would have set up the preset/connections differently. I tried swapping it to the aux input, but I'm guessing the return 3 is the same as the Aux regarding levels. There wouldnt be any global settings that would change input sensitivity? Not that I could find or remember right now.

Attached is the actual preset. Path 1a - My guitar (this path is fine, I use this duplicately in another preset for solo gigs) Path 1b - My vocals (this path is fine, I use this signal path in another preset for solo gigs) Path 2a - Duo (2nd) guitar - I did not get to compare this to my guitar preset yet (vocals were first thing I checked as I knew they would be the issue....but I dont aniticipate anything here I cannot resolve myself) Path 2b - Duo (2nd) vocals - This is the path that I can't seem to resolve. If you remove the 3 gain blocks (the first was a volume block like the other 3 lines to help mute signal between sets) and reduce the comp block level to a more 'normal' amount, you get barely any audio at all. In order to match levels to my Path 1b signal, I need 3 gain blocks maxed out at +12db each, and even then the compressor level needs to be at +9db. Level is there, but it seems like the 'feel' is different than my channel (duh, no mic preamp there, I get that) Just wondering if there is a better way in Helix to do this or if I'm hitting a limitation of the Helix in this scenario. I feel like I've done this before and didnt have issues, so I'm not sure what I did differently before. Duo - Troy - E.hlx

So I got them to 'match' better, but the airy response isnt there. Level wise its close, but doesnt seem right. I added a 3rd gain block (all +12db) and also on the deluxe comp (first after the gain blocks) I have the level set to +9.0db. Is there a better solution...???

Ok, I have a preset that I use for solo gigs....so I copied and pasted it to another slot to use with a 2nd guitar/mic for a duo project. I have routing and all set up fine. I'm getting levels, but they are drastically lower in the 2nd mic 'channel'. I am running a XLR>1/4" cable. Initially I tried running it into the Return 3, and using that as my input. I got so little input, it wasnt even audible, but could see the output block lighting up green, but the output meter was barely being tickled at all. I tried moving the 2nd mic into the Aux input, but same level issues. I am running the Sennheiser 835 mic, and even on the XLR input, I'm still running +36 db to get a comfortable mic response. In 'MY' chain, i do not run any other gain type blocks. I run a compressor - chorus - LA comp (very slight to help tame outputs a touch) - Ambient Reverb. So here is my dilemma...with the 2nd mic, I have added 2 gain blocks (both +12db) and also the mic preamp block (level dimed) and I still need to boost the preamp's gain enough that it sounds like garbage. Am I missing something or am I getting the results I 'should' be with this setup?

Yes for sure. I recently saw a vid where the guy was doing more an analog signal chain where all effects were between the amp and cab vs. the studio of 'post' effects after the cab. I've love the Dynamic Ambience block...and may try it last in the chain before the cab and see how that changes things as well. The Revv amp(s) I love the sound from it, however when I've dialed in song presets it seems to be less favored verses others. Usually I was trying to match the tone/feel of the original more than 'my' tone. Maybe in this project I'll use it more where I'm thinking I'll use more 'my' tone rather than dialing in the song's tone.

Not sure what that has to do with my post?

Yeah I favor the 2204 Mod over the 'regular' 2204, but I get where your going with that. The mid freq control on the mod can help darken/thicken things up with slight adjustments. I also get what your saying for the OD's in front. I set the preset up this morning (visually only, I'll plug in and tweak tonight after my trivia date) but I was able to fit a ton of tone possibilities in my preset to use as a template. I added in chain order: Path 1a Poly Tune Wah - Fassel Phaser - Script Chorus Deluxe Comp OD - Timmy (this may change but this would be to help with my clean amp to get from clean to pushed type sounds, not high gain beasts) OD - TS808 (I love this as a lead OD, it loosens the tone a bit in a way other OD's dont) Split 1a>2a, 1b>2b 2a - 10 band EQ (only for trying Craig's EQ clarity trick, havent tried it yet, these may get removed) 2a - Line 6 Badonk 2a - Mesa EQ (if it will fit, have not tried yet) Split/Merge 2b - 10 band EQ (only for trying Craig's EQ clarity trick, havent tried it yet, these may get removed) 2b - Vitriol Crunch (not sure if I need the heavier version or not, thinking probably not with a dual amp sound) 2b - Mesa EQ (if it will fit, have not tried yet) Split/Merge Dual Cab - Marshall Greenback 25 4x12/57 mic, cap edge, on axis, high cut down to 6.5khz, Mesa V30 4x12/121 mic, 3.5 from center, on axis, high cut down to 6.5khz Stereo Chorus Volume Pedal for swells (may not be needed) Stereo Simple Delay I know I will not need all of this on every preset, but if I can dial in all my sounds using this 'template' then it'll be easier to remove whats not needed and sprinking in song specific effects instead of frankenstein'ing each preset and trying to get them to match. This will (once dialed in) provide a great template to save favorites to then use in building song presets. Still open to ideas on what to try, again that was all by eyes only and my own experience with what I think I'd like. I did not play anything...on paper, I think it covers most everything.

Ok, I'm not lazy, I have my cab/mic faves for some stuff that I do, but I'm looking for suggestions on where to start with this style (It's been awhile since I've done this stuff). I'm figuring I will end up using the Badonk amp (other suggestions?) mainly because of its lower DSP requirements. I like to dual cabs, I figure a dual cab would save me DSP over dual amps, however...I would love to run dual amps into a dual cab as well, so ..... open to ideas on that. I plan on running a preset/per song approach, as some will require the poly block to drop tune some things, so that is where the amp idea came from. I'd love to pair the VItriol with the Badonk or two Vitriols, just not sure I'd have room with the Poly block involved as well. So, what suggestions do you have? I usually gravitate (old cabs) towards a 160/57 combination, with the new cabs it's been the (I think?) a 121/57 combination with the 121 on a mesa v30 4x12 and the 57 on a marshal v30 4x12. I'd like to keep a consistent amp setup for sounds rather than grabbing amps for each song/artist sound. The lesser tones like cleans and gritty stuff I can find easy enough, but the bulk of the tones are the heavier sounds. I'm at work and looking for distraction...lol. First 7 songs on our list to go over as reference are: Godsmack - Whatever Nickelback - FIgured You Out Nickelback - Animals Drowning Pool - Bodies Three Days Grace - Break Papa Roach - Last Resort Marilyn Manson - Beautiful People White Zombie - More Human Than Human

I havent listened to the clip (yeah, I know....why comment then?) but I havent seen anyone mention the Ripple Parameter. On some amps this can be quite pronounced with other settings.

I believe I did move a few things around, and it didnt seem to help much. I did not get a chance to play with it more last night, but am hoping I will tonight. I had a practice for another group pop up for this Thursday and needed to run over that material instead.

So I have an acoustic sound I love using a gain block, acoustic sim and compressor block. However, when I applied these blocks after the Poly Capo to shift down 1 step (Eb tuning) it drastically changes and seems to lose what makes it sound acoustic like. It sorta sounds like it loses all the high end response the acoustic sim adds, however I couldnt seem to make the right adjustments to get the sound back. My chain has the Poly Capo > then my above acoustic 'chain'. Is there something that I'm maybe not trying to get that feel back? I know there is the pitch change (duh), but there is clearly a frequency response difference there. I'm working on a kitchen sink preset using the SLO Clean/OD/Lead amp blocks, but we have a few songs that use an acoustic sound in places. I would prefer to not just use a clean sound as it sounds ok, but seems to lose the dynamics of the strumming a bit. Appreciate any ideas. I only sat with it initially and adjusted the Poly/Acoustic/Comp settings and couldnt seem to get it right. I think I may have DSP left to insert an EQ block, if that solves it between the the Poly/Gain blocks... I have the tone on the Poly block around 7.5-8 so I dont have a ton of room to raise that much more.

You got it. There is a basic flow chart that should happen when attemting to program this process do I want the same layout on every snapshot? 1 - yes - then the copy all, paste all is all you need to do. You should see this option in HX Edit's command center. If you right click on any of the footswitches, you should get those options. I know when I do this, I also choose 'Clear All' between the copy/paste. So its a 3 step process for me. Copy All, Clear all (exits command center), (open command center) Paste All. 2 - no - if you do not want the same layout, meaning you want a different foot switch layout per snapshot in a preset, then for sure you need to follow RD2RK's instructions or you run into mapping errors when going from 1 > 2 > 7 and then trying to get back to 1 possibly. Happy you got it figured out and understand the process. It opens up a lot of possibilities for sure.

Its called a momentary switch (other is latching). This can be setup in the bypass page of the controller settings for that block. Or you can get fancy with snapshot assignments in Command Center, however that can get messy if you dont understand how to program those.

I thought about the version number as well. but didnt watch the video long as I'm at work. Good catch!

I watched a bit of the beginning and the first thing I see is that he is assigning a 'preset' to a switch not a snapshot. The snapshot colors would only be chosen in the normal HX Edit screen dropdown I believe. I usually right click > Color choice. If you are assigning an effect to a button using the blocks bypass tab (not in command center) say for my 2nd momentary approach (Assigning OD/Delay/Gain boost to FS 7 via their individual block screens) then you can also set a color and rename the effect. I do this for more song specific special effects or lead fill parts sometimes. Examples - Crazy Train/Ozzy - I have a snapshot for the full lead, but I also double my lead blocks (copy/paste) and assign the 2nd blocks to FS 7 as a momentary switch within each blocks controller tab. I then can assign the name "Lead Fill" and give it a different color. Basically creating a snapshot without using a snapshot slot if you will. Lady Picture Show/Stone Temple Pilots - There is a leslie speaker/rotary type effect in the chorus that is only about 1 second long. I assign the blocks for that effect to FS7 as well for a momentary effect.

I do this all the time, if I decide I'd like a separate snapshot for a part instead of just using my normal rhythm tone. I'll then have to shift my snapshot switches down one to put the 'bridge' in my lineup where I'd prefer it. Again, I think the key for myself and my layouts is that I use the same layout for every snapshot 'layer'. What that means is that when I open Command Center, it opens on SS 1's layout, I make my changes. Lets say I have 3 SS's but I want to add a 4th. and it would go 3rd in my order. So current order would be Rhythm>Chorus>Lead. The new order I'd prefer would be Rhythm>Chorus>Bridge>Lead. I would do that by bumping the Rhythm down a footswitch and set it up 'new' and the Chorus down a footswitch changing the SS reference from SS1>SS2 and then changing the Chorus to Bridge SS2 > SS4. However, again, this is all being edited on the Snapshot 1 layer, as command center opens. I would then do my copy all>clear all, enter the command center again, and paste all to apply those changes I copied on snapshot 1's layer into the other 7 layers as well. If I was to only move the rhythm down a footswitch, and only change rhythm>chorus and chorus>bridge on the 1st snapshot layer....then potentially you end up with a mess because on Snapshot 1, it would all look correct. However on Snapshot 2/3/4 - the footswitch now assigned to rhythm would read "SNAPSHOT" because it hasnt been assigned on the SS 2 layer. But also they chorus/bridge assignments would not be 'moved down' as well. they would be in the original layout of Rhythm>Chorus>lead.

I get what he is saying, the button layout starts on the top row FS 1 to FS 12 (bottom right corner). Wants the presets to be displayed that way as well. 000 in the upper left, and 007 in the botttom right. To my knowledge there is not a way to do this. Logically from a reading perspective I get it. From a L6 perspective I get it too. You are going 'up' in preset number so directionally 'up' makes sense.

I'll confirm this when I get home to what mine shows. But from the top of my head (can you post a screen shot of what your seeing to compare?) it should read as this FS7 Type - Snapshot Press - Snapshot 3 (Lead Fill) Release - Snapshot 2 (Rhythm) If its saying otherwise, then there may be something weird with how Command center is reading the preset info. I haven't heard of anyone else stating that they have noticed that. I'll check mine at home tonight when I fix my auto-engage issues and post a screenshot if we can confirm that mine is showing that it is programmed/behaving/displaying correctly and yours looks different. You may have something else going on (which has been suspected the whole time). On a side note, have you done any sort of preset rebuilding restart using the FS buttons up on power up? There could be something wonky in there if it hasnt rebuilt the presets to the current firmware. And both Helix and HX Edit are updated to 3.50/3.51? I'm sure this was stated, but just confirming.

This would happen occasionally when I was playing at home but was usually rectified by resetting that setting. And it was one preset, not every one essentially. I'll just reprogram my auto engage to be the switch and it should be fine. But seems it is a mess to resolve if they havent squashed it yet.

"Keep in mind that if you use a switch to temporarily move to another snapshot and want to return to the original snapshot (or do ANYTHING) ON RELEASE, the ON RELEASE action needs to be assigned in the TEMPORARY snapshot because that's where you'll be when you release the switch." That part right there is a big causal part. I know for me, I dont' logically think about this step, but thats because I use the same 'layout' across all my snapshots. So FS 7 on the preset I provided, has the same press/release settings on SS1 as it does on SS8. So whichever SS I tell it to go to for my lead fill, the release action will be programmed. If you are changing your layouts for each snapshot 'layer' in the preset, then you MUST do as rd2rk says and make sure that you go to the Press SS layer and make sure that you set the release there or it wont matter.

So I pulled up my setlist for my show tomorrow, started playing away along with Spotify to the songs, and I got to a song where there is a wah. On this song I have a few other blocks bypass settings attached to the auto engage settings as well. I always use the same settings (toe down = off, engage at 98%). I believe I got through 4 presets that use this feature, before giving up. Preset 1 - Wah did not engage, OD did engage, EQ did engage, Delay did not engage sub 98%. When returning to 100% toe down (should be off) the OD/EQ shut off, however the Wah and Delay no engaged...killing my rhythm tone, unless I reloaded the preset (not ideal of course) Preset 2 - Same result as preset 1 Preset 3 - Same result as preset 1, however the blocks varied. OD did not engage but the delay did and then vice versa when the pedal was toe down. Preset 4 - Worked exactly as it should When I check the settings for those blocks on that presets that aren't working, it has defaulted back to the 'heel down' setting as being off. I can save the preset, exit and return to the preset and it works fine. Till maybe the next time. I just used these presets the day before Thanksgiving, 11/23, and I have not made any changes to them since then. With that said.... 1) I thought this bug was squashed with the 3.5 update? no? 2) If I change all those bypass settings to be attached to the EXP Switch instead of auto engage will that solve my problems? Instead of auto engage I just need to step on switch? 3) Has anyone else had this issue and contacted L6 about it and gotten a response? I know there is one member that refuses to update until this bug is there as it wrecks his performances, and It would greatly dampen mine as well if I stuck with this.

Yes I was happy with the stock cabs previously, but I liked York Audio IR's, they seemed to have a bit more punch to them. I'm sure it was just the files I was choosing vs the stock cabs I was using, but I bounced between those two often. The new cabs are great and so far, have been happy with them. I will try and take a look at your preset tonight and look at what you have created and see if I can help pinpoint where an error is happening if rd2rk doesnt beat me to it while I'm at work.

Here is a typical layout for what you had originally mentioned with a 'momentary' lead fill. This is for Slither by Velvet Revolver. Warning, apparently I create my presets loud, lol.... However, you will see my template I typically use for this as I described above. Preset details: SS1 - Intro SS2 - Rhythm SS3 - Lead Fill The actual lead is all wah, so I have everything "Solo" wise attached to the bypass of the wah pedal at 98%. Toe down is off, under 98% is on what I have assigned to EXP 1. Exp 2 is if I feel like adding a Wah to the intro at all. Its a 2nd expression pedal I have here. However, I noticed in tonights prep for saturdays gig, the ugly toe down auto engage bug reared its head on most of my wah presets, so I would just delete the wah as they are not relevant really to your initial inquiry. If you go in command center, FS 7 is where you will see how I have a momentary set up when using SS's. Also FYI, this is a 3.50/3.51 preset if that matters at all. Using stock cabs. Slither.hlx